The Half-Naked Elf Problem

Agiel7

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Perhaps it speaks to how prudish the gaming community is when it comes to matters of sexuality that a fantasy game that happens to have skimpy outfits is somehow more objectionable than games like GTA or Serious Sam that encourage mass genocide in the game world.

I'd be the last person to impose my aesthetic sensibilities on somebody else, but the guys who like to pretend that they have the moral and intellectual superiority to decry the people who play this game because of the art style really reek of hypocrites to me; They demand practical armours and believable combat when Serious Sam goes to work in undershirt and slaughters masses of enemies with a gatling from an A-10C Thunderbolt II.

Not your thing? Fair enough, but don't be that quick to judge the guys who think the art-style is their cup of tea.
 

Kahunaburger

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animehermit said:
Kahunaburger said:
Ashannon Blackthorn said:
I have an issue with this whole thread... even getting off the original topic of female over sexualization in video games.

Kahunaburger is the lead one for this, I showed this thread and his comments ot my Korean room mate who is a quiet 22 year old female exchange student. All she could say is why is he so racist toward my culture?

And Kuhuna and other like him(her?) are. Korean culture is not American. They have much different views on what is acceptable sexually then Americans do. (to a lesser extent Canadians and Europeans but Americans tend to go right off the prude scale quite easily)
Sounds like your alleged roommate is a little over-sensitive, there. I highly doubt that this sort of pedo crap is mainstream in Korea. Disliking sexual abuse of minors and imagery that evokes sexual abuse of minors isn't being a "prude," it's being a decent human being. That's true regardless of where you're from.
I disagree with a lot of what you have to say most of the time, but I agree here, this is pretty unacceptable. It shocks me more than a little that they would even consider releasing this game here. Ultimately this kind of thing can only hurt the game's sales potential, as soon as people see the loli characters, it's gonna be a no-buy.
Yeah, it's bizarre on multiple levels.

I'm honestly mostly shocked at how many people are crawling out of the woodwork to defend this stuff. I mean, we at the Escapist may disagree about things like the Mass Effect 3 ending, the state of modern RPGs, and whether games are art or not, but I'm dumbfounded that we can't all agree that sexualized portrayals of children are bad.
 

Kahunaburger

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animehermit said:
Kahunaburger said:
Yeah, it's bizarre on multiple levels.

I'm honestly mostly shocked at how many people are crawling out of the woodwork to defend this stuff. I mean, we at the Escapist may disagree about things like the Mass Effect 3 ending, the state of modern RPGs, and whether games are art or not, but I'm dumbfounded that we can't all agree that sexualized portrayals of children are bad.
It's not-so-much women I have the big issue with, it's children, or characters that are meant to appear as children. Sexuality can and should be used, but only in the right context and with maturity.
Yeah - while I think that objectification is a thing that exists and that shouldn't, I think that sexualization of adult characters is much less of a clear-cut issue (and one on which reasonable people can disagree) than sexualization of characters that are meant to look like minors.
 
Jan 22, 2011
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Okay I am bit more sober lets see..people have a problem with this and yet to bring this shojo mod or cotw from fallout to light or nude mods/scanty clothes??

Yes they are mods but hey they still exist even for these games.
http://newvegas.nexusmods.com/mods/35097
 

Lunar Templar

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Eamar said:
I totally understand putting gameplay first, I just find it saddening that I am increasingly losing my ability to see past this stuff :( The minute I see jiggle physics being touted as a major selling point I lose all interest, no matter how good the game might be.
I can under stand that, though >.> can't say i notice the jigglys in Vin, it dose have it, but Plate tends to keep things still, if you know what i mean

Haha yeah, I am indeed a woman :p Ah, I *really* don't want to pull the "you don't get it because you have a PENIS" card but... yeah, I guess it hits a bit closer to home when it's your gender being presented like this (sorry!) Like I said in my original post, it's not just the characters that bug me, it's the comments on videos (either of gameplay or of female games journalists) along the lines of "BOOBIEZ!!!1!11 ZOMG I WANT TO TOUCH YOUR TITS." So I probably tend to conflate the two, which may not be helpful. Though I don't think it's too much of a leap to connect the two a lot of the time...
:p hey! I'll have you know i don't do that! ^^;; i have to many female friends and I'm sure they'd glare if i did. o.o;; and the glare sucks, even over the interenet

