This is hardly redeeming evidence.Nurb said:
I can understand some support when they come to the defense of people who didn't actually do anything wrong, but it's when they pull something like this is when I don't understand why anyone would back hackers doing a move like this.Captain Bobbossa said:
You're really going to pull this? Xbox Live can be hacked as well, and as far as we know Sony was sizing up the damage before reporting in like any responsible company should. They were HACKED. There is no fault on Sony's part and there's no reason to believe they were not as prompt as humanly possible given the circumstances. You think they have a warning light that pops on for every single account that gets accessed sitting on their front desks? Even BANKS fail to catch identity theft until the card holders themselves report it, so Sony is doing better than BANKS who we trust with our money on a daily basis.Torque669 said:
Your bank details? That isn't knowledge. It's data.Captain Bobbossa said:You are an idiot.Nurb said:No connection?Awexsome said:I don't see a connection.Nurb said:Yes, it does actually. Having and sharing knowledge, even that which can be used for harmful purposes is not illegal and a basic right in a free society covered by the first amendment. Do you have any idea how dangerous it is to punish people for just knowing something? Besides, it's why Jackass can't get shut off the air when copy cat kids kill themselves recreating a stunt. You've got no clue what you're talking about.Awexsome said:The sharing information and convincing other people not to abuse it are completely exclusive to each other. This is the internet we're talking about. You probably trust Sony about as much as they trust you, a random person on the internet. The kind of person that Geo released that code to.Nurb said:I call them "Evil corporate bastards" when they act like it, and they certainly are when they punish a guy for just sharing information, when they convince people they don't have any right to do anything with the device they paid hundreds of dollars for simply because they company says so and has the money to bully people who do learn everything about it and expose problems with it instead of using those resources to protect customer data at the most basic levels. They don't care about the customer, only how much control they have over them.Awexsome said:Of course. Lazy corporate bastards.Nurb said:I'm not giving up dick because some company can't do what every other damn company does and MAKE A PATCH when they discover someone found an exploit. You're a perfect example as how kids are manipulated by these lazy corporate bastards into thinking people need to give up more freedom as technology advances and finding an exploit in the company's hardware is something that needs to be punished.Awexsome said:You ever think things are better now? That they don't give people permission to do whatever they want?Nurb said:Yes. they do. It's a computer, people have a right to look into how their computers work at the code level and talk about it. If they want so much control over people's property, then they can charge less for it or lease it for 10 bucks a month.Awexsome said:
Just because people make viruses for PCs doesn't mean software engineers should be thrown in prison for figuring out and sharing how the window OS works, and you don't see car companies dragging car enthusiasts into court for cracking their car computer to tweak performance.
So yea, Sony isn't special and they're no different than any other hardware manufacturer. Deal with that. Damn kids are being brainwashed into defending some corporate bully who can't even encrypt their customer data. Not even banks let hackers get away with the entire database and they're hacked all the time.
It only pisses off a very small amount as most people get what they want from the functionality provided. You ever think that maybe the old ways were worse? Sure the people who love customization take a hit but its a small price to pay for the added security.
I'm not going to convince someone that has lived their entire life thinking that freedom is a given when given a new piece of technology but the times have changed.
Fuck that and fuck them. They can't punish people because they screw up and don't move fast enough to fix it like every other company out there. Apple doesn't prosecute jailbreakers, they just update the firmware.
Y'know they're not evil bad guys. As much as you lie to yourself they aren't actively trying to screw you over. They're trying to do what's best for everyone and the people who want stuff like you want are an extreme minority now.
I know you want to think that you're preaching one of the last hopes of a rapidly decaying videogame industry but you're not. You're just someone with another opinion.
If you were trying to run a business with unknown number of hackers always trying to be a step ahead of you and steal your products or ruin your services for their own personal gains what would you do? Keep fighting the same fight until the end of time? Because your solution isn't realistic or efficient.
If you're just going to be stubborn and only think of them as the "evil corporate bastards" then we're done here.
But they are trying to screw everyone over in the days of "profit at all costs", just look at the oppressed communist workers and children they employ to make the devices.
Releasing the code and saying "Oh, I don't intend any wrong." does NOT dismiss him of the wrong he did.
Oh and THE IRONING IS DELICOUS
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootkit_scandal
The Sony BMG CD copy protection scandal concerns the copy protection measures included by Sony BMG on compact discs in 2005. Sony BMG included the Extended Copy Protection (XCP) and MediaMax CD-3 software on music CDs. XCP was put on 52 titles and MediaMax was put on 50 titles. This software was automatically installed on Windows desktop computers when customers tried to play the CDs. The software interferes with the normal way in which the Microsoft Windows operating system plays CDs by installing a rootkit which creates vulnerabilities for other malware to exploit. This was discovered and publicly revealed by Mark Russinovich on the Sysinternals blog.
Sony made a rootkit that left customer computers vulnerable to viruses and malware and they weren't publicly humiliated or scolded by expensive lawyers. They deserve whatever they get and no defense whatsoever from people who have short memories.
Karma's a *****.
Sony screwed up a while back by making a crappy product that put people at risk. Shame on them.
This somehow makes them responsible for other people committing identity fraud?
Besides considering that rootkey just basic "knowledge" isn't true. Just like how all these people's identity's are just "knowledge" right? The rootkey was Sony's not the consumers to use.
Sony makes a rootkit (code) that leaves people vulnerable to hackers and viruses without telling them = No consequences
Customer makes a video that exposes code that will leave Sony's databases vulnerable to hackers and viruses = "KILL THE MESSENGER IN A HAIL OF LAWSUITS AND DON'T CHANGE SECURITY TO PROPERLY PROTECT CUSTOMER DATA!"
They have a really obvious point. So my bank details are just "knowledge" that sony has and it would be perfectly ok to just let someone else know what they are? No, that's apsolute rubbish. Even though you are the anti-sony troll that you are how can you not see that Geo is not in the wrong here? He has provided information to the world that could potentially (and probably did) expose very private and dangerous information of thousands and thousands of people. Wether he should be sued or not isn't even in question here, the fact is he should never have released that informaion. What if it was a bank instead of sony? What if it was your bank? Would you still be holding to your guns then? What if Geo gave your credit/debit card details over to some random stranger, would you still be sticking to your guns about this? I doubt it.
