The Big Picture: Wunderpants - Wonder Woman's New Clothes

[RandV80]

Kind of funny that Bob uses a picture of Slayers for his cartoon/anime example. A lot of irony here, because the character 'Naga' first appeared in 1995, and was definately not intended as sexy fanservice. She was intentionally over the top, annoying, and had whats best described as 'gag boobs'. She was basically a comic sidekick designed to annoy Lina, the lead character. Yet I'm not sure exactly when this happened, but I say it's ironic because fast forward to todays anime/manga and somehow Naga's 'gag boobs' became the de facto standard for sexy fanservice. How the hell did that happen?

 

[Seracen]

I liked thejacket as well. I liked that whole costume.

Agreed. The pants actually look kind of lame without the jacket, in my eyes.

I always preferred the skirt, like the style her "Evil" version wore in Injustice (Roman legionnaire style skirt). This works even more so in live action. As much as people like for heroes to look like they do in comics, some things work, some things don't.

I just can't see a one-piece bikini look as working in any sort of dramatic and serious context in live action. I think Linda Carter's WW would have looked better with a skirt in addition to her onsie. I also think that Adrianne Palicki's WW would have benefited from a jacket to match her pants.

Additionally, it would have helped to add an illusion of bulk, as WW isn't supposed to be a damn stick figure.

 

[bladeofdarkness]

extremely minor point : its pronounced ga-dot, not gado.

 

[Hagi]

Just wondering, does anyone else here think she looks more sexualized with pants than without?

Without pants, especially in a live-action movie, everything tends to look just a bit more saggy, less tight, less round etc. than things do with pants, at least the skin-tight ones shown in those images, where certain parts get propped up, supported and overall appear more idealized than reality will ever be.

At least that's how my male gaze sees it. The actual naked female body I find extremely humanizing exactly because of all the things that aren't perfect. While in skin-tight outfits all those very human imperfections tend to get worked away through careful sewing.

That's not to say any of that truly matters in the face of characterization, I fully agree with the video on that part. But I do find it somewhat curious that the skin-tight pants seen in those images could be regarded as less sexualized, I personally find those to be more so.

 

[Zombie Badger]

Why is DC and WB so desperate to make a live action movie? Does a movie having a bloated budget and with live grossly overpayed actors add some sort of legitimacy more than a animated movie?

They're desperately trying to copy both The Avengers and The Dark Knight trilogy in the hopes of repeating their success. Honestly I think DC's film being animated would be a good way to make it distinctive as its own thing.

 

[DementedSheep]

Hey I actually like that jacket. It doesn't look very wonder womeny mind you but I do like that costume.

I don't know that america stars underwear is going to look good in live action. You can get away with more stuff when its drawn but if put in live action it will likely look absurd. Especially if you going to be putting her next to the new movie superman and batman.

I'm not a huge fan of WW but I have read some of it and seen her in crossovers so my opinions probably not valid but Wonder woman's lack of pants never really bothered me*. Personally I think that shouldn't give her pants, that seems like just the 'go to' solution that doesn't have a lot to do with the character. I think they should play up the Greek armour aspect and give her a skirt inspired by that if they want to get rid of the underwear.

Spoiler

*depending on how it's drawn, poses, panel focus, what the character is acting like ect. Same with anything. You can be covered from the neck down and still be very very sexualized. You could sexualize a burka if you really wanted to.

 

[SeeDarkly_Xero]

Quick guide to being progressive:

Wonder Woman goes from bare legs to trousers = progressive way to make a character less sexualised, even if nothing else changes.

Robin goes from bare legs to trousers = no change to the character, no one thinks dressing differently will change this character.

So it seems that what a woman wears is part of her character.

Actually, I somewhat disagree. The Boy Wonder shifting to pants made him a far more believable character... because he is mortal in a way the Wonder Woman is not.
Him running around in clothes that made it not just likely but inevitable that he would suffer numerous avoidable injuries always made him a bit laughable as a realistic concept, despite how likable he was as a character otherwise.

Wonder Woman? Well it takes a little more to damage her so what she wears for that practicality becomes less relevant, but her clothing isn't the singular element "sexualizing" her and plenty of fully dressed female characters are "sexualized" as well.

 

[Trishbot]

So, let me get this straight...

This is a movie directed by the guy who made Sucker Punch, written by the guy who thinks She-Hulk is just a giant green porn star for the Hulk to bang, with consultation by the guy responsible for "sperm bank" Wonder Woman and Sin City, starring a super-skinny supermodel with very limited acting experience best known for looking "sexy" for a few scenes of the last Fast & Furious movie.

... Good lord. All we need is some Mark Millar tossed in there and we'll hit the sexist bingo.

 

[rbstewart7263]

Bob finally says all the things ive been thinking for a while now! Yes making the women "cover up" is just an extension of patriarchial social values from the old days and is just as oppressive by feminists as overly sexualizing the woman.

Wonderwoman in her current form is not oversexualized and I hope they match her for what she is like somewhat in the comics. someone with depth and character regardless of what she wears.

 

[SeeDarkly_Xero]

Unless Robin's trousers are made of stab proof kevlar they're not going to protect him from anything other than scraped knees.

Kind of the point. It's why you don't, say, dress a female baseball league in skirts... except that happened too didn't it.
Again though... would they choose to dress that way if they had impenetrable skin resistant to "sliding into base?"
Wonder Woman has that, so as a choice, she's free to dress how she likes without that consideration.