And actually, it's kind of interesting that you automatically assumed I was a guy (not having a go, just making a point). There are A LOT more female gamers out there than people realise, many hidden behind male avatars and forum profiles and staying well clear of voice chat (honestly, try using voice chat in any popular FPS as a woman. You would not believe the abuse you tend to get. Again, not trying to demonise men here, it's the vocal minority and all that, but it leads to women hiding themselves).
as mentioned above, most my friends are female, and they all game, (one is hyper competitive to) so I'm aware your out there, but I'm not about to start asking peoples gender, most the time i just call it as i see it, though admittedly, zombies aren't the best to base anything off of >.> kind like me and my midnight blue Alicorn ....

also >.> FPS community's a crap to begin with, I'd avoid voice chat to


Absolutely there are some decent games for this out there, and I'm totally down with sexy as an option for both genders when it's appropriate. I mean, it would make total sense for male and female Blood Elves in WoW to shmex themselves up, for example. Like I said, and as Shamus said, the key element is choice. Also I happen to love WoW :p
>.> only good thing about WoW, is the Draenie far as I'm concerned >.>;; (mostly i hate it cause the, imo, fucked up the warrior class >..<)

I'm not familiar with vin at all, so my bad. But YAY for tank love :)

Totally agree, character models are a major problem, perhaps more so than the outfits. Something that bugs me in particular is the lack of variety (again, it all comes down to choice). While still limited in many cases, there does tend to be a lot more variation in male body types in games (compare males and females here: http://en.playpw.com/heroes.html )I can totally understand some people wanting to play as a supermodel lookalike, but I'd prefer my characters to look like they can handle the weapons they're supposed to be using. My personal preference would be for powerful, muscular females who looked more like elite athletes than models.
Vindictus is an action based 'MMO' which plays more like a dungeon crawler :see here for how basic runs play out [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6DfpyEB35Jo]:
the game operates on instances only with teams of four with the leader hosting. Raids (which are generally one room and just the boss monster) cap of at eight and work under the same 'hosting rules' as normal instances, the exception to this is the new, twenty-four player 'God of the Fomor' [http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/540357_208935832555938_100003185690757_357425_333474157_n.jpg] raid,(and he's REALLY fucking big o.0) which is a hosted by a server. gear is almost exclusively crafted, with mats gathered from bosses for the most part(mats lists are easy to find and generally keep track of) but can only be relied on so much (the dragon, despite being a lvl 40 raid boss was more then capable of one shotting MY lvl 66 ass in lvl 60 gear) with the bulk of 'not dieing' requiring you to understand boss movements, and tells, and reacting (generally by getting out of the way or blocking, though some higher level raid bosses have unblockable attacks). characters are gender locked though, so no dual wielding swords and caving some ones head in with a battle pillar for the ladys :/ unfortunately

also, that link of yours :( only like 12 characters unlocked and of those, the females looked like pretty standard fair
 
Jan 22, 2011
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animehermit said:
Cecilthedarkknight_234 said:
Okay I am bit more sober lets see..people have a problem with this and yet to bring this shojo mod or cotw from fallout to light or nude mods/scanty clothes??

Yes they are mods but hey they still exist even for these games.
http://newvegas.nexusmods.com/mods/35097
Well you aren't too sober, that first sentence is completely garbage.

And yes I have a problem with sexualizing children in mods too. There is, however a difference between something modded in, and something that's put intentional into the game.
Then good for ya bro I don't care because it's game nor will I ever care. Everyone has their own sense of morality "right or wrong" & this doesn't bother me. I am more worried about where I am going to live or eat in the next 4 months than some game a guy is playing this then beating off into a towel to really care.

Protecting fictional children isn't on my high list, now if this was game using real children I would be right there with you but polygons or 2d sprites really don't make me grab the pitch forks and go hang them the bastards.
 

Daaaah Whoosh

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I think the best way to do armor is to have as much skintight clothing as possible. That way, women can't complain because everyone's wearing that kind of stuff anyway, and men can feel bad for not being as muscular as their avatar.
 

Therumancer

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Well, for starters this is a non-issue that should have been pretty much banned from geekdom long ago. The idea that women are somehow put off by, or offended by, these depictions of women in fantasy is outright false. Some might be, but they represent a tiny minority. If you've ever paid attention to what female artists and authors produce when aiming at women, it's as "bad" or "worse" than what the guys doing this kind of artwork do.