True hackers evolve day to day, but a company isn't supposed to let all of their users information get out, let alone if credit card numbers are involved in this. Protect the big things and let the little things go. I don't see the same happening to Nintendo or Microsoft or Apple with their security.Kadamon said:
I meant specifically Geo and annonimous, the whinny bitches that they are.Frank_Sinatra_ said:
Again I say, it shouldn't even have been possible for a PS3, even one that had been jailbroken, to access this data. That is why Sony is more to blame than Geohot. He jailbroke the iPhone too, yet the app store is still up...Captain Bobbossa said:You are an idiot.Nurb said:No connection?Awexsome said:I don't see a connection.Nurb said:Yes, it does actually. Having and sharing knowledge, even that which can be used for harmful purposes is not illegal and a basic right in a free society covered by the first amendment. Do you have any idea how dangerous it is to punish people for just knowing something? Besides, it's why Jackass can't get shut off the air when copy cat kids kill themselves recreating a stunt. You've got no clue what you're talking about.Awexsome said:The sharing information and convincing other people not to abuse it are completely exclusive to each other. This is the internet we're talking about. You probably trust Sony about as much as they trust you, a random person on the internet. The kind of person that Geo released that code to.Nurb said:I call them "Evil corporate bastards" when they act like it, and they certainly are when they punish a guy for just sharing information, when they convince people they don't have any right to do anything with the device they paid hundreds of dollars for simply because they company says so and has the money to bully people who do learn everything about it and expose problems with it instead of using those resources to protect customer data at the most basic levels. They don't care about the customer, only how much control they have over them.Awexsome said:Of course. Lazy corporate bastards.Nurb said:I'm not giving up dick because some company can't do what every other damn company does and MAKE A PATCH when they discover someone found an exploit. You're a perfect example as how kids are manipulated by these lazy corporate bastards into thinking people need to give up more freedom as technology advances and finding an exploit in the company's hardware is something that needs to be punished.Awexsome said:You ever think things are better now? That they don't give people permission to do whatever they want?Nurb said:Yes. they do. It's a computer, people have a right to look into how their computers work at the code level and talk about it. If they want so much control over people's property, then they can charge less for it or lease it for 10 bucks a month.Awexsome said:
Just because people make viruses for PCs doesn't mean software engineers should be thrown in prison for figuring out and sharing how the window OS works, and you don't see car companies dragging car enthusiasts into court for cracking their car computer to tweak performance.
So yea, Sony isn't special and they're no different than any other hardware manufacturer. Deal with that. Damn kids are being brainwashed into defending some corporate bully who can't even encrypt their customer data. Not even banks let hackers get away with the entire database and they're hacked all the time.
It only pisses off a very small amount as most people get what they want from the functionality provided. You ever think that maybe the old ways were worse? Sure the people who love customization take a hit but its a small price to pay for the added security.
I'm not going to convince someone that has lived their entire life thinking that freedom is a given when given a new piece of technology but the times have changed.
Fuck that and fuck them. They can't punish people because they screw up and don't move fast enough to fix it like every other company out there. Apple doesn't prosecute jailbreakers, they just update the firmware.
Y'know they're not evil bad guys. As much as you lie to yourself they aren't actively trying to screw you over. They're trying to do what's best for everyone and the people who want stuff like you want are an extreme minority now.
I know you want to think that you're preaching one of the last hopes of a rapidly decaying videogame industry but you're not. You're just someone with another opinion.
If you were trying to run a business with unknown number of hackers always trying to be a step ahead of you and steal your products or ruin your services for their own personal gains what would you do? Keep fighting the same fight until the end of time? Because your solution isn't realistic or efficient.
If you're just going to be stubborn and only think of them as the "evil corporate bastards" then we're done here.
But they are trying to screw everyone over in the days of "profit at all costs", just look at the oppressed communist workers and children they employ to make the devices.
Releasing the code and saying "Oh, I don't intend any wrong." does NOT dismiss him of the wrong he did.
Oh and THE IRONING IS DELICOUS
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootkit_scandal
The Sony BMG CD copy protection scandal concerns the copy protection measures included by Sony BMG on compact discs in 2005. Sony BMG included the Extended Copy Protection (XCP) and MediaMax CD-3 software on music CDs. XCP was put on 52 titles and MediaMax was put on 50 titles. This software was automatically installed on Windows desktop computers when customers tried to play the CDs. The software interferes with the normal way in which the Microsoft Windows operating system plays CDs by installing a rootkit which creates vulnerabilities for other malware to exploit. This was discovered and publicly revealed by Mark Russinovich on the Sysinternals blog.
Sony made a rootkit that left customer computers vulnerable to viruses and malware and they weren't publicly humiliated or scolded by expensive lawyers. They deserve whatever they get and no defense whatsoever from people who have short memories.
Karma's a *****.
Sony screwed up a while back by making a crappy product that put people at risk. Shame on them.
This somehow makes them responsible for other people committing identity fraud?
Besides considering that rootkey just basic "knowledge" isn't true. Just like how all these people's identity's are just "knowledge" right? The rootkey was Sony's not the consumers to use.
Sony makes a rootkit (code) that leaves people vulnerable to hackers and viruses without telling them = No consequences
Customer makes a video that exposes code that will leave Sony's databases vulnerable to hackers and viruses = "KILL THE MESSENGER IN A HAIL OF LAWSUITS AND DON'T CHANGE SECURITY TO PROPERLY PROTECT CUSTOMER DATA!"
They have a really obvious point. So my bank details are just "knowledge" that sony has and it would be perfectly ok to just let someone else know what they are? No, that's apsolute rubbish. Even though you are the anti-sony troll that you are how can you not see that Geo is not in the wrong here? He has provided information to the world that could potentially (and probably did) expose very private and dangerous information of thousands and thousands of people. Wether he should be sued or not isn't even in question here, the fact is he should never have released that informaion. What if it was a bank instead of sony? What if it was your bank? Would you still be holding to your guns then? What if Geo gave your credit/debit card details over to some random stranger, would you still be sticking to your guns about this? I doubt it.
