Sorry to burst your bubble on this one but there is no serious climatologist who rejects anthropomorphic climate change. I'm not exaggerating, not a single one. The idea that man-made climate change is controversial in the scientific community is complete misinformation. As a 'theory' it is no more controversial that the theory of evolution or theory of gravitation.JackSparrowSucks said:
The Big Picture: Conspiracy Weary
- Thread starter MovieBob
- Start date
Long time listener, first time poster.
I like your stuff Bob. This episodes especially, as I've had more than my fair share of conspiracy-battles with crazed loons in my life. One thing I gotta speak up on here though...
After you stole my heart by writing off all the conspiracy crap about oil, the war, etr. You turn around and support the biggest conspiracy of all - Global Warming!
So here's a question for you Bob - What do you think is more likely:
-A bunch of 'evil' conservatives trying to convince the world that there is no future threat to an ozone that's lasted thousands and thousands of years enduring all kinds of emisions (such as those from volcanos which is a million times more harmful and toxic than man could ever produce) JUST so the can save money for what REALLY matters.
OR
- A group of loons intended on creating another 'doomsday theory' just like Y2K, 2012 meltdown etr.
I like your stuff Bob. This episodes especially, as I've had more than my fair share of conspiracy-battles with crazed loons in my life. One thing I gotta speak up on here though...
After you stole my heart by writing off all the conspiracy crap about oil, the war, etr. You turn around and support the biggest conspiracy of all - Global Warming!
So here's a question for you Bob - What do you think is more likely:
-A bunch of 'evil' conservatives trying to convince the world that there is no future threat to an ozone that's lasted thousands and thousands of years enduring all kinds of emisions (such as those from volcanos which is a million times more harmful and toxic than man could ever produce) JUST so the can save money for what REALLY matters.
OR
- A group of loons intended on creating another 'doomsday theory' just like Y2K, 2012 meltdown etr.
Conspiracies are a very real thing, in this context.
(from the dictionary)
Law. an agreement by two or more persons to commit a crime, fraud, or other wrongful act.
Yeah that happens all the time, its just far more petty then the grandiose Illuminati garbage stoners keep rambling on about. Basically a conspiracy is any kind of multi person crime plan. Technically a gang running a cocaine dealing/smuggling ring in a small neighborhood is a conspiracy.
However, large big scary conspiracies have existed in the past. The most famous of them all is of course the rise of the 3rd Reich. Another the assassination of Julius Caesar,
History is full of questionable ones however, the assassination of the Arch Duke Ferdinand is the best I can think of. Was it just a random hate crime, or was there more to it? We will never know of course. Likely a random hate crime, but the events fallowing were catastrophic.
The is issue is that these are huge moments in history that will never be forgotten, are very rare, and the purposes are usually very obvious, and never include secret groups or organizations.
(from the dictionary)
Law. an agreement by two or more persons to commit a crime, fraud, or other wrongful act.
Yeah that happens all the time, its just far more petty then the grandiose Illuminati garbage stoners keep rambling on about. Basically a conspiracy is any kind of multi person crime plan. Technically a gang running a cocaine dealing/smuggling ring in a small neighborhood is a conspiracy.
However, large big scary conspiracies have existed in the past. The most famous of them all is of course the rise of the 3rd Reich. Another the assassination of Julius Caesar,
History is full of questionable ones however, the assassination of the Arch Duke Ferdinand is the best I can think of. Was it just a random hate crime, or was there more to it? We will never know of course. Likely a random hate crime, but the events fallowing were catastrophic.
The is issue is that these are huge moments in history that will never be forgotten, are very rare, and the purposes are usually very obvious, and never include secret groups or organizations.
Relatively long post; general gist: MoviBob, what they hell are you thinking these days? I thought you were smart.
Insightful? Are you joking? I'm starting to think this opinion show should never be watched by anyone because the opinions are logically flawed while also accusing other opinions of being logically flawed.
Random? Everything? Not saying anything about Goddies or Atheists, I think the organization of subatomic material into positively and negatively charged particles which then create a hierarchy of this thing we call existence isn't very chaotic...in fact, it's the very opposite of chaos. The way those particles may assemble themselves after the fact may be seemingly or actually random, but seeing as the mechanics that define such combinations and then go on to define secondary and tertiary combinations are very simple and consistent, I would have to say the polar nature of existence is, in fact, extremely ordered.
And no conspiracies? Yeah, Oswald probably killed JFK alone, we did land on the moon, the Obama birth certificate scandal was proven to be a hoax, the tsunami wasn't cause by underwater nuclear testing, and the twin towers were not hit by drones. That doesn't mean there aren't any conspiracies.
