Yes, water it down in favor of more sales. Its what everybody is doing these days. Thank you for making the gaming industry BETTER and games MORE HIGH QUALITY. Thankfully, we now have GEMS like Modern Warfare 2 just from this wonderful trend.
Porting From PC to Console Is Doing Things Backwards, Says Rage Dev
- Thread starter Logan Westbrook
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this reminds me of why we have to wear seat belts in cars but not helmets on motorcycles
see when both issues were brought up here, car drivers had huge numbers but were very unorganized so they couldnt push much political clout but cyclists on the other hand had smaller numbers but were able to organize much easier and form a still opposition to the law and now they dont need helmets
my point is that pc gamers might only be 1/3rd of their upfront consumer base but we tend to be much more organized about things like this and also get much more annoyed by it, not to mention that the life of a game is much longer on the pc then it is on a console, if the makers are smart they can keep a game making money for them forever on the pc but for the most part consoles only make you money for a limited time
see when both issues were brought up here, car drivers had huge numbers but were very unorganized so they couldnt push much political clout but cyclists on the other hand had smaller numbers but were able to organize much easier and form a still opposition to the law and now they dont need helmets
my point is that pc gamers might only be 1/3rd of their upfront consumer base but we tend to be much more organized about things like this and also get much more annoyed by it, not to mention that the life of a game is much longer on the pc then it is on a console, if the makers are smart they can keep a game making money for them forever on the pc but for the most part consoles only make you money for a limited time
That totally did not come over in your comments. And if it has already been said before and you agree, why are you still arguing the toss with your line about PC only titles.bombadilillo said:
Just because it is PC only, does not mean it has been programmed to fully take advantage of all the PC can now do. Hence a lot of them only having DX 9, like Witcher 2 and Starcraft II. Being a PC only title does not = showing what a PC can do.
Most devs of PC only titles have an eye on moving the title to consoles in the future. The only things that stop a title going to consoles is if consoles are not capable of running the game currently or the title would not work with console controls. There is no exclusivity for PC titles, dev's will always try to bring them to consoles at some point, even if it is a future gen console. That's how it has always been with titles that start on the PC and how it should always be. As a PC gamer I have never wanted to have a monopoly on titles and any PC gamer who does is a d!*k.
The problem with it is the way these numbers are divined.Azaraxzealot said:
Pirate-downloads DON'T EQUATE TO LOST SALES, not even close, not even close-to-close
How are they counting the number of pirate downloads? They can't, because it's not counted. If they are, then they are estimating from the loss in expected profits (see above) or just guesstimating in general
The worse the devs do, the more they pirate. You're signing a death sentence to yourself from pirates on your PC platform when you don't consider them important in development. The best way for devs to kick pirates' asses is to work like Valve do, who have no problems at all with piracy on their games. The orange box brought enough value, and custom servers on CSS and TF2 would be hilariously terri-bad compared to the official list. they're also priced much better, and provide real advantages to using it.
But that's fine, I'm not buying console ports anyway, there are enough good games in this world not to need to.
I'm not against designing a game for consoles first, as long as they remember PCs are not consoles either. Case in point: the most recent Star Raiders (beyond its several technical flaws, which are many, too) has one of the most atrocious control schemes ever designed for a PC, and it doesn't even allow to be properly mapped to a Dualshock 2-type PC controller, one of the most popular models that are still being used.
I understand that developers need to start somewhere in order to do their job, but no platform should take priority. Each one has their fortes and particularities, and as such you need to make sure the game works in every one.
I understand that developers need to start somewhere in order to do their job, but no platform should take priority. Each one has their fortes and particularities, and as such you need to make sure the game works in every one.
There's a difference between developing primarily for consoles and (potentially) blindly crippling the PC version. The fact that they aren't even allowed to touch a keyboard and mouse while developing would worry me, if I had any anticipation for the game in the first place.
I still don't get their numbers, even if PC is 33% of sales more money goes to the publisher on PC sales VS consoles. On steam the Dev gets 77% of purchase price vs retail were they get 30% of purchase price. To me that means my digital sales are twice as precious as retail sales and I would work on that platform first. But hey we know how good our companies have been run in the past decade in the US.
That is a matter of opinion. For all you know, Azaraxzealot, might have actually played some RPG's on a PC and finds that they are better on a console.HassEsser said:
I use to be both a PC and Console gamer when I had the money, but at the moment it is much cheaper for me to just get games for my Xbox 360 then to overhaul my PC to run games for maybe a year or two.