I don't think that's possible? Not immediately, at least. The only thing they can do is call their credit card companies and get a freeze on them until they can get a replacement card, and transfer all the funds (for debit cards, at least) to the appropriate accounts.Cyan. said:
Owyn_Merrilin said:Again I say, it shouldn't even have been possible for a PS3, even one that had been jailbroken, to access this data. That is why Sony is more to blame than Geohot. He jailbroke the iPhone too, yet the app store is still up...Captain Bobbossa said:You are an idiot.Nurb said:No connection?Awexsome said:I don't see a connection.Nurb said:Yes, it does actually. Having and sharing knowledge, even that which can be used for harmful purposes is not illegal and a basic right in a free society covered by the first amendment. Do you have any idea how dangerous it is to punish people for just knowing something? Besides, it's why Jackass can't get shut off the air when copy cat kids kill themselves recreating a stunt. You've got no clue what you're talking about.Awexsome said:The sharing information and convincing other people not to abuse it are completely exclusive to each other. This is the internet we're talking about. You probably trust Sony about as much as they trust you, a random person on the internet. The kind of person that Geo released that code to.Nurb said:I call them "Evil corporate bastards" when they act like it, and they certainly are when they punish a guy for just sharing information, when they convince people they don't have any right to do anything with the device they paid hundreds of dollars for simply because they company says so and has the money to bully people who do learn everything about it and expose problems with it instead of using those resources to protect customer data at the most basic levels. They don't care about the customer, only how much control they have over them.Awexsome said:Of course. Lazy corporate bastards.Nurb said:I'm not giving up dick because some company can't do what every other damn company does and MAKE A PATCH when they discover someone found an exploit. You're a perfect example as how kids are manipulated by these lazy corporate bastards into thinking people need to give up more freedom as technology advances and finding an exploit in the company's hardware is something that needs to be punished.Awexsome said:You ever think things are better now? That they don't give people permission to do whatever they want?Nurb said:Yes. they do. It's a computer, people have a right to look into how their computers work at the code level and talk about it. If they want so much control over people's property, then they can charge less for it or lease it for 10 bucks a month.Awexsome said:
Just because people make viruses for PCs doesn't mean software engineers should be thrown in prison for figuring out and sharing how the window OS works, and you don't see car companies dragging car enthusiasts into court for cracking their car computer to tweak performance.
So yea, Sony isn't special and they're no different than any other hardware manufacturer. Deal with that. Damn kids are being brainwashed into defending some corporate bully who can't even encrypt their customer data. Not even banks let hackers get away with the entire database and they're hacked all the time.
It only pisses off a very small amount as most people get what they want from the functionality provided. You ever think that maybe the old ways were worse? Sure the people who love customization take a hit but its a small price to pay for the added security.
I'm not going to convince someone that has lived their entire life thinking that freedom is a given when given a new piece of technology but the times have changed.
Fuck that and fuck them. They can't punish people because they screw up and don't move fast enough to fix it like every other company out there. Apple doesn't prosecute jailbreakers, they just update the firmware.
Y'know they're not evil bad guys. As much as you lie to yourself they aren't actively trying to screw you over. They're trying to do what's best for everyone and the people who want stuff like you want are an extreme minority now.
I know you want to think that you're preaching one of the last hopes of a rapidly decaying videogame industry but you're not. You're just someone with another opinion.
If you were trying to run a business with unknown number of hackers always trying to be a step ahead of you and steal your products or ruin your services for their own personal gains what would you do? Keep fighting the same fight until the end of time? Because your solution isn't realistic or efficient.
If you're just going to be stubborn and only think of them as the "evil corporate bastards" then we're done here.
But they are trying to screw everyone over in the days of "profit at all costs", just look at the oppressed communist workers and children they employ to make the devices.
Releasing the code and saying "Oh, I don't intend any wrong." does NOT dismiss him of the wrong he did.
Oh and THE IRONING IS DELICOUS
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootkit_scandal
The Sony BMG CD copy protection scandal concerns the copy protection measures included by Sony BMG on compact discs in 2005. Sony BMG included the Extended Copy Protection (XCP) and MediaMax CD-3 software on music CDs. XCP was put on 52 titles and MediaMax was put on 50 titles. This software was automatically installed on Windows desktop computers when customers tried to play the CDs. The software interferes with the normal way in which the Microsoft Windows operating system plays CDs by installing a rootkit which creates vulnerabilities for other malware to exploit. This was discovered and publicly revealed by Mark Russinovich on the Sysinternals blog.
Sony made a rootkit that left customer computers vulnerable to viruses and malware and they weren't publicly humiliated or scolded by expensive lawyers. They deserve whatever they get and no defense whatsoever from people who have short memories.
Karma's a *****.
Sony screwed up a while back by making a crappy product that put people at risk. Shame on them.
This somehow makes them responsible for other people committing identity fraud?
Besides considering that rootkey just basic "knowledge" isn't true. Just like how all these people's identity's are just "knowledge" right? The rootkey was Sony's not the consumers to use.
Sony makes a rootkit (code) that leaves people vulnerable to hackers and viruses without telling them = No consequences
Customer makes a video that exposes code that will leave Sony's databases vulnerable to hackers and viruses = "KILL THE MESSENGER IN A HAIL OF LAWSUITS AND DON'T CHANGE SECURITY TO PROPERLY PROTECT CUSTOMER DATA!"
They have a really obvious point. So my bank details are just "knowledge" that sony has and it would be perfectly ok to just let someone else know what they are? No, that's apsolute rubbish. Even though you are the anti-sony troll that you are how can you not see that Geo is not in the wrong here? He has provided information to the world that could potentially (and probably did) expose very private and dangerous information of thousands and thousands of people. Wether he should be sued or not isn't even in question here, the fact is he should never have released that informaion. What if it was a bank instead of sony? What if it was your bank? Would you still be holding to your guns then? What if Geo gave your credit/debit card details over to some random stranger, would you still be sticking to your guns about this? I doubt it.
