Poll: Your view on parents spanking their children?

[DeltaEdge]

I personally don't find anything wrong with spanking, at least, to a degree. It definitely should not be used regularly, and Shouldn't be used on kids that are too young (i.e., 3 and under) or too old (about 8-9 or older). It's not like people are savagely pummeling their children with all of their parental fury balled up into their fists, they are simply administering a regulated amount of physical force to cause discomfort, without injuring them, for a small period of time.
I was spanked as a child, and I turned out fine. I didn't grow up thinking that I must beat up other children to make them obey like some people seem to be insisting that spanking will make you do, I just began to simply avoid doing things that I knew would cause me that temporary discomfort. I also think that every child varies, and just like some might need physical discipline, others might benefit more from other forms of discipline. Children aren't all cut from the same cloth so you can't say for 100% of the time that non-physical punishment is always vastly superior to physical punishment.
I knew plenty of kids who weren't spanked, and were constantly grounded and were never allowed to do anything other than read pre-approved books in their rooms. With them, once everything was taken away, what else was there to lose? Once they hit that point and realized that there was nothing more their parents could do to them, they started to do whatever they wanted, and there was pretty much nothing that their parents could do about it.
And vice versa, some kids just don't respond well at all to physical punishment. It's really up to the parents to decide what punishments suit their children best, and the only way that can be done is by experimenting within reasonable confines. Even with that all being said, I can't even really see myself spanking my children. Maybe in some extreme cases, but just because I approve spanking, it doesn't mean I will practice it regularly if at all. (Also, to be clear, I don't approve of hitting your children anywhere on their body except in a highly controlled open palm manner their backside, so don't think that I endorse "spanking" your child in the face or stomach or legs or anywhere strange like that)

 

[Callate]

I feel about corporal punishment kind of like I do about drunk driving or texting while driving: yes, there may be people who can do this without anyone coming to harm; no, I do not think anyone should pronounce themselves such a person, and many of the people who would are fooling themselves. And that being the case, better to avoid it all together.

It is far, far too easy for people- even otherwise reasonable and mature people- to punish a child not because their behavior is especially bad or out of the ordinary, but because the adult is in some kind of state of stress, and the child makes a handy target or scapegoat for that stress.

I will confess that I spanked my child twice in her lifetime, both times after she had deliberately hurt me multiple times. I'm still not proud of it, or entirely convinced that I couldn't have handled it better; it was a decisive way to resolve the situation, and at least I'm reasonably certain that I didn't do it out of anger, or hurt her any more than was absolutely necessary. But again, see above. I'm not convinced anyone should make that kind of self-assessment.

 

[Lieju]

snip

You must of had SOME method of training the animal, they don't magically become obedient, I assume it would be something a long the line of treats? Because treats don't work on kids they start to "expect" treats.

I have had to work to train my pets, of course. Rewarding good behaviour, and punishing the bad, but always preferring the 'reward' route.
Not necessarily treats, depending of the animal, praise and petting them can work just as well. And even with treats, once the animal has learned it, you don't always give them treats. Or at all, depending on what you're trying to teach them to do.

As for human children, rewarding the good behaviour certainly works. And if you think the only way to punish a child (or an animal)is to physically hurt them, you are wrong.

Besides, you can reason with a kid. Explain them why what they are doing is wrong. That's what my mom always did when I was a kid. And that, in my experience, works with kids.

Children (as well as social animals) are cabable of feeling empathy. Explain them that they are hurting someone, or in danger themselves.

Just like how spanking isn't the same as physical abuse,

The object of it is to cause physical discomfort for a child, right? If it doesn't hurt, how does it work as a punishment? And if causing pain isn't the point, why not substitute it for something else?

Physical discomfort yes, but not pain. It's more in the shock of the action to get the child to realise that he's doing something wrong. You can put a child in the corner, eventually he'll be let out of the corner, you can take away his toys but we both know that more often than not he'll get them back. You can ground him but he's gonna be let out eventually. I don't see how anything like that is beneficial because the kid will cop on that none of those punishments actually stick.