It's pretty much one of those straw men, where guys generally string up the idea of women being objectified as the reason why there aren't more women around for them to play with, also hoping that by doing so women will be more interested in them for being sensitive. That's really not accurate, and all you really have to do is look at the artwork of female fantasy artists like say Julie Bell, or read how some of the characters dress in say Kim Harrison's "Hollows" series, the "Anita Blake" series, or any of the other diverse "paranormal romance" and "modern fantasy" generes.

That said, the whole idea of having a set of visible equipment as opposed to what your wearing is an old one. I think "Anarchy Online" actually did it first with their social tab, but you can also see it in game like "Star Trek Online" with the abillity to disable the visuals of your equipment and be seen only wearing your clothing/uniform. The various "Super Hero" games also allow a free range of visual design with gear having no overt apperance effect, and apparently "The Secret World" is following suit.

To be honest though I have mixed opinions about the entire thing, to be honest in a fantasy game a big part of the idea is that your high end gear is being scavanged from tombs and such. Your typical AD&D dungeon crawling party DOES tend to look like a group of vagabonds which is one of the reasons why they can be identified as adventurers. A warrior might be using say a Kopesh Sword taken from an egyptian style tomb, while wearing an elven cloak taken from a forest adventure, gnome crafted boots of levitation, and a suit of armor thrown together by dwarves... all obtained from differant places. That's kind of the fun of an established adventurer is that his gear sort of represents a record of what he's done in his X number of levels of play.

To be honest, I think the problem in MMOs is simply that it winds up becoming uniform due to developers cutting corners with resources and not wanting to create a lot of parallel builds and gear. What's more with a limit amount of content everyone winds up doing the same stuff and getting their gear off the same loot tables... unlike a PnP game where even if the GM never wrote an adventure himself, you could say raise three differant fighters to 20th level on modules (easily) without ever repeting any content and wind up with a very differant collection of trophies and magical weaponry.

Accepting the limits of computer MMOs, I tend to feel that within sword and sorcery games, you should see equipment done the way it traditionally has been. If anything you just need developers to stop trying to streamline the game for casuals, as with simplicity comes there being "ideal" builds and equipment sets far too easily, and narrow equipment options produced to cater to the simiplified specializations. Make things a bit more complex, produce more gear, and move away from "tier sets" and I think that would be the way to go.

When it comes to science fiction and super hero games, I tend to agree that the apperance options fit in better with the vibe. For example in "Star Trek" you don't see everyone walking around in heavy armor, and loaded with gizmos. In super hero comics the character tends to have whatever he happens to need, oftentimes just producing it out of hammerspace or from "microcircuitry" or "unstable molecules" allowing it to be concealed in or somehow attached to their costume. Generes like Cyberpunk and Modern Dark Fantasy are the same, your various cyberpunk characters tend to have a lot of the details of how they carry whatever it is they are using glossed over from chapter to chapter, and characters like "Hellboy" somehow manage to stuff more garbage into their dusters than Batman at a Loony Toons convention (or so it seems).

To be honest there is still immersion in these games, no matter what handles people use, the characters should fit the setting and the genere, with the people behind them being what might break immersion during play. A fantasy RPG should be a fantasy RPG, other generes come with their own tropes. In some generes maintaining a distinctive apperance makes sense, in others it does not.

This is part of the problem with say being unable to equip your characters in "Dragon Age 2" since the whole "dungeon looting" is part of the genere. It's also why there is still some opposition to the plans for say "Dragon Age 3" with the apperance of an item varying depending on who wears it. Basically if you grab a magic spear off of a Lizardman Shaman then it should look like a bloody Lizardman spear if that's who made it, it shouldn't suddenly adapt a Zulu apperance or a Roman apperance depending on who handles it. Sort of like how the GM won't let you spontaneously reforge equipment in your typical AD&D game, you know like "gee, I'd be much happier if Excalibur was a Rapier" or "Damn Thor, thanks for letting me borrow Mjolnir for this quest to free you from those chains, but do you mind if I reforge it into an axe, giant runing hammers aren't my thing" or "Glowing black swords that moan with the souls of their victims don't fit my style, I'm going to choose to re-do Stormbringer as a dagger while I wield it".

I mean even in LOTRO where is your gear coming from? If your wearing armor from the floor of a barrow, it shouldn't look like something you had custom smithed to your personal specifications.