(We all know that is and has always been a creator choice more than a character choice. I'm not pretending otherwise. Simply acknowledging the perspective with regards to issues of practicality.)

 

[CelestDaer]

So, Bob sounds a little sick this week...? Or was that just me...?
Also, why the everloving hell does Escapist do those pop up windows to frame videos? I can't close them once they're open without reloading the page.

 

[Kerethos]

Let's face it those star patterned hot pants(?) she wears as a cartoon, like batman and superman's "underwear on pants"-thing, doesn't look good IRL. It makes it look like they put the costume on in the wrong order.

The best rendition of Wonder Woman I've seen so far is this:

Spoiler

It's light/medium armor that looks like functional armor. Make the eagle stand out a bit more, and slim the armor down a little, and you could probably be rid of the "boobplate" and make the armor fully functional, and without a fatal[footnote]As most people should know a "boobplate" would kill you if it took a hit, due to focusing the full force of the blow onto your sternum - shattering it and filling your lungs and heart with bone shards, or resulting in a crushed rib cage. And armor is not a stiff cat suit, no matter what fantasy art says, and the actor/combatant needs to be able to move.[/footnote] flaw.

And more importantly she looks like the seasoned brawler/warrior she's supposed to be - all without wearing pants or a jacket. She can even keep the star patterned hot pants.

And, from a movie standpoint, it'd make it easier to make her look stronger and more muscular than the actor playing her.

 

[AgDr_ODST]

I really don't mind Wonder Woman's jacket and pants attire...I do like her traditional attire as much if not far more so than if the jacket that Bob and other fans are bemoaning so much. I just want Gadot in her portrayal to kick ass and prove all the whining naysayers[footnote]who are still bitching about Gina Carano or Jamie Alexander getting the role, whilst continually forgetting that Gadot served in the Israeli military[/footnote] wrong regardless of what her costume looks like.

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

Spoiler

It's light/medium armor that looks like functional armor. Make the eagle stand out a bit more, and slim the armor down a little, and you could probably be rid of the "boobplate" and make the armor fully functional, and without a fatal flaw.

And more importantly she looks like the seasoned brawler/warrior she's supposed to be - all without wearing pants or a jacket. She can even keep the star patterned hot pants.

And, from a movie standpoint, it'd make it easier to make her look stronger and more muscular than the actor playing her.

Now that's a great Wonder Woman outfit. Maybe tone down the gaudy eagles on the shins and shoulders, fix the breastplate and slim the armor down a bit like you mentioned, and it's pretty much perfect imo.

 

[StriderShinryu]

I like the outfit with the jacket and have always found Wonder Woman's original outfit to be silly looking (and not in a good Captain America silly way).

I have less to say about her outfit as the woman playing her. Gal Godat just isn't a charismatic or skilled actor and her build is way too skinny.

I agree completely, well about Gadot's build anyway. I haven't seen her on film enough to say yes or no to her acting. I liked her in Fast and Furious and found she fit that role well, but it didn't really seem to ask much of her. I still think that, physically, Gina Carano would have been perfect for Wonder Woman.

 

[teamcharlie]

This was a great episode with a very well-thought-out discussion on the topic.

All cards on the table: I'm in favor of as much sex and violence as is humanly possible in my movies. If there was some way to make The Avengers with legitimate actors, great writing, a huge budget, amazing special effects and also make it a full-on hardcore porno with Toxic Avenger-level gore, I would be 100000% down.

But you pick your battles. For me, I care far less about what Wonder Woman is wearing than about
a) how good the movie is
b) the fact that there should by this point be a legitimate superhero movie starring a woman in which she is not subordinated to some man (or some woman). Where that woman has actual agency, thoughts, feelings, desires, even just the most lines, and has a character that exists beyond some stereotypical masculine fantasy (that probably doesn't really correspond to many mens' fantasies anyway).

The audience is clearly there (Jesus, they sat through The Heat, Bridesmaids and [I didn't see it but it sounds not-good] Maleficent). Just do it, make the money, and deal with the fact that misogyny doesn't make good business sense anymore.

 

[DementedSheep]

Let's face it those star patterned hot pants(?) she wears as a cartoon, like batman and superman's "underwear on pants"-thing, doesn't look good IRL. It makes it look like they put the costume on in the wrong order.

The best rendition of Wonder Woman I've seen so far is this:

Spoiler

It's light/medium armor that looks like functional armor. Make the eagle stand out a bit more, and slim the armor down a little, and you could probably be rid of the "boobplate" and make the armor fully functional, and without a fatal[footnote]As most people should know a "boobplate" would kill you if it took a hit, due to focusing the full force of the blow onto your sternum - shattering it and filling your lungs and heart with bone shards, or resulting in a crushed rib cage. And armor is not a stiff cat suit, no matter what fantasy art says, and the actor/combatant needs to be able to move.[/footnote] flaw.

And more importantly she looks like the seasoned brawler/warrior she's supposed to be - all without wearing pants or a jacket. She can even keep the star patterned hot pants.

And, from a movie standpoint, it'd make it easier to make her look stronger and more muscular than the actor playing her.

I really like that one (minus the eagle shoulders) but I think its a bit far removed from her 'iconic' look and complicated for a movie. Maybe...
That artists dose a lot of awesome redesigns.

 

[LobsterFeng]

It's been said but yes I quite like the jacket pants look. The costume on the live action tv show Wonder Woman makes me cringe.