If someone has my bank details (or yours) then they know what they are, knowledge, knowing things, information, data, doesn't make a differance, try acctually reading what I say next time.Nurb said:Your bank details? That isn't knowledge. It's data.Captain Bobbossa said:You are an idiot.Nurb said:No connection?Awexsome said:I don't see a connection.Nurb said:Yes, it does actually. Having and sharing knowledge, even that which can be used for harmful purposes is not illegal and a basic right in a free society covered by the first amendment. Do you have any idea how dangerous it is to punish people for just knowing something? Besides, it's why Jackass can't get shut off the air when copy cat kids kill themselves recreating a stunt. You've got no clue what you're talking about.Awexsome said:The sharing information and convincing other people not to abuse it are completely exclusive to each other. This is the internet we're talking about. You probably trust Sony about as much as they trust you, a random person on the internet. The kind of person that Geo released that code to.Nurb said:I call them "Evil corporate bastards" when they act like it, and they certainly are when they punish a guy for just sharing information, when they convince people they don't have any right to do anything with the device they paid hundreds of dollars for simply because they company says so and has the money to bully people who do learn everything about it and expose problems with it instead of using those resources to protect customer data at the most basic levels. They don't care about the customer, only how much control they have over them.Awexsome said:Of course. Lazy corporate bastards.Nurb said:I'm not giving up dick because some company can't do what every other damn company does and MAKE A PATCH when they discover someone found an exploit. You're a perfect example as how kids are manipulated by these lazy corporate bastards into thinking people need to give up more freedom as technology advances and finding an exploit in the company's hardware is something that needs to be punished.Awexsome said:You ever think things are better now? That they don't give people permission to do whatever they want?Nurb said:Yes. they do. It's a computer, people have a right to look into how their computers work at the code level and talk about it. If they want so much control over people's property, then they can charge less for it or lease it for 10 bucks a month.Awexsome said:
Just because people make viruses for PCs doesn't mean software engineers should be thrown in prison for figuring out and sharing how the window OS works, and you don't see car companies dragging car enthusiasts into court for cracking their car computer to tweak performance.
So yea, Sony isn't special and they're no different than any other hardware manufacturer. Deal with that. Damn kids are being brainwashed into defending some corporate bully who can't even encrypt their customer data. Not even banks let hackers get away with the entire database and they're hacked all the time.
It only pisses off a very small amount as most people get what they want from the functionality provided. You ever think that maybe the old ways were worse? Sure the people who love customization take a hit but its a small price to pay for the added security.
I'm not going to convince someone that has lived their entire life thinking that freedom is a given when given a new piece of technology but the times have changed.
Fuck that and fuck them. They can't punish people because they screw up and don't move fast enough to fix it like every other company out there. Apple doesn't prosecute jailbreakers, they just update the firmware.
Y'know they're not evil bad guys. As much as you lie to yourself they aren't actively trying to screw you over. They're trying to do what's best for everyone and the people who want stuff like you want are an extreme minority now.
I know you want to think that you're preaching one of the last hopes of a rapidly decaying videogame industry but you're not. You're just someone with another opinion.
If you were trying to run a business with unknown number of hackers always trying to be a step ahead of you and steal your products or ruin your services for their own personal gains what would you do? Keep fighting the same fight until the end of time? Because your solution isn't realistic or efficient.
If you're just going to be stubborn and only think of them as the "evil corporate bastards" then we're done here.
But they are trying to screw everyone over in the days of "profit at all costs", just look at the oppressed communist workers and children they employ to make the devices.
Releasing the code and saying "Oh, I don't intend any wrong." does NOT dismiss him of the wrong he did.
Oh and THE IRONING IS DELICOUS
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootkit_scandal
The Sony BMG CD copy protection scandal concerns the copy protection measures included by Sony BMG on compact discs in 2005. Sony BMG included the Extended Copy Protection (XCP) and MediaMax CD-3 software on music CDs. XCP was put on 52 titles and MediaMax was put on 50 titles. This software was automatically installed on Windows desktop computers when customers tried to play the CDs. The software interferes with the normal way in which the Microsoft Windows operating system plays CDs by installing a rootkit which creates vulnerabilities for other malware to exploit. This was discovered and publicly revealed by Mark Russinovich on the Sysinternals blog.
Sony made a rootkit that left customer computers vulnerable to viruses and malware and they weren't publicly humiliated or scolded by expensive lawyers. They deserve whatever they get and no defense whatsoever from people who have short memories.
Karma's a *****.
Sony screwed up a while back by making a crappy product that put people at risk. Shame on them.
This somehow makes them responsible for other people committing identity fraud?
Besides considering that rootkey just basic "knowledge" isn't true. Just like how all these people's identity's are just "knowledge" right? The rootkey was Sony's not the consumers to use.
Sony makes a rootkit (code) that leaves people vulnerable to hackers and viruses without telling them = No consequences
Customer makes a video that exposes code that will leave Sony's databases vulnerable to hackers and viruses = "KILL THE MESSENGER IN A HAIL OF LAWSUITS AND DON'T CHANGE SECURITY TO PROPERLY PROTECT CUSTOMER DATA!"
They have a really obvious point. So my bank details are just "knowledge" that sony has and it would be perfectly ok to just let someone else know what they are? No, that's apsolute rubbish. Even though you are the anti-sony troll that you are how can you not see that Geo is not in the wrong here? He has provided information to the world that could potentially (and probably did) expose very private and dangerous information of thousands and thousands of people. Wether he should be sued or not isn't even in question here, the fact is he should never have released that informaion. What if it was a bank instead of sony? What if it was your bank? Would you still be holding to your guns then? What if Geo gave your credit/debit card details over to some random stranger, would you still be sticking to your guns about this? I doubt it.
Knowing how to hack in and take it is knowledge. Sharing the information to hack banks is legal, but if anyone uses the information to attack a bank, then it's punishable. Besides, banks protect their customer data better than Soney at least.