The point being is that as an issue/feature it applies to some generes, not all of them.

As a final note on the original topic:

As far as women walking around in sensible armor, understand that a lot of those "cheesecake" outfits are sensible. As much as people might decry it as being sexist, understand that when people were running around with actual weapons and armor like that and whacking on each other women were at best second class citizens because they just couldn't perform to the level of men... the exceptions to this being few and far between (though they do exist)

As a result you just don't have a lot of armor and weapons made for women, and when looking at the realities of such combat you run into a number of problems in terms of getting them to function properly.

In general this means that in fantasy when your giving men and women identical capabilities (ie ignoring the upper limits of physical performance and such), your left with the question as to what women are going to wear into battle. In general it comes down to trying to find ways for them to fight mobily....

One thing to understand is that all those super hero costumes people make fun of came about because in general doing physical activity like gymnastics or martial arts in street clothes is insane. Thus they wore unitards, tights, briefs, and similar kinds of outfits like gymnists, dancers, and other sorts wore, when "on the job". I've read quite a bit about the logic behind super hero costumes.

When it comes to fantasy though your looking at a similar logic, but left with the question as to what the lady in question could wear at a time when things like spandex didn't exist. This of course leads to thinks like briefs, shorts, and other costumes that aren't going to leave a lot to the imagination. You tend to look at say the "panty shot" as something off color in a modern context, but consider that you actually could justify a female warrior wandering around with a thong, and a very short skirt that doesn't restrict mobility us actually an attempt at a degree of modesty. I remember reading some stuff about the art of guys like Frank Frazetta and some other authors who had a lot of knowlege of athletics and in drawing the human body (there was a big thing about Frank in paticular in the special features of the "Fire and Ice" animated movie DVD as well) and why they did a lot of what they did in setting up some of these stereotypes.

Now, one important exception here of course is silk. Of course in a fantasy world that's going to be incredible rare an expensive. You might see something more akin to regular clothing (in the spirit of say a traditional black Kung-Fu outfit) in the hands of nobility or in an Asian setting for such characters.

It's like a post I wrote not too long ago about Mileena from "Mortal Kombat" in that whole "live action" thing. The costume doesn't work for be-bopping around in the middle of the modern 21st century, but at the same time a costume like that is exactly what you'd expect a female warrior who jumps around like that to wear in her own fantasy dimension.

I suppose in the end you could argue for intentionally modest designs, but to be blunt I don't think that's nessicary.

I'll also say that from the girls I've met online who play MMOs with costume options (and yes I've met some) I seriously doubt you'll notice a heck of a lot of differance. I play characters of both genders, and have dressed my characters up in some fairly pervy outfits, on the other hand to use "Star Wars Galaxies" for an example it was a girl (and actual one) who taught me the "trick" of wearing hot pants and nothing else under a duster to make your character look functionally naked under the overcoat. With the social tab in that game, lets just say none of the people I knew of who were using that look in the final days were dudes. That doesn't mean ALL girls do that kind of thing, but it does mean that there is such a thing as being overprotective, and projecting sentiments that just don't seem to be there. It's one of those things where what people talk about in forms like this one, do not match what people actually do in the games themselves.
 

snave

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The solution I've been hoping for for years now is an extension of the Diablo socketing system.

Basically, your visible clothes come in a variety of forms, but each one only takes one of 9 pre-defined stat bonuses. Thats right, hundreds of armours, nine stat sets (ten if you include some sort of statless burlap sack you start with). Specifically:
NPC Purchasable (+X DEF, +X MagDEF or +X SPD)*
Loot (+2X DEF, +2X MagDEF or +2X SPD)
Craftable (+3X DEF, +3x MagDEF or +3X SPD)

Therefore, from the basic design, you can see what broad type of defensive stats a players outfit gives. Yeah, some of those lithe, speed-oriented ones will be stripper attire for sure, but there'll also be the option of an equivalent plain looking leather outfit. For powerplayers then, your goal becomes to get the third tier of the type you want (speed, defense, magic). With only 9 standard stat-sets for armour (and 6 of them basically being newbie training wheels for the tutorial stages), this is a rather easy task if you don't care for appearance.