Is Cheney the evil mastermind of an occult organization bent on world domination? I doubt it...but he IS getting extraordinarily rich off of watching the military industrial complex slowly dominate the world. Did Hussein really have WMD's? I doubt it...but a large group of military intelligence specialists did produce a bogus report saying that he DID, all for the purpose of convincing an idiot to invade a country that was actually our economic friend. Was the hyperbubble collapse of aught 8 intentional? I doubt it...but the masterminds of wall street certainly came out on top of the whole deal, didn't they (and now the know they CAN get away with whatever they want)?
When Ford deliberately refuses to recall the '95 Explorer to replace the tires which are blowing out and killing idiot drivers--I mean, women drivers---I mean, less experienced drivers---because getting sued for wrongful death will cost less than a country wide recall...that's a conspiracy. When Bechtel seizes the water that falls from the sky over Cochabomba in order to render it's hydraulic despotism concrete and the government back their play...that's a conspiracy. When the PATRIOT ACT is deliberately titled as an acronym that would make someone appear unpatriotic for opposing it and it is then dropped off over night with a vote on it called after the hill doors open the next morning, leaving absolutely no time to read the multiple-hundred-page bloated proposition and see what collateral log rolling will occur after the fact...that's a conspiracy. When the jackass at Whataburger gives me a little "secret sauce" and the cook slides me a little "extra meat," that's a conspiracy. There are legitimate conspiracies everywhere.
Bob, you've got to stop your arguments half-way through...by that, I mean that you need to carry your syllogisms through to their completion before spouting a bunch of left-centrist nonsense. Yes, I said left-centrist nonsense, because when you take a look at it, that's all it is. I'm right on some things, I'm left on others, but most of my choices come from thoughtful conclusions made against known factors of logical fallacies. For example, I don't agree with abortion, but I still think the woman has a right to have one...If any of you want to have that conversation, you can pm me, but I guarantee you it is made on a host of logical conclusions. Lately, however, you haven't been doing the final 200 meters, Bob.
Perhaps the biggest lapse of logic in this ep? Telling viewers to calm down because it's an "opinion show," and then spending the rest of the episode using your personal opinion to bash them and theirs over the head for being so stupid. Why is it their opinion is so wrong and dangerous, and yours isn't? A little bit difficult to sit in judgement over the thoughts of others when, everything in the universe being random and chaotic and having no meaning, their thoughts really don't amount for shit.
Insightful? Are you joking? I'm starting to think this opinion show should never be watched by anyone because the opinions are logically flawed while also accusing other opinions of being logically flawed.
Random? Everything? Not saying anything about Goddies or Atheists, I think the organization of subatomic material into positively and negatively charged particles which then create a hierarchy of this thing we call existence isn't very chaotic...in fact, it's the very opposite of chaos. The way those particles may assemble themselves after the fact may be seemingly or actually random, but seeing as the mechanics that define such combinations and then go on to define secondary and tertiary combinations are very simple and consistent, I would have to say the polar nature of existence is, in fact, extremely ordered.
And no conspiracies? Yeah, Oswald probably killed JFK alone, we did land on the moon, the Obama birth certificate scandal was proven to be a hoax, the tsunami wasn't cause by underwater nuclear testing, and the twin towers were not hit by drones. That doesn't mean there aren't any conspiracies.
Is Cheney the evil mastermind of an occult organization bent on world domination? I doubt it...but he IS getting extraordinarily rich off of watching the military industrial complex slowly dominate the world. Did Hussein really have WMD's? I doubt it...but a large group of military intelligence specialists did produce a bogus report saying that he DID, all for the purpose of convincing an idiot to invade a country that was actually our economic friend. Was the hyperbubble collapse of aught 8 intentional? I doubt it...but the masterminds of wall street certainly came out on top of the whole deal, didn't they (and now the know they CAN get away with whatever they want)?
When Ford deliberately refuses to recall the '95 Explorer to replace the tires which are blowing out and killing idiot drivers--I mean, women drivers---I mean, less experienced drivers---because getting sued for wrongful death will cost less than a country wide recall...that's a conspiracy. When Bechtel seizes the water that falls from the sky over Cochabomba in order to render it's hydraulic despotism concrete and the government back their play...that's a conspiracy. When the PATRIOT ACT is deliberately titled as an acronym that would make someone appear unpatriotic for opposing it and it is then dropped off over night with a vote on it called after the hill doors open the next morning, leaving absolutely no time to read the multiple-hundred-page bloated proposition and see what collateral log rolling will occur after the fact...that's a conspiracy. When the jackass at Whataburger gives me a little "secret sauce" and the cook slides me a little "extra meat," that's a conspiracy. There are legitimate conspiracies everywhere.