Like I said, you don't know what you're talking about.
Exposing government corruption that shows they were working with a private security company to blackmail journalists that support wikilieaks isn't redeamable just because some of them do malicious things?Frank_Sinatra_ said:
First of all, I fail to see where bank details came into this at all; it's a bit of a non-sequiter from the post you initially quoted. Second, my response was in regards to you blaming Geohot for this. Why did you quote me, again?Captain Bobbossa said:Owyn_Merrilin said:Again I say, it shouldn't even have been possible for a PS3, even one that had been jailbroken, to access this data. That is why Sony is more to blame than Geohot. He jailbroke the iPhone too, yet the app store is still up...Captain Bobbossa said:You are an idiot.Nurb said:No connection?Awexsome said:I don't see a connection.Nurb said:Yes, it does actually. Having and sharing knowledge, even that which can be used for harmful purposes is not illegal and a basic right in a free society covered by the first amendment. Do you have any idea how dangerous it is to punish people for just knowing something? Besides, it's why Jackass can't get shut off the air when copy cat kids kill themselves recreating a stunt. You've got no clue what you're talking about.Awexsome said:The sharing information and convincing other people not to abuse it are completely exclusive to each other. This is the internet we're talking about. You probably trust Sony about as much as they trust you, a random person on the internet. The kind of person that Geo released that code to.Nurb said:I call them "Evil corporate bastards" when they act like it, and they certainly are when they punish a guy for just sharing information, when they convince people they don't have any right to do anything with the device they paid hundreds of dollars for simply because they company says so and has the money to bully people who do learn everything about it and expose problems with it instead of using those resources to protect customer data at the most basic levels. They don't care about the customer, only how much control they have over them.Awexsome said:Of course. Lazy corporate bastards.Nurb said:I'm not giving up dick because some company can't do what every other damn company does and MAKE A PATCH when they discover someone found an exploit. You're a perfect example as how kids are manipulated by these lazy corporate bastards into thinking people need to give up more freedom as technology advances and finding an exploit in the company's hardware is something that needs to be punished.Awexsome said:You ever think things are better now? That they don't give people permission to do whatever they want?Nurb said:Yes. they do. It's a computer, people have a right to look into how their computers work at the code level and talk about it. If they want so much control over people's property, then they can charge less for it or lease it for 10 bucks a month.Awexsome said:
Just because people make viruses for PCs doesn't mean software engineers should be thrown in prison for figuring out and sharing how the window OS works, and you don't see car companies dragging car enthusiasts into court for cracking their car computer to tweak performance.
So yea, Sony isn't special and they're no different than any other hardware manufacturer. Deal with that. Damn kids are being brainwashed into defending some corporate bully who can't even encrypt their customer data. Not even banks let hackers get away with the entire database and they're hacked all the time.
It only pisses off a very small amount as most people get what they want from the functionality provided. You ever think that maybe the old ways were worse? Sure the people who love customization take a hit but its a small price to pay for the added security.
I'm not going to convince someone that has lived their entire life thinking that freedom is a given when given a new piece of technology but the times have changed.
Fuck that and fuck them. They can't punish people because they screw up and don't move fast enough to fix it like every other company out there. Apple doesn't prosecute jailbreakers, they just update the firmware.
Y'know they're not evil bad guys. As much as you lie to yourself they aren't actively trying to screw you over. They're trying to do what's best for everyone and the people who want stuff like you want are an extreme minority now.
I know you want to think that you're preaching one of the last hopes of a rapidly decaying videogame industry but you're not. You're just someone with another opinion.
If you were trying to run a business with unknown number of hackers always trying to be a step ahead of you and steal your products or ruin your services for their own personal gains what would you do? Keep fighting the same fight until the end of time? Because your solution isn't realistic or efficient.
If you're just going to be stubborn and only think of them as the "evil corporate bastards" then we're done here.
But they are trying to screw everyone over in the days of "profit at all costs", just look at the oppressed communist workers and children they employ to make the devices.
Releasing the code and saying "Oh, I don't intend any wrong." does NOT dismiss him of the wrong he did.
Oh and THE IRONING IS DELICOUS
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootkit_scandal
The Sony BMG CD copy protection scandal concerns the copy protection measures included by Sony BMG on compact discs in 2005. Sony BMG included the Extended Copy Protection (XCP) and MediaMax CD-3 software on music CDs. XCP was put on 52 titles and MediaMax was put on 50 titles. This software was automatically installed on Windows desktop computers when customers tried to play the CDs. The software interferes with the normal way in which the Microsoft Windows operating system plays CDs by installing a rootkit which creates vulnerabilities for other malware to exploit. This was discovered and publicly revealed by Mark Russinovich on the Sysinternals blog.
Sony made a rootkit that left customer computers vulnerable to viruses and malware and they weren't publicly humiliated or scolded by expensive lawyers. They deserve whatever they get and no defense whatsoever from people who have short memories.
Karma's a *****.
Sony screwed up a while back by making a crappy product that put people at risk. Shame on them.
This somehow makes them responsible for other people committing identity fraud?
Besides considering that rootkey just basic "knowledge" isn't true. Just like how all these people's identity's are just "knowledge" right? The rootkey was Sony's not the consumers to use.
Sony makes a rootkit (code) that leaves people vulnerable to hackers and viruses without telling them = No consequences
Customer makes a video that exposes code that will leave Sony's databases vulnerable to hackers and viruses = "KILL THE MESSENGER IN A HAIL OF LAWSUITS AND DON'T CHANGE SECURITY TO PROPERLY PROTECT CUSTOMER DATA!"