But this is where the beauty of the system comes into it: the armours are all socketable. Stick in some sort of magic MacGuffin and it gives you your attack bonuses, and multipliers to your base armour type (DEF, MagDEF, SPD). All MacGuffins that offer pure defensive bonuses not aligned with your base outfit's style (so say, +X DEF regardless of whether you're wearing SPD or DEF aligned armour) also add visible polygonal changes to your armour model. These can be things like little wings or bulky shoulders or horns/spikes and the armours will all be designed with places to append these visual tidbits in mind.

All loot your (including unwanted armour pieces) get can be distilled into armour MacGuffins or something too, so you don't get some ludicrous situation where every monster in-game just drops a bucket of random gems and nout else.



* DEF = Physical Defense
MagDEF = Magic Defense
SPD = Speed
All strictly defensive type stats.
 

Axzarious

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lesterley said:
I think I just talked about this last week in my cartoon:
http://www.serialmmogamy.com

I think I would be more comfortable with the sexual objectification of an MMO avatar if it was an equal-opportunity objectification. If YOU can have the choice of playing a half-naked FEMALE avatar, why am I not given the opportunity to play a half-naked MALE avatar?

Leslee
Eh, from what I have seen in TERA it has more fanservice geared towards females than other games. Some male armours have sections of the back and chest uncovered for no reason at all.
Though that seems to be castanic territory. Still I was amused that some males had such blatantly impractical armour... but they still have pants. Which kinda makes this argument moot in some ways.

http://tera-online.cc/uploads/gallery/main/55/castanic_m_h14.jpg
And I wonder how this can even be considered heavy armour- http://tera-online.cc/uploads/gallery/main/55/castanic_m_h02.jpg

Still, if I ever made a game I would probably have a rule that for 'every scanty uniform that females have, one must be made for the males.'

I also hear from people who have gotten farther into the game that TERA also has an armour system where you can have your gear appear as earlier stuff you had.
 

Moromillas

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animehermit said:
Moromillas said:
Again, this is incorrect. You don't get craftables from RE custom gear. Just because it's not a requirement doesn't mean it should be overlooked, especially when it is the best there is.

No. No no no, I support TOR as I have done from launch. What I don't support is restricting player choices and only catering to this tiny part of what is a very large and diverse demographic. Too many assumptions.

Not just the pants slot, they gave Artifice a grand total of 2 (yes 2) schematics with which to craft sabers with augments, and they both look like unshaven ass imo.
It's the best by a VERY tiny margin. Most players who care that much about looks won't mind taking up some social gear if they want to wear pants. In fact you could argue that since light armor classes have access to orange belts, that they actually have a stat advantage over non-light armor wearing classes. It's a pretty minor nit-pick in the grand scheme of things though. I will say this, since 1.2 I have not seen any two people of the same class look the same. Which is something I think more MMO's should strive for.

on Artifice, i'm pretty sure the class was intended to be used for the crystals they make. Which is why they're limited in the saber making department. Purple crystals sell for about half a million credits, I'm sure artificers can live with that.
1.2 I took the mods out of an ankle skirt, and had the option to put them into the same ankle skirt with a slightly different texture. Yeah, I'd say that's an issue. "Nit-picking"? Not so much. Ripping the mods out of those enormous pointy triangle pauldrons was indeed the best thing since sliced bread.
 

Scrustle

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Eventidal said:
The power isn't connected to the armour sets. It's connected to the gems to enchant them. The point of the system is that upgrading armour is reduced to something purely aesthetic, so you don't have to worry about looking mismatched or having bad stats because you don't want to look the same as everyone else. But you are still compelled to level up and get new armour because of the increased ability to add enchantments to either the new armour or the set that you already own and prefer. It means you don't have to choose between looking good and having the best stats, and it still leaves the carrot of increased stats for levelling up and getting new loot. But with this system you get to choose whether that loot reward is the actual armour or just the stat bonuses that comes with them.
 

loa

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Kahunaburger said:
So now it's "entitled" to not want pedo shit in vidya gaems?
You seem pretty darn entitled to have your opinion heard and accepted as the norm.
Why else would you repeatedly proclaim it?
My condolences but yours isn't the only view on this world no matter how much you keep kicking and screaming about it.

Ah but to answer your question, while it isn't that far off, there is in fact a more fitting term for such behavior than "entitled". It starts with a "b".
 

Eventidal

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Scrustle said:
Eventidal said:
The power isn't connected to the armour sets. It's connected to the gems to enchant them. The point