so....Not having children=Selfish?

[KAPTAINmORGANnWo4life]

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SNIP.

yes

but so what?

There's no point in trying to find what we know isn't there. Anything; raising a child, ruling a nation, playing a game, they are all equal in their ultimate triviality. They are preoccupations of life awaiting it's fate.

More and more people are, consciously or not, becoming aware of this. It is why fertility rates in educated countries are so abysmal. The will of fruitless perpetuity is being eroded from the human mind.

That is why this thread, while sharing pointlessness with all living pursuits, is pointless in another sense: Selfishness doesn't matter. Your race will die. Your nation will die. Your species, planet, system, and galaxy all will die. Your offspring will die. As will theirs, and all which come after. And regardless of what they pursue, where they go, how they live, or what society has deemed as their accomplishments, they, and you, will be forgotten.

Nihilists! Fuck me. I mean, say what you like about the tenets of National Socialism, Dude, at least it's an ethos.
(All in good humor)

It might have an ethos if I WAS ABDUCTED BY NINJAS! NINJAS!

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1. PLENTY of people like procreating, plenty of people will continue to do it...your blowing things out of proportaion

2. we arnt being destroyed (at least not for a few life times..and even then I doubt it)..and even if we are didnt you say its all going to end anyway? (I think I saw on a documentry, if you could have an atom for every year untill the end of the universe...there atill arnt enough atoms) you say everthing is meaningless because it will eventually end yet you also talk about how our current attitudes are "somwhow" leading us to doom becuse some peopel dont want ot have babies

I dont wan to have babies because "Alien: chest burster" seriously

3. you sound pretty miserable to me if you think everything is so horrible you dont want ot bringa child into the world

4. highly debatable, all depends on how you look at it

1) When the amount of people who don't want to procreate continues to grow, there's no reason to assume anything other than the trend continuing.

2) People not wanting children aren't contributing to the longevity of the species. It is part of what is leading to our end. Our existence is still meaningless, regardless, but it's hard to argue that more people choosing not to make babies does anything other than remove potential from our gene pools

3) I never said everything is horrible, I said it was pointless. Fallout 3, ham, the Qur'an, Tunisia, Shakespeare, they're all ultimately pointless. If people want to assign personal value to them, that's fine, but it doesn't change their actual net worth of zero.

4) There is no greater point to being informed over being ignorant. If you can indulge the film analogy, it's akin to the Matrix: If you take the blue pill of ignorance, you will believe what you want to believe, and know everything you want to, but if you take the red pill of information, there is no going back from the harsh realities you must accept, lest they destroy you.

 

[samstewiefisher]

The world is already overpopulated, and the worlds population is growing exponentially. If less people decided to have children we woulpdprobably end up in a better position in 50 years time.

 

[ElPatron]

Lol? If you don't have kids bad things don't happen. Surprise surprise.

I kindly suggest that you should tell that to Japan/France.

somehow means I deny all responsibilities towards society? It's simply illogical.

I quoted a post that was borderline anarchic. I feel that my post was justified towards that person.

There are what, 7 billion people on earth right now? It's becoming increasingly more selfish to have children, I'd say.

Do you know the percentage of people we are trying to stop from having kids?

We don't have enough children in Western countries, period. We will either reach the point everyone is too old to work or the former ethnic "minorities" will surpass natives.

While other countries have just too many kids who won't even live past 35.

We are not talking about populational growth, we are talking about maintaining our population.

Usually when I hear about "downshifting" (taking a less fulfilling job to have more free time) it's usually to have more time to be with the family.

If having a lot of free time in loneliness is your thing, I think that you not having children isn't an option. It should be mandatory.

 

[Christopher Callahan]

I only skimmed your post, but it's selfish because you are jeopardizing the economy and stability of your country by refusing to have children. Every couple must produce at least two children on average to sustain your population, but since there are factors such as early death, sterility, homosexuality inhibiting us, couple must produce above 2 children or the population will dwindle over the years. Then of course there's the fact that the ratio of boys to girls is not equal, so even more children need to be produced.

Lowering the national reproductive rates to below the par required for sustaining to population results in age demographic imbalances. China is famous for it's one child policy they introduced to help counter overpopulation. This has been disastrous because it actually worked to an extent and since people stopped producing enough children, the country's average age is very high compared to most countries, it's a big problem when your country mostly contains seniors for obvious reasons.

Canada's population is actually at risk because too many people don't feel it's worth their time to have kids. Personally I think the government needs to offer more incentives to parents. Sure you will have welfare bums who will only benefit further from this, but more good will come of it than bad I think.

Former Premiere of British Columbia, Gordon Campbell made the situation a little worse in 2010 with the introduction of the new tax system. Yeah, let's tax all children's clothing and goods, I'm sure more people will have kids if we do that.

You ether
A. Had to write a paper on this or
B. Have spent too much of your free time thinking on this.

Besides, don't you have a greater responsitlity to yourself? This is even more true if you do have kids, as everything you do is seen by them. If they see to working yourself to the bone try to feed them, what does that tell them? that you live solely as a way for them to get what they want?

Now you will say:
No, it will show them that they should sacrifice for the greater good of their country and the world.

To which I will say:
Unless they work for the government, that isn't and shouldn't be their job.

Then you say something sarcastic in a vain attempt to outdo me and win an internet debate, and then I will start ignoring you, then you will think you won, and so on and so forth.

So people should only be concerned for themselves? If normal people viewed things like you then there would be little life worth living. Your parents raised you to what you are yet you criticise people who want to do the same for other children. I doubt they raised you to belive that you shouldnt have kids else they wouldnt have had you.

Life is all about living, if we don't live our live our selves who will? Life isn't about having kid, or making piles of money, or going rock clime ling or mediating or going to church every Sunday or waking up in pool of vomit from an all night party. It's about doing what makes you happy and fulfilled. So long as you don't hurt anyone along the way, what does it matter?
And don't call me normal, if we were all normal, we'd living in caves slowly starving to death. And hey, guess what? I'm over 18, my parents don't have any say in what I do, and even if they did, they raised me to think for myself, not blindly do what they did. I never said that people shouldn't have kids. Unlike some people here, I like kids. I just don't want any. Not right now anyway. If that make me wrong, well, you should know the rest of that saying.
Also? you replied fast.

"life not lived for others is not a life". Thats my philosophy (thats from Mother Teresa by the way im not claiming it is my statement). What I said about your parents was that they raised you from a child to who you are now. Being legally an adult doesnt change that you to were once a helpless child who wouldnt be breathing if it werent for people who took care of you. You shouldnt look down on those with children and Iview it that you owe someone else a childhood and life because you had one as well and to decide that you shouldnt so you can further only yourself os rather selfish.

I'd rather be selfish and and happy then selfless and cutting.

 

[Christopher Callahan]

Ha ha ha! This thread is great! I love all the folk posturing that they don't want kids. No woman in her right mind would allow herself to be inseminated by you bunch of losers in the first instance so please, go ahead and convince yourselves that this is your choice and not a defence mechanism related to your hideous physique/ personality/ both.

Cheers!

The fact that you chose to say this instead of just reading the posts tells me that you have a much bigger problem then your own Hideous physique/personality/both. To be fair I replied, so that doesn't make me much better.

Now you will say:
So you admit that you have a Hideous physique/personality/both.

Then I'll say:
I'm told that I'm rather handsome, but prone to the odd sarcastic remark, but their funny enough that no one has disown me over them.

Your mum doesn't count when people tell you you're rather handsome.

And you do? Well whatever, I sure you have lots of friend to tell you what you look like with that personality. And is that the best you can do? "Dur, you mum, Dur". That is the weakest insult I ever heard.

 

[Mikeyfell]

I won't have kids. And my nonexistent children should be grateful.
You see I had my eyes opened by this insightful documentary, maybe you've heard of it. It's called Idiocracy.

With the birth rate among "the stupids" skyrocketing and the birth rate of "The non-stupids" ever shrinking the only responsible thing to do for the benefit of your unborn children is to keep them that way.

Real life example of this: the dumbest person I met throughout my 4 years of highschool wants to be a teacher.

I had enough trouble dealing with current generation stupids, I can only imagine how hard it would be for my hypothetical offspring to not "go all serial killer" on the next generation.
So let the future dissolve, no one related to me will be around to see it.

 

[LHZA]

I know

You say you don't want kids and people look at you like there is something wrong with you, and most patronizing of all, give that knowing smile that says " you'll change your mind". No it is not selfish to not want children, and you can have a fufillinh life without them.

 

[Varrdy]

3.Child rearing is a lifestyle choice, is it selfish of me to not have children because I want to pursue my own goals...rather than have children and be a terrible parent because I dont want to give up everything to raise them?

I use this point over and over when people say I am selfish for not wanting children. I have neither the means or the motivation to rear a child (not to mention the small matter of being single). I don't want one and I don't like them but I would never dream of bringing a child into the world knowing that I didn't want it or was unable to care for it. It would be a horrible and SELFISH thing to do!

It's not so much being called selfish that bothers me as the implication that I am in some way abnormal when I say I don't want children. The responses range from a raised eyebrow of disbelief through to excrutiatingly patronising statements along the lines of: "Oh you don't know what you're saying, of COURSE you want children, REALLY!"

Erm...no.

I never felt the desire to be a parent and I can't be arsed to be one anyway.

As for the sort of things you have to do to get a baby, that bit I don't mind one little bit but bless Durex for the gift of the condom, says I!

Wardy

 

[ElPatron]

or the former ethnic "minorities" will surpass natives.

Is that supposed to be a problem?

Oh, boy. Here comes the "race card".

Yes, indeed it is. First, in a large scale it could effectively drive Caucasians extinct. And I am all for biodiversity. I don't like to take it to extremes, but if we control the population of wild animals to preserve native wildlife why can't we do it with humans? Second, after a few dozens of generations former minorities can just control the state, and I would move out of country before I had to obey "Sharia law" or any other law tied to ethnic groups.

I'm not saying you should take a rifle and start "varmint hunting" on humans, of course.

You people would cry for biodiversity if I was cloning Caucasian humans and pumping a stream of them to places where they are not native.

Call me racist, but I am sure some of my descendants would love to have a Caucasian girlfriend without inbreeding.

Lol? If you don't have kids bad things don't happen. Surprise surprise.

I kindly suggest that you should tell that to Japan/France.

Oh I see. So you have a severe disability. You can't see context. I was talking about society enforcing certain views like yours, not about other consequences. So do tell, were you being dishonest or stupid here? I can't quite tell which.

What the hell am I reading?

Lol? If you don't have kids bad things don't happen. Surprise surprise.

I was talking about society enforcing certain views like yours, not about other consequences.

If I am missing something, please do tell. I'm apparently stupid and a pathological liar.

 

[nathan-dts]

Not having children is selfless. Population did reach 7 billion a couple months back and we still haven't colonised the moon.

 

[freakymojo]

only if the place you live in is currently having problems with its population. otherwise its something that usually comes natural to alot of people sooner or later.

 

[Zayle79]

I won't have kids. And my nonexistent children should be grateful.
You see I had my eyes opened by this insightful documentary, maybe you've heard of it. It's called Idiocracy.

With the birth rate among "the stupids" skyrocketing and the birth rate of "The non-stupids" ever shrinking the only responsible thing to do for the benefit of your unborn children is to keep them that way.

Real life example of this: the dumbest person I met throughout my 4 years of highschool wants to be a teacher.

I had enough trouble dealing with current generation stupids, I can only imagine how hard it would be for my hypothetical offspring to not "go all serial killer" on the next generation.
So let the future dissolve, no one related to me will be around to see it.

But people get smarter as time goes on. If a person from the year 1900 who was considered to have average intelligence were to take a modern-day IQ test, they be considered mildly retarded by today's standards. Besides, just think about it--if it really worked like it did in Idiocracy, then how has our society come so far since, say, the Middle Ages?

Not that it means you're obligated to have kids. The whole "people are getting dumber!" thing just really irritates me.

 

[Tommeh Brownleh]

There are over eight billion people on this planet. I think we can stand for birth rates to drop. A lot. Forever. I don't want kids, I don't think mankind needs to be sustained. What have we done that has actually helped this planet? Can you think of anything? Because I can't.

 

[Innegativeion]

Hell no!

If anything, human generations need to get smaller! Not that having kids is not bad or anything, but we're at 7 BILLION people now. We're slowly choking out most other forms of animal life on the planet.

We seriously need to stop overpopulating before either the earth implodes or the anti spirals[sub][sub]( go all majora's mask on our asses )[/sub][/sub] finally get sick of our shit.

 

[ElPatron]

Biodiversity would best be served by interracial marriage.

No. You might be confusing some terms.

Interracial couples would mix up our gene pool by creating a singular hybrid of all races. That sounds a lot like Eugenics.

Every race has the right to sustain on it's own.

As for the population of wild animals... You do realize that animals serve roles and them going extinct might upset their environment? Lose all the wolves, hey now a predator is gone. Lose all the Caucasians and... what? We still have humans around.

You're missing the point. There are wolfs in a region. Then pink wolves appear. They are no better at hunting or fighting. But they breed out of control. They will make the regular NATIVE wolves die.

Edited because of POLITICAL CORRECTNESS. All you people see is racism... everywhere.

The same is happening in Britain. The Nutkin breed is being phased out by alien species.

Australia. Rabbits would destroy the vegetation as their breeding capabilities are outstanding.

As for the second part, that's cultural. Having kids to fight for votes is ridiculous though.

Yet it's a serious concern in France.

Notice how the first post coincides nicely with my latest. Society. And even your reply was about society. It's just lately you decided to start talking about other things besides society's attitude.

It is morally reprehensible to stop contributing to society. You said that nothing bad happens. Logically the argument steers that way.

Well, bad things do happen. Society will have to pay an absurd amount of taxes to pay for the old society of people who didn't want to have kids because they had better things to do.

Let's talk about life sentence.

If you started talking about it, I couldn't be able to use the "moving the goalposts argument".

 

[ElPatron]

What have we done that has actually helped this planet? Can you think of anything? Because I can't.

Because life is all about helping the planet.

Viruses only seek for hosts and destroy their cells. What the hell have they been doing for the planet?

If anything, human generations need to get smaller!

Because most of the countries that have high birth rates don't have absurd mortality rates and an average life expectancy of less than 40 years.

While we have very low birth rates and our old society forces us to have a big chunk of people that are too old to work and need money to live.

That means high taxes and low productivity.

 

[Tommeh Brownleh]

Here's a quick question, has anybody who is arguing that not having children is selfish seen the population count? Over seven billion. A lot of these are children with no good homes. Your logic states that adopting one of these children, and encouraging people to adopt one of them too, rather than cranking out a new waste of carbon, is selfish. This is saying that keeping a lifestyle that you are happy with, and that allows you to live as you please, is selfish. You are stating that contributing to the overpopulation problem is NOT selfish. You are stating that putting a woman through labor pains, and then at least eighteen years of a small combination of you and your partner putting you through money related, noise related, and stress related pain, is NOT selfish, even when your partner may have not wanted this little waste. Is this getting through to you?