Bob, you've got to stop your arguments half-way through...by that, I mean that you need to carry your syllogisms through to their completion before spouting a bunch of left-centrist nonsense. Yes, I said left-centrist nonsense, because when you take a look at it, that's all it is. I'm right on some things, I'm left on others, but most of my choices come from thoughtful conclusions made against known factors of logical fallacies. For example, I don't agree with abortion, but I still think the woman has a right to have one...If any of you want to have that conversation, you can pm me, but I guarantee you it is made on a host of logical conclusions. Lately, however, you haven't been doing the final 200 meters, Bob.
Perhaps the biggest lapse of logic in this ep? Telling viewers to calm down because it's an "opinion show," and then spending the rest of the episode using your personal opinion to bash them and theirs over the head for being so stupid. Why is it their opinion is so wrong and dangerous, and yours isn't? A little bit difficult to sit in judgement over the thoughts of others when, everything in the universe being random and chaotic and having no meaning, their thoughts really don't amount for shit.
Cursed Frogurt said:
If only what you said was true. A lot of people still say global wamring is just a government cover up, for either Chinese or Japanese cars. I also heard one that gays were behind global warming cause on account of how much sex they have.
Ignorant, uneducated opinion. Global warming is happening. We don't have much to do with it. Nothing we can do and ESPECIALLY nothing we do, helps. As for how much profits ecobussiness generates, take a head out of your ass for a second and take a minute to browse EU CO2 limits for countries and how everyone has to pay for CO2 they are emiting (apart from Iceland I guess as this little volcano used up their CO2 limit for the next 100 years, dayum shame). And then look where all this money are going. We should be spending money preparing to deal with consequences of global warming instead of limiting our 0.0001% global CO2 share. There really is no evidence to prove that we are the couse of this and by now such ignorance makes me rage, because as I ask for evidence of our involvment, it turns out people don't know shit. Only person able to disscuss it with me was a greenpeace man giving out info to people passing by. And even he after 5 min told me he just works here and really agrees with me...arbane said:
As for JFK... dunno, evidence seem to be compelling, especially that he annoyed the hell out of enough people to get himself killed, and there is a lot of little details I'm not gonna bore anyone with.
This.Serenegoose said:
If one were to put Bobs argument rather formally, it would go something like this:
1) We believe in conspiracy theories because they make the world appear more ordered and manageable.
2) Most (possibly 'all', but I'll be generous) conspiracy theories break down when analyzed logically.
3) Most (All?) conspiracy theories are therefore false.
It doesn't quite work. Some are more plausible than others. People are also certainly capable of starting conspiracies as well (this is why we have anti-trust laws, and why 'conspiracy' is a class of crime).
JFK and the moon landing are the typical examples. There's logic behind each of them though, and you don't have to believe in a shadow government or the illuminati to believe in them. We could have faked the moon landing for pure propaganda purposes. We WERE in a cold war arms race after all. In fact, what seems like the more fantastic feat? That people staged something in Hollywood, or that people actually traveled to the moon?
What's even funnier is that the same argument could be made about religious miracles. What's more improbable, that thousands of people all decided to lie about something in a giant, unorganized conspiracy, or that the laws of nature were actually violated. My instincts are that Bob would lie on the other side of that argument (which I am merely putting out there for rhetorical purposes, and am not myself advocating, mind you).
Sorry Bob, the dragons already got me. Guess I'll to meet your troopers in glorious combat.
Seriously though. There are people in my town that genuinely think Barrack Obama will become the next Adolf Hitler.
No, really. That's their specific message.
I'll just let that one speak for itself.
Seriously though. There are people in my town that genuinely think Barrack Obama will become the next Adolf Hitler.
No, really. That's their specific message.
I'll just let that one speak for itself.
Ha! The ending was perfect!
Made some nice points there. I've always hated when people tell me about their conspiracy theories.
Made some nice points there. I've always hated when people tell me about their conspiracy theories.
Remember the medieval warming trend? it had quite the carbon dioxide spike. Indeed, almost 1/5 of that which humans have created within the past couple of centuries.JackSparrowSucks said:
Some bits of information:
This warming isn't simply warming. It's an average increase, but it also means that temperatures vary more.
The amount of time in which the greenhouse gas levels have increased is not enough time to show significant increase. And europe is in danger of entering another ice age (something that hasn't happened in tens of thousands of years, in a significant warming trend). It will be several centuries before the carbon dioxide levels return to normal.
The northwest passage, in this time, has become almost entirely open during the summer. Things don't happen this fast (indeed, proven) unless a significant environmental shock has occurred, say, a carbon dioxide spike virtually unheard of in the planet's history.