So make them stick. You aren't seriously suggesting you have to cause lasting pain or damage to make the kid remember the punishment?

The pain/discomfort will go away eventually, after all.
Just like the kid will get their toy back.

I don't recall saying anything about lasting pain or damage.

Yeah, it'll fade but I'm not talking about spinning a kid around and spanking him as soon as he puts a foot out of line. It's meant as a last resort. I'm not saying that it's 100% effective but nothing is. If spanking doesn't deter the kid, maybe things like being grounded and having toys taken away will. If being grounded and having toys taken away doesn't deter the kid, then maybe being spanked will. If neither works well then this hypothetical parent has their work cut out for them.

You were saying that a punishment like putting the kid in a corner will not work because the punishment only lasts a while and the kid knows it will end. Which, by the way, is not so in my experience. Kids are inpatient. Besides, if you make it clear that is the result of disobeying, it works as a deterrent, because it's something the kid will want to avoid.

Not that punishing the bad behaviour should be the priority, in my opinion. Sometimes it's necessary, yes, but isn't rewarding the good behaviour better?

A Healthy Parent/Child relationship needs an element of fear. People will say that that's not true, but I don't think they really get it. If you need to hit your kids for them to fear and respect you, then more power to you, just don't do it when you're drunk and don't actually injure them.

That all sounds horrible, but I think it's true

You're confusing 'fear' with 'respect', I think.
A common mistake, it seems.
I know I didn't respect adults who yelled at me in hopes of making me do what they wanted. I thought they were idiots. And when I was beaten by my classmates, I might have feared them, but I also despised them and looked down on them.

 

[lacktheknack]

If the spanking can be classed as "physical abuse",

YOU.
ARE.
DOING.
IT.
ALL.
GOD.
DAMNED.
WRONG.

With that in mind, it varies from kid to kid, but spankings should be allowed, yes.

 

[MeChaNiZ3D]

I got it regularly with a belt and never really understood why. If someone had explained to me what I had done wrong, I think that would have sufficed after the first time. So maybe very occassionally.

 

[Eppy (Bored)]

Spanking breeds sociopathy. Children should never be spanked. That kind of conditioning doesn't teach anything. Children between two and three should be able to start understanding cause and effect at a level where right and wrong can be adequately explained. Before that, if they throw a fit the best thing anybody can do is refuse to acknowledge it.

Now, to clarify, I refer specifically to hitting on the buttocks. If a two-year-old refuses to stop grabbing something a quick tap (emphasis on TAP, not WHACK) on the hands is an effective way to communicate that a parent is serious, but if you grab a kid, bend him over your knee and thrash his butt he's most likely going upset and confused; there is no visible connection between his immediate suffering and whatever it is he has done, but he does know that the person he trusts most has grabbed him, restrained him in a humiliating position and inflicted extreme suffering on a part of his body he can't even see.

.
This first sentence sounds... Unreal. At the end you explain yourself better. So Pain can be used to teach a child right from wrong, but spanking doesn't tell the child the direct consequence of his actions, right? Tell me if I've got a mistake somewhere.

At a very basic level pain can be used to teach a child right from wrong but I feel its efficacy is VERY limited, and completely ineffectual if there is no visual correlation within the age range where it can be used at all. It's like beating a dog; we get away with it to a certain extent when we train them because they're not our intellectual equals and they don't make connections that quickly, but if you kick a dog many times it becomes aggressive and resentful. Cats are worse; my grandma left the house for a four-day weekend, and even though they were being visited and cared for daily when she got home she found that the more aggressive of the pair had been running downstairs and crapping on the sofa. The cat took revenge for a wrong it perceived itself as incurring by violating a long-standing behavior it had been trained for since birth.

The act of spanking is a very unique, distinctive punishment; if it's employed immediately on a young child it can effectively create a negative association with a certain behavior, but think of the potential ways that can go wrong! Instead of some minor positive punishment like a literal slap on the wrist you have been seized, inverted, physically (and potentially sexually) humiliated, and injured, sometimes significantly and at length, by somebody who supposedly loves you the most and cares about your well-being. That is potentially an extreme trauma, regardless of whether a child is two, six, ten, thirteen, whatever, and trauma causes problems.

My parents only hit me once. I think they realized that it was a terrible idea after I began quietly arming myself at the tender age of seven; by age eight I could build a pipe bomb and by nine I was spending my spare time learning how to purify uranium and build implosion lenses (answer: very carefully). Fortunately, none of this information was ever put to use, (deterrent, as it were) and I successfully conditioned my parents! Children are smarter than we give them credit for.

 

[solemnwar]

While I disagree with parents spanking their kids as discipline method #1 I defiantly disagree with the government deciding how people should raise their kids.

By that logic I should be allowed to raise my son or daughter to hate jews, eat babies on sundays, and kick puppies. And I should inflict punishment by beating and whipping with a knife tied to some string and maybe break some of his/her toes if it's really bad, and teach him/her to have sex with everyone they meet at least once whether the person wants to or not.

Cus it's my right to raise my child how I want right?

I know I totally went overboard lol but really, if the government didn't regulate at least a little bit on how parents raised their kids....

I think it is good that PHYSICAL FUCKING ASSAULT is now illegal. It's there to inflict extreme pain and suffering on a developing human being to submit them to your will. That shit is fucking ... It makes me angry. It IS brainwashing through physical torture. You cannot argue with that really... Granted it's certainly not the worst of course but it is what it is.

Yeahhh.. let's teach our kids that when one does something wrong they should be beaten or smacked. We want a peaceful society but won't even solve our issues with our kids without violence.

Good on new zealand.

It's a shame, I don't think america will ever adopt such a policy, we're such a backwards ass country. Amurica, fuck yeah.

I was spanked when I was a child, as was my sister.

We are both perfectly well-adjusted members of society.
We weren't BEATEN, it was one or two swift slaps to the buttocks that would sting for a few minutes, and that was it.
It taught us that actions had consequences. Sometimes painful ones. It taught us to never do that stupid thing again.

Of course, all children are different, and I don't condone supreme violence (whipping, hitting hard/long enough to bruise). But I think people really over exaggerate what spanking really is.

 

[DeimosMasque]

As both a person who was only spanked maybe three times in his life, and a BDSM guy who likes a good spanking, I will say this.

The buttocks is a fleshy part of our body that can absorb pain rather well, there is a reason that punishment is given to it.

It doesn't hurt as much as many of the other places a body does. It doesn't leave marks unless someone is exceedingly harsh, and

Abusers tend to go for the pain rather than the cover. There is a reason "I ran into a door" or "I fell down the stairs" has become ingrained into our minds as code for "A person who is abused"

To me, spanking is something that happens to a child from age 2 to age 8. It's not child abuse, it just is.

 

[Asuka Soryu]

I completely disagree with it, by I see why it's done.

Humans are naturally violent, so are response to fixing a problem is obviously violent.

And so, we breed the seed of hate. A kid hates being hit as punishment, they grow up with that hate and share it with their child and the cycle tends to go on.

I really wonder how many 'adults' would smack their children if they'd never been around such an enviorment, nor had been smacked themselves.

As we as a species try to better ourselves, I would hope that we phase out violence, outside of games, comics, cartoons and other fictional areas where no one is actually being hurt.




I don't feel the Government should be telling you how to raise your children, but you shouldn't be breaking the law either, and there's still the issue of parents who go to far and violently beat their children to an inch of their life, which is obviously when their 'rights' as parents should be immediately revoked.

 

[DeimosMasque]

[quote="Asuka Soryu" post="18.384815.15284910"Humans are naturally violent, so are response to fixing a problem is obviously violent.

And so, we breed the seed of hate. A kid hates being hit as punishment, they grow up with that hate and share it with their child and the cycle tends to go on. [/quote]

Of course human beings are violent. All carnivores and omnivores are violent. It's part of our instinctual reaction.

This "seed of hate" thing however bothers me. How does it explain people like me and my wife? Or our parents for that matter?

As I admitted I was spanked but perhaps only 3 or 4 times in 12 years. My wife's parents were physically punished a lot. They never spanked her or her brother.

If physical punishment left a "seed of hate" in us than I wouldn't often play video games with my father and discuss politics with my mother, I'd hate them too much to do so. And both my wife and I would abuse our pet cat because he pees on things we don't want him to.

 

[Yopaz]

Using violence as a disciplinary action shows your kids that violence can be accepted.

But it IS accepted in appropriate circumstances and with appropriate levels of force.

So I guess you are teaching them the right lesson.

Well, there are laws against violence and it is considered a crime unless it's self defense. Few countries allow violence as a punishment (kids being spanked is the exception).

When kids are being spanked it's not about self defense, which is the accepted form of violence, it's out of anger which is also why so many are sent to jail on assault charges.

I had never thought so many would argue the fact that violence is bad considering the fact that there are laws against it.

 

[Aprilgold]

Also, to claim that you came out the other side fine when you still think that hitting a defenceless innocent is acceptable I would say proves that you aren't fine.

But they aren't innocent. That's the idea.

And they know better? The issue with hitting a child is that it solves nothing, at all. Your not teaching the kid what their doing is wrong, your just forcing them not to do it.

I'm sure we have all been to that stage to where we think we know what is best when we really don't. Smacking a child anywhere does nothing but cause pain. It doesn't stop them from bullying other kids, it doesn't stop them from doing stupid shit. All it does is instill fear and will never do anything past that.

All I can say to that is you have no fucking clue what you are talking about. A kid doesn't cross lines JUST because they don't know better, they can cross it because they WANT to after being told not to. You're supposed to verbally set those lines up first, and then punish for crossing them. I never said that you should spank a kid just because they committed a crime they aren't aware of. That's stupid and it doesn't enforce anything, just as you said.

Forcing your kids to do things is a critical part of their development. If you're not forcing them to do things that they should, then you are failing your job as a parent to raise them to be an adult in the world. You don't have to be harsh about it, and it doesn't require spanking, but if a kid doesn't understand that something needs to be done, or there will be consequences for failing, then that kid is more likely going to grow up spoiled.

And how is pain and fear bad to motivate someone from doing something bad? Last time I checked, I didn't want to stick my hand in an open flame because of the pain, and the fear of that pain. I used to tempt fate and ride my bike without holding the handle bars, until I crashed it and skinned my knees and palms. Guess what I stopped doing after that? The world isn't covered in pillows and safety nets, so if a kid grows up unafraid of pain and consequences, he's going to get himself into trouble with the law or someone else not afraid to give him the beating he's earned. "Time Out" may be enough for a lot of kids, but there are a lot of kids that time is just more time to plot out more trouble. Those kids are the ones you save the spankings for, because they are far from innocent or unknowing.

PS: If you're going to take the hard-line on an issue, be sure you're using the right "you're" and "they're." Typos happen, but your post had at least 3 incorrect homophones. I'm not one to be a grammar nazi, but you're supposed to be the enlightened one here spreading your wisdom down unto the unwashed masses such as myself. I'm not trying to discredit your position on grammar, but I know you wouldn't take me seriously if I wrote back in cellphone or l33t speak.

By the same token, I should treat my child like he is a war prisoner who I must beat ruthlessly for information.

The issue with fear is exactly what is wrong with the death penalty, no one does something bad with the thought of getting caught being part of the agenda. No one murders another person in cold blood with the thought of "Well I am going to get caught for this." Some do, but a majority don't. A kid steals a lollipop from one of his classmates and gets a spanking for doing it. He didn't do it with the thought of getting caught, he did it because he wanted a tasty treat. What does beating him solve, if anything [I'm talking under the age of 5] he has forgotten about it and pretty much sees this as "Oh what did I do this time" instead of being taught why what he did was bad.

Also, spoiled. Cool, people still use that as a "their a brat" when every bratty kid I've ever met my entire life has been a kid who was punished via spanking, or being whipped with a belt and in some cases outright slapped that never got anything from their home-life that they desired like that brand new awesome book. Thats my personal experience, by the way, not a fact so trying to argue it is rather silly. If your case was different, it was different.

Pulling out a belt or whipping your hand at a child is not solving anything. Especially when their younger. All your doing is instilling fear so they will be complacent, not so that they will be good and know what their doing is good.

Fire or skinning your knee is not being caused by someone else or a trusted figure such as a parent. You learned after that because it is something you experienced for the first time [in that particular case] and as such your mind went "OH SHIT, THAT IS BLOODY PAINFUL" and reacted accordingly. There is a difference between teaching a kid not to do something and then forcing them not to do it for fear of getting hurt. Spanking is the latter. Spanking does nothing if you do it all the time for every available method since it eventually becomes a "OK, I did something wrong again, cool."

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Your a parent, a shepherd, a teacher and a guide. If you can not do any of the above without actually teaching them things, guiding them out of their comfort zones and making sure their safe and instead instilling pain and fear for complacency then you have failed, in my eyes as a parent. We need less kids forced into lives they don't want to live based on what their parents ideals are or based on the punishment is if they break those parent's rules and grow up to be hateful, spiteful people and more kids growing up as their own individual who is not, in short, a dick.

PS: Piss off. I never said that I was on a "higher horse" then you and you assuming that position is a "Oh look at this big man here picking on the stupid people around here with all of his knowledge. Trying to keep the common-man down" reeks of whining.

 

[Vanitas likes Bubbles]

I'm pretty sure I saw a study that proved (or at least saw a link) between kids being hit and their intelligence going down. If it's true then I'm doubly against it, I already disagree with the practice.

Ah, here it is.

http://www.webmd.com/parenting/news/20090924/kids-who-get-spanked-may-have-lower-iqs

Behold! A logical person on the internet! Rather than formulating a bias opinion on the matter, this person has backed up his opinion with scientific research.

Yeah, studies show that it lowers IQ and educational development along with some other stuff. I can't believe it that people like you use a link to scientific research but get completely ignored.

Edit: Shit, also you should never use verbal abuse on a child as discipline either because that will create fear into the child and will make them secretly wish you were dead. Okay, that was just a little bit hysterical.

 

[Zack Alklazaris]

I honestly do not know as I was never spanked.

I was a good kid as in didn't do drugs, go to parties, or have sex. But... I was spoiled rotten, didn't put effort in school, and constantly talked back to my parents.

I turned out ok, but I do wonder had I had a stricter punishment would I have been in a better career. I wanted to be an engineer, instead I'm a Technical Director.

All those lost monies...

 

[Signa]

Also, to claim that you came out the other side fine when you still think that hitting a defenceless innocent is acceptable I would say proves that you aren't fine.

But they aren't innocent. That's the idea.

And they know better? The issue with hitting a child is that it solves nothing, at all. Your not teaching the kid what their doing is wrong, your just forcing them not to do it.

I'm sure we have all been to that stage to where we think we know what is best when we really don't. Smacking a child anywhere does nothing but cause pain. It doesn't stop them from bullying other kids, it doesn't stop them from doing stupid shit. All it does is instill fear and will never do anything past that.

All I can say to that is you have no fucking clue what you are talking about. A kid doesn't cross lines JUST because they don't know better, they can cross it because they WANT to after being told not to. You're supposed to verbally set those lines up first, and then punish for crossing them. I never said that you should spank a kid just because they committed a crime they aren't aware of. That's stupid and it doesn't enforce anything, just as you said.

Forcing your kids to do things is a critical part of their development. If you're not forcing them to do things that they should, then you are failing your job as a parent to raise them to be an adult in the world. You don't have to be harsh about it, and it doesn't require spanking, but if a kid doesn't understand that something needs to be done, or there will be consequences for failing, then that kid is more likely going to grow up spoiled.

And how is pain and fear bad to motivate someone from doing something bad? Last time I checked, I didn't want to stick my hand in an open flame because of the pain, and the fear of that pain. I used to tempt fate and ride my bike without holding the handle bars, until I crashed it and skinned my knees and palms. Guess what I stopped doing after that? The world isn't covered in pillows and safety nets, so if a kid grows up unafraid of pain and consequences, he's going to get himself into trouble with the law or someone else not afraid to give him the beating he's earned. "Time Out" may be enough for a lot of kids, but there are a lot of kids that time is just more time to plot out more trouble. Those kids are the ones you save the spankings for, because they are far from innocent or unknowing.

PS: If you're going to take the hard-line on an issue, be sure you're using the right "you're" and "they're." Typos happen, but your post had at least 3 incorrect homophones. I'm not one to be a grammar nazi, but you're supposed to be the enlightened one here spreading your wisdom down unto the unwashed masses such as myself. I'm not trying to discredit your position on grammar, but I know you wouldn't take me seriously if I wrote back in cellphone or l33t speak.

By the same token, I should treat my child like he is a war prisoner who I must beat ruthlessly for information.

The issue with fear is exactly what is wrong with the death penalty, no one does something bad with the thought of getting caught being part of the agenda. No one murders another person in cold blood with the thought of "Well I am going to get caught for this." Some do, but a majority don't. A kid steals a lollipop from one of his classmates and gets a spanking for doing it. He didn't do it with the thought of getting caught, he did it because he wanted a tasty treat. What does beating him solve, if anything [I'm talking under the age of 5] he has forgotten about it and pretty much sees this as "Oh what did I do this time" instead of being taught why what he did was bad.

Also, spoiled. Cool, people still use that as a "their a brat" when every bratty kid I've ever met my entire life has been a kid who was punished via spanking, or being whipped with a belt and in some cases outright slapped that never got anything from their home-life that they desired like that brand new awesome book. Thats my personal experience, by the way, not a fact so trying to argue it is rather silly. If your case was different, it was different.

Pulling out a belt or whipping your hand at a child is not solving anything. Especially when their younger. All your doing is instilling fear so they will be complacent, not so that they will be good and know what their doing is good.

Fire or skinning your knee is not being caused by someone else or a trusted figure such as a parent. You learned after that because it is something you experienced for the first time [in that particular case] and as such your mind went "OH SHIT, THAT IS BLOODY PAINFUL" and reacted accordingly. There is a difference between teaching a kid not to do something and then forcing them not to do it for fear of getting hurt. Spanking is the latter. Spanking does nothing if you do it all the time for every available method since it eventually becomes a "OK, I did something wrong again, cool."

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Your a parent, a shepherd, a teacher and a guide. If you can not do any of the above without actually teaching them things, guiding them out of their comfort zones and making sure their safe and instead instilling pain and fear for complacency then you have failed, in my eyes as a parent. We need less kids forced into lives they don't want to live based on what their parents ideals are or based on the punishment is if they break those parent's rules and grow up to be hateful, spiteful people and more kids growing up as their own individual who is not, in short, a dick.

PS: Piss off. I never said that I was on a "higher horse" then you and you assuming that position is a "Oh look at this big man here picking on the stupid people around here with all of his knowledge. Trying to keep the common-man down" reeks of whining.

Says you, the one who never was spanked. Get a time machine, go back to your childhood and get spanked for breaking mama's favorite lamp, THEN talk to me about how awful it was. You wouldn't, because you'd know you were being a little brat that deserved it. Also telling me to piss off shows lack of the respect that I expect many spanked kids have instilled in them. I respect your right to your opinion. I do not respect how you talk down to me, my upbringing and my parents who love me an all my siblings very much.

 

[Ryan Minns]

Lol, I love watching shows about what the experts say on the matter. I remember a documentary based on 'spanking' and while saying "Spanking is considered a good means to discipline children but how true is this?" They were showing a mother smashing her child repeatably across the head and neck and dared to claim that is what giving a child a firm hand means...

Also I wish to ask a serious question here, who here who has a strong opinion on how to raise kids actually have kids? Better yet, who here has at least 50 children as to actually get a proper opinion on what child needs what kind of punishment because you're silly if you think one type of punishment works on all children