They have a really obvious point. So my bank details are just "knowledge" that sony has and it would be perfectly ok to just let someone else know what they are? No, that's apsolute rubbish. Even though you are the anti-sony troll that you are how can you not see that Geo is not in the wrong here? He has provided information to the world that could potentially (and probably did) expose very private and dangerous information of thousands and thousands of people. Wether he should be sued or not isn't even in question here, the fact is he should never have released that informaion. What if it was a bank instead of sony? What if it was your bank? Would you still be holding to your guns then? What if Geo gave your credit/debit card details over to some random stranger, would you still be sticking to your guns about this? I doubt it.If someone has my bank details (or yours) then they know what they are, knowledge, knowing things, information, data, doesn't make a differance, try acctually reading what I say next time.Nurb said:Your bank details? That isn't knowledge. It's data.Captain Bobbossa said:You are an idiot.Nurb said:No connection?Awexsome said:I don't see a connection.Nurb said:Yes, it does actually. Having and sharing knowledge, even that which can be used for harmful purposes is not illegal and a basic right in a free society covered by the first amendment. Do you have any idea how dangerous it is to punish people for just knowing something? Besides, it's why Jackass can't get shut off the air when copy cat kids kill themselves recreating a stunt. You've got no clue what you're talking about.Awexsome said:The sharing information and convincing other people not to abuse it are completely exclusive to each other. This is the internet we're talking about. You probably trust Sony about as much as they trust you, a random person on the internet. The kind of person that Geo released that code to.Nurb said:I call them "Evil corporate bastards" when they act like it, and they certainly are when they punish a guy for just sharing information, when they convince people they don't have any right to do anything with the device they paid hundreds of dollars for simply because they company says so and has the money to bully people who do learn everything about it and expose problems with it instead of using those resources to protect customer data at the most basic levels. They don't care about the customer, only how much control they have over them.Awexsome said:Of course. Lazy corporate bastards.Nurb said:I'm not giving up dick because some company can't do what every other damn company does and MAKE A PATCH when they discover someone found an exploit. You're a perfect example as how kids are manipulated by these lazy corporate bastards into thinking people need to give up more freedom as technology advances and finding an exploit in the company's hardware is something that needs to be punished.Awexsome said:You ever think things are better now? That they don't give people permission to do whatever they want?Nurb said:Yes. they do. It's a computer, people have a right to look into how their computers work at the code level and talk about it. If they want so much control over people's property, then they can charge less for it or lease it for 10 bucks a month.Awexsome said:
Just because people make viruses for PCs doesn't mean software engineers should be thrown in prison for figuring out and sharing how the window OS works, and you don't see car companies dragging car enthusiasts into court for cracking their car computer to tweak performance.
So yea, Sony isn't special and they're no different than any other hardware manufacturer. Deal with that. Damn kids are being brainwashed into defending some corporate bully who can't even encrypt their customer data. Not even banks let hackers get away with the entire database and they're hacked all the time.
It only pisses off a very small amount as most people get what they want from the functionality provided. You ever think that maybe the old ways were worse? Sure the people who love customization take a hit but its a small price to pay for the added security.
I'm not going to convince someone that has lived their entire life thinking that freedom is a given when given a new piece of technology but the times have changed.
Fuck that and fuck them. They can't punish people because they screw up and don't move fast enough to fix it like every other company out there. Apple doesn't prosecute jailbreakers, they just update the firmware.
Y'know they're not evil bad guys. As much as you lie to yourself they aren't actively trying to screw you over. They're trying to do what's best for everyone and the people who want stuff like you want are an extreme minority now.
I know you want to think that you're preaching one of the last hopes of a rapidly decaying videogame industry but you're not. You're just someone with another opinion.
If you were trying to run a business with unknown number of hackers always trying to be a step ahead of you and steal your products or ruin your services for their own personal gains what would you do? Keep fighting the same fight until the end of time? Because your solution isn't realistic or efficient.
If you're just going to be stubborn and only think of them as the "evil corporate bastards" then we're done here.
But they are trying to screw everyone over in the days of "profit at all costs", just look at the oppressed communist workers and children they employ to make the devices.
Releasing the code and saying "Oh, I don't intend any wrong." does NOT dismiss him of the wrong he did.
Oh and THE IRONING IS DELICOUS
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootkit_scandal
The Sony BMG CD copy protection scandal concerns the copy protection measures included by Sony BMG on compact discs in 2005. Sony BMG included the Extended Copy Protection (XCP) and MediaMax CD-3 software on music CDs. XCP was put on 52 titles and MediaMax was put on 50 titles. This software was automatically installed on Windows desktop computers when customers tried to play the CDs. The software interferes with the normal way in which the Microsoft Windows operating system plays CDs by installing a rootkit which creates vulnerabilities for other malware to exploit. This was discovered and publicly revealed by Mark Russinovich on the Sysinternals blog.
Sony made a rootkit that left customer computers vulnerable to viruses and malware and they weren't publicly humiliated or scolded by expensive lawyers. They deserve whatever they get and no defense whatsoever from people who have short memories.
Karma's a *****.
Sony screwed up a while back by making a crappy product that put people at risk. Shame on them.
This somehow makes them responsible for other people committing identity fraud?
Besides considering that rootkey just basic "knowledge" isn't true. Just like how all these people's identity's are just "knowledge" right? The rootkey was Sony's not the consumers to use.
Sony makes a rootkit (code) that leaves people vulnerable to hackers and viruses without telling them = No consequences
Customer makes a video that exposes code that will leave Sony's databases vulnerable to hackers and viruses = "KILL THE MESSENGER IN A HAIL OF LAWSUITS AND DON'T CHANGE SECURITY TO PROPERLY PROTECT CUSTOMER DATA!"
They have a really obvious point. So my bank details are just "knowledge" that sony has and it would be perfectly ok to just let someone else know what they are? No, that's apsolute rubbish. Even though you are the anti-sony troll that you are how can you not see that Geo is not in the wrong here? He has provided information to the world that could potentially (and probably did) expose very private and dangerous information of thousands and thousands of people. Wether he should be sued or not isn't even in question here, the fact is he should never have released that informaion. What if it was a bank instead of sony? What if it was your bank? Would you still be holding to your guns then? What if Geo gave your credit/debit card details over to some random stranger, would you still be sticking to your guns about this? I doubt it.
Knowing how to hack in and take it is knowledge. Sharing the information to hack banks is legal, but if anyone uses the information to attack a bank, then it's punishable. Besides, banks protect their customer data better than Soney at least.