We are putting things in the atmosphere that haven't been there in millennia.
I don't have references at the moment (as it would take a while to get them), but if you want some they can be retrieved fairly quickly.
I also have a simple experiment based on reason and logic that can be attempted fairly easily.
Supplies:
3 large jars (or multiples thereof) of equal size
wine taps (used for the production of homebrew liquor) of equal number to the jars.
Putty or other malleable sealant
heat lamps of equal number to the jars
Thermometers of equal numbers to the jars
dry ice
tape a thermometer inside each jar
cut holes in the jar lids, place wine taps inside and seal with putty.
Separate the jars into three equal groups.
Close the lids on the first group, leave the jars empty.
Place 1% of each jar's holding volume in dry ice in each jar of the second group. close the lids tightly.
Place 2% of each jar's holding volume in dry ice in each jar of the third group. close the lids tightly.
Place a heat lamp 5 inches from each jar and aim it towards the jar and turn them on.
Record the temperature inside each jar every 5 minutes for 1 hour.
Turn off the heat lamps.
Record the temperature inside each jar every 5 minutes for 1 hour.
Results I obtained: Dry ice is frozen carbon dioxide, jars with 1% dry ice in them were consistently several degrees warmer and even more so in the 2% jars than in the normal jars at the warming peak. They also cooled down much more slowly. Higher than normal carbon dioxide levels trap more heat.
Deductive reasoning: if minute levels of carbon dioxide can increase heat this much on a small scale, how is the earth affected on a large scale.
But that was really off-topic.
Really enjoyed the video. Another good one, Bob.
EDIT: just looking back... that was one hell of a lot longer than intended. Sorry.
The Romanian Witch story is very interesting. The main advocate claimed the regulatory laws for magical practice and fortune telling were regected because politicians feared being cursed. Which is pretty funny. THe truth is it was rejected because requiring what is a moslty an underground market to keep receipts for tax purposes. It would also recquire them to stand behind their predictions and promises. Which is silly we don't force horoscope writters to stand behind their predictions, hell we don't force Jim Cramer to stadn behind his predictions.
Still you got to love a witch tax. Goes well with the Romanian Vampire Industry.
Still you got to love a witch tax. Goes well with the Romanian Vampire Industry.
Actually one of the greatest courses I took in university was all about modern religious movements. One section was about alien/UFO religions in general and the Church of the SubGenius was featured prominently. However, my personal favourite is the Raëlian Church, started by a French sports-car journalist who met aliens (Elohim) in the 70s.arbane said:
Nice Vid and I Love the Icke I read up on him and von Daniken for a paper last year. However the Iraq war theory of yours posits only two ideas and neither of them works.
The Idea that Saddam could fool the CIA is silly mainly because he would not want to. The invasion was based on the premise he had WMDs and the lack of UN backing was because they had no proof. No one in Iraq except his enemies would want the world to think he had weapons there. He even opened his doors to the UN to look for them which he wouldn't do if he was a posturing gangster.
It is known now that the information Given to Colin Powell was false and the CIA knew it was false. The only one who didn't know it was false was Powell who just said what he was told to say. We also have come to learn that Bush was kept in the dark about almost everything suggestign Cheney (Who declared himself no subject to the constitution and removed his house from google maps) was actually in charge.
As for why the Invasion took place? I don't know. No explanation makes sense. They all sound stupid or unrealistic. It may have been just another jingoistic pointless venture like the war of 1812 or the Spanish American War. Maybe we will find out in thirty years.
P.S. Not scared of the Reptillians Canada is too cold for lizards.
The Idea that Saddam could fool the CIA is silly mainly because he would not want to. The invasion was based on the premise he had WMDs and the lack of UN backing was because they had no proof. No one in Iraq except his enemies would want the world to think he had weapons there. He even opened his doors to the UN to look for them which he wouldn't do if he was a posturing gangster.
It is known now that the information Given to Colin Powell was false and the CIA knew it was false. The only one who didn't know it was false was Powell who just said what he was told to say. We also have come to learn that Bush was kept in the dark about almost everything suggestign Cheney (Who declared himself no subject to the constitution and removed his house from google maps) was actually in charge.
As for why the Invasion took place? I don't know. No explanation makes sense. They all sound stupid or unrealistic. It may have been just another jingoistic pointless venture like the war of 1812 or the Spanish American War. Maybe we will find out in thirty years.
P.S. Not scared of the Reptillians Canada is too cold for lizards.
Global warming IS real... as is global cooling, it's a cycle.
Global warming being a threat to the existence of mankind... that's the part that is a joke.
Global warming being a threat to the existence of mankind... that's the part that is a joke.