The reason I had to get out of PC gaming is that it was just getting too expensive because I was having to buy some new piece of hardware every year or year and a half. With that, I would only have the money to get maybe 2 or 3 games a year, and then by the time I had the money to get the latest game I wanted, the latest game needed new hardware to run.
Back to what I was getting at, RPGs on Consoles and PC. When I did both PC and Console, I did platformers and a few other types of games on consoles, and I did RPGs, RTSs, and Shooters on PC.
Well now that I am a relative console only gamer, I play RPGs on my 360. Dragon Age is in your list. That is BioWare. I played KoTOR on my PC back in the day. I found that Dragon Age, like most BioWare RPGs, is set up mostly like KoTor. In battle you pause the action, plan what you need done, and then watch the battle and input special commands as needed.
I got Dragon Age on my 360 and comparing the two experiences, KoTOR on PC and playing Dragon Age on 360, I find that playing RPGs on the console is just slightly better. The reason it is better to me, is that it takes less time to input special commands with a controller than it does with clicking a mouse on the command or finding the button on the keyboard. It may only be a matter of a few seconds difference, but a few seconds can mean life or death in such RPGs.
So in such matters it is a matter of opinion not fact on what platform a game is better on. That is why I wish all this silly fighting about platforms would stop. There are no facts in the matter to be arguing about when it comes to how a game plays.
While I am at it, I will also say that for me, FPSs are better on consoles. It is all a matter of opinion, no facts.
I read all that too.Astalano said:
It's outright stupid to port anything, anywhere. Just because it's multiplatform doesn't mean one audience has to have priority over another. Different development teams for different platforms, but with common elements, such as the graphic artists, writers, ect. Basically, everything in common, but coded specifically for each platform. Don't even get me started on how wrong it is to port from the console to the PC, there are just too many epic failures that way.
JESUS CHRIST GUYS, WHY AREN'T YOU ALL WEARING HELMETS AND SHARPING YOUR PITCHFORKS!? YOU'RE ALL IN FLAME TERRITORY! WE HAVE TO FIGHT TO SURVIVE!
Since I don't have the money to buy an experimental supercomputer from space, I'm happy.
I'll be getting this on my PS3 if I buy it at all, because upgrading to hardware that can run this game will cost more money than I have, not including the cost of the game.
You're forgetting that gamepads have less buttons than keyboards. Therefore if you map actions to every keyboard button then you can't play that game on console. I'm sure the elitists would be happy, but that is the wrong stance.
Map the controls and optimise for consoles. Then when it's running on consoles well, tweak the menus, graphics and controls to take advantage of the mouse+keyboard and the potentially superior hardware.
I'll be getting this on my PS3 if I buy it at all, because upgrading to hardware that can run this game will cost more money than I have, not including the cost of the game.
You're forgetting that gamepads have less buttons than keyboards. Therefore if you map actions to every keyboard button then you can't play that game on console. I'm sure the elitists would be happy, but that is the wrong stance.
Map the controls and optimise for consoles. Then when it's running on consoles well, tweak the menus, graphics and controls to take advantage of the mouse+keyboard and the potentially superior hardware.
Heh, and then people will realize they can just run their pirated 360 and ps3 software with an emulator on their PC once they stop making PC games. It's all spiraling down the shitter. Free to play and micro-transactions will take over everything. I'm just waiting for the government to allow Microsoft and Mac to start treating computers like consoles where they control all content and disallow all unapproved 3rd party programs. *sigh* Alas poor Linux I knew him well.bombadilillo said:
I think trying to get a game to run on lower level hardware would be a lot easier than trying to make it and then go through and optimize everything afterwards. Probably why we get so many shitty ports on PC.
Carmack is pretty smart. I mean... he builds freakin' rocket ships.ph0b0s123 said:
(I also think he's being misquoted here, but whatevs.)The argument about PCs being "x percent" more powerful are very misleading, and are misusing raw numbers. For example, consider that a 5000HP train isn't going to win a race against a 500HP muscle car - despite the raw HP numbers being far skewed in the train's favor.
The architecture of an XBox 360 is actually significantly different in many ways from a desktop PC... the main reason applications are more readily migrated is because Microsoft controls the development environment on both platforms. The PS3 is a bit further differentiated, but not nearly as much as people think... the challenges of developing for it stem as much from the development tools provided by Sony as from the uniqueness of the platform.
Consoles are purpose built for real-time graphics/gaming - which is why PCs, while most certainly able to eclipse their abilities through brute force, aren't necessarily "zomg 50x bettar!!11one".