Like I said, you don't know what you're talking about.
See I can get behind that, but something like this is unforgivable.Nurb said:
UGH... yes it does. If they have your data, then they used their knowledge illegally. You're attempt to try and twist this around isn't working.Captain Bobbossa said:Owyn_Merrilin said:Again I say, it shouldn't even have been possible for a PS3, even one that had been jailbroken, to access this data. That is why Sony is more to blame than Geohot. He jailbroke the iPhone too, yet the app store is still up...Captain Bobbossa said:You are an idiot.Nurb said:No connection?Awexsome said:I don't see a connection.Nurb said:Yes, it does actually. Having and sharing knowledge, even that which can be used for harmful purposes is not illegal and a basic right in a free society covered by the first amendment. Do you have any idea how dangerous it is to punish people for just knowing something? Besides, it's why Jackass can't get shut off the air when copy cat kids kill themselves recreating a stunt. You've got no clue what you're talking about.Awexsome said:The sharing information and convincing other people not to abuse it are completely exclusive to each other. This is the internet we're talking about. You probably trust Sony about as much as they trust you, a random person on the internet. The kind of person that Geo released that code to.Nurb said:I call them "Evil corporate bastards" when they act like it, and they certainly are when they punish a guy for just sharing information, when they convince people they don't have any right to do anything with the device they paid hundreds of dollars for simply because they company says so and has the money to bully people who do learn everything about it and expose problems with it instead of using those resources to protect customer data at the most basic levels. They don't care about the customer, only how much control they have over them.Awexsome said:Of course. Lazy corporate bastards.Nurb said:I'm not giving up dick because some company can't do what every other damn company does and MAKE A PATCH when they discover someone found an exploit. You're a perfect example as how kids are manipulated by these lazy corporate bastards into thinking people need to give up more freedom as technology advances and finding an exploit in the company's hardware is something that needs to be punished.Awexsome said:You ever think things are better now? That they don't give people permission to do whatever they want?Nurb said:Yes. they do. It's a computer, people have a right to look into how their computers work at the code level and talk about it. If they want so much control over people's property, then they can charge less for it or lease it for 10 bucks a month.Awexsome said:
Just because people make viruses for PCs doesn't mean software engineers should be thrown in prison for figuring out and sharing how the window OS works, and you don't see car companies dragging car enthusiasts into court for cracking their car computer to tweak performance.
So yea, Sony isn't special and they're no different than any other hardware manufacturer. Deal with that. Damn kids are being brainwashed into defending some corporate bully who can't even encrypt their customer data. Not even banks let hackers get away with the entire database and they're hacked all the time.
It only pisses off a very small amount as most people get what they want from the functionality provided. You ever think that maybe the old ways were worse? Sure the people who love customization take a hit but its a small price to pay for the added security.
I'm not going to convince someone that has lived their entire life thinking that freedom is a given when given a new piece of technology but the times have changed.
Fuck that and fuck them. They can't punish people because they screw up and don't move fast enough to fix it like every other company out there. Apple doesn't prosecute jailbreakers, they just update the firmware.
Y'know they're not evil bad guys. As much as you lie to yourself they aren't actively trying to screw you over. They're trying to do what's best for everyone and the people who want stuff like you want are an extreme minority now.
I know you want to think that you're preaching one of the last hopes of a rapidly decaying videogame industry but you're not. You're just someone with another opinion.
If you were trying to run a business with unknown number of hackers always trying to be a step ahead of you and steal your products or ruin your services for their own personal gains what would you do? Keep fighting the same fight until the end of time? Because your solution isn't realistic or efficient.
If you're just going to be stubborn and only think of them as the "evil corporate bastards" then we're done here.
But they are trying to screw everyone over in the days of "profit at all costs", just look at the oppressed communist workers and children they employ to make the devices.
Releasing the code and saying "Oh, I don't intend any wrong." does NOT dismiss him of the wrong he did.
Oh and THE IRONING IS DELICOUS
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootkit_scandal
The Sony BMG CD copy protection scandal concerns the copy protection measures included by Sony BMG on compact discs in 2005. Sony BMG included the Extended Copy Protection (XCP) and MediaMax CD-3 software on music CDs. XCP was put on 52 titles and MediaMax was put on 50 titles. This software was automatically installed on Windows desktop computers when customers tried to play the CDs. The software interferes with the normal way in which the Microsoft Windows operating system plays CDs by installing a rootkit which creates vulnerabilities for other malware to exploit. This was discovered and publicly revealed by Mark Russinovich on the Sysinternals blog.
Sony made a rootkit that left customer computers vulnerable to viruses and malware and they weren't publicly humiliated or scolded by expensive lawyers. They deserve whatever they get and no defense whatsoever from people who have short memories.
Karma's a *****.
Sony screwed up a while back by making a crappy product that put people at risk. Shame on them.
This somehow makes them responsible for other people committing identity fraud?
Besides considering that rootkey just basic "knowledge" isn't true. Just like how all these people's identity's are just "knowledge" right? The rootkey was Sony's not the consumers to use.
Sony makes a rootkit (code) that leaves people vulnerable to hackers and viruses without telling them = No consequences
Customer makes a video that exposes code that will leave Sony's databases vulnerable to hackers and viruses = "KILL THE MESSENGER IN A HAIL OF LAWSUITS AND DON'T CHANGE SECURITY TO PROPERLY PROTECT CUSTOMER DATA!"
They have a really obvious point. So my bank details are just "knowledge" that sony has and it would be perfectly ok to just let someone else know what they are? No, that's apsolute rubbish. Even though you are the anti-sony troll that you are how can you not see that Geo is not in the wrong here? He has provided information to the world that could potentially (and probably did) expose very private and dangerous information of thousands and thousands of people. Wether he should be sued or not isn't even in question here, the fact is he should never have released that informaion. What if it was a bank instead of sony? What if it was your bank? Would you still be holding to your guns then? What if Geo gave your credit/debit card details over to some random stranger, would you still be sticking to your guns about this? I doubt it.If someone has my bank details (or yours) then they know what they are, knowledge, knowing things, information, data, doesn't make a differance, try acctually reading what I say next time.Nurb said:Your bank details? That isn't knowledge. It's data.Captain Bobbossa said:You are an idiot.Nurb said:No connection?Awexsome said:I don't see a connection.Nurb said:Yes, it does actually. Having and sharing knowledge, even that which can be used for harmful purposes is not illegal and a basic right in a free society covered by the first amendment. Do you have any idea how dangerous it is to punish people for just knowing something? Besides, it's why Jackass can't get shut off the air when copy cat kids kill themselves recreating a stunt. You've got no clue what you're talking about.Awexsome said:The sharing information and convincing other people not to abuse it are completely exclusive to each other. This is the internet we're talking about. You probably trust Sony about as much as they trust you, a random person on the internet. The kind of person that Geo released that code to.Nurb said:I call them "Evil corporate bastards" when they act like it, and they certainly are when they punish a guy for just sharing information, when they convince people they don't have any right to do anything with the device they paid hundreds of dollars for simply because they company says so and has the money to bully people who do learn everything about it and expose problems with it instead of using those resources to protect customer data at the most basic levels. They don't care about the customer, only how much control they have over them.Awexsome said:Of course. Lazy corporate bastards.Nurb said:I'm not giving up dick because some company can't do what every other damn company does and MAKE A PATCH when they discover someone found an exploit. You're a perfect example as how kids are manipulated by these lazy corporate bastards into thinking people need to give up more freedom as technology advances and finding an exploit in the company's hardware is something that needs to be punished.Awexsome said:You ever think things are better now? That they don't give people permission to do whatever they want?Nurb said:Yes. they do. It's a computer, people have a right to look into how their computers work at the code level and talk about it. If they want so much control over people's property, then they can charge less for it or lease it for 10 bucks a month.Awexsome said:
Just because people make viruses for PCs doesn't mean software engineers should be thrown in prison for figuring out and sharing how the window OS works, and you don't see car companies dragging car enthusiasts into court for cracking their car computer to tweak performance.
So yea, Sony isn't special and they're no different than any other hardware manufacturer. Deal with that. Damn kids are being brainwashed into defending some corporate bully who can't even encrypt their customer data. Not even banks let hackers get away with the entire database and they're hacked all the time.
It only pisses off a very small amount as most people get what they want from the functionality provided. You ever think that maybe the old ways were worse? Sure the people who love customization take a hit but its a small price to pay for the added security.
I'm not going to convince someone that has lived their entire life thinking that freedom is a given when given a new piece of technology but the times have changed.
Fuck that and fuck them. They can't punish people because they screw up and don't move fast enough to fix it like every other company out there. Apple doesn't prosecute jailbreakers, they just update the firmware.
Y'know they're not evil bad guys. As much as you lie to yourself they aren't actively trying to screw you over. They're trying to do what's best for everyone and the people who want stuff like you want are an extreme minority now.
I know you want to think that you're preaching one of the last hopes of a rapidly decaying videogame industry but you're not. You're just someone with another opinion.
If you were trying to run a business with unknown number of hackers always trying to be a step ahead of you and steal your products or ruin your services for their own personal gains what would you do? Keep fighting the same fight until the end of time? Because your solution isn't realistic or efficient.
If you're just going to be stubborn and only think of them as the "evil corporate bastards" then we're done here.
But they are trying to screw everyone over in the days of "profit at all costs", just look at the oppressed communist workers and children they employ to make the devices.
Releasing the code and saying "Oh, I don't intend any wrong." does NOT dismiss him of the wrong he did.
Oh and THE IRONING IS DELICOUS
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootkit_scandal
The Sony BMG CD copy protection scandal concerns the copy protection measures included by Sony BMG on compact discs in 2005. Sony BMG included the Extended Copy Protection (XCP) and MediaMax CD-3 software on music CDs. XCP was put on 52 titles and MediaMax was put on 50 titles. This software was automatically installed on Windows desktop computers when customers tried to play the CDs. The software interferes with the normal way in which the Microsoft Windows operating system plays CDs by installing a rootkit which creates vulnerabilities for other malware to exploit. This was discovered and publicly revealed by Mark Russinovich on the Sysinternals blog.
Sony made a rootkit that left customer computers vulnerable to viruses and malware and they weren't publicly humiliated or scolded by expensive lawyers. They deserve whatever they get and no defense whatsoever from people who have short memories.
Karma's a *****.
Sony screwed up a while back by making a crappy product that put people at risk. Shame on them.
This somehow makes them responsible for other people committing identity fraud?
Besides considering that rootkey just basic "knowledge" isn't true. Just like how all these people's identity's are just "knowledge" right? The rootkey was Sony's not the consumers to use.
Sony makes a rootkit (code) that leaves people vulnerable to hackers and viruses without telling them = No consequences
Customer makes a video that exposes code that will leave Sony's databases vulnerable to hackers and viruses = "KILL THE MESSENGER IN A HAIL OF LAWSUITS AND DON'T CHANGE SECURITY TO PROPERLY PROTECT CUSTOMER DATA!"
They have a really obvious point. So my bank details are just "knowledge" that sony has and it would be perfectly ok to just let someone else know what they are? No, that's apsolute rubbish. Even though you are the anti-sony troll that you are how can you not see that Geo is not in the wrong here? He has provided information to the world that could potentially (and probably did) expose very private and dangerous information of thousands and thousands of people. Wether he should be sued or not isn't even in question here, the fact is he should never have released that informaion. What if it was a bank instead of sony? What if it was your bank? Would you still be holding to your guns then? What if Geo gave your credit/debit card details over to some random stranger, would you still be sticking to your guns about this? I doubt it.
Knowing how to hack in and take it is knowledge. Sharing the information to hack banks is legal, but if anyone uses the information to attack a bank, then it's punishable. Besides, banks protect their customer data better than Soney at least.
Like I said, you don't know what you're talking about.
You're telling him he doesn't know what he's talking about when the words you're saying are absolutely ludicrous!Nurb said:
Then explain your wildlife that runs rampant.MattAn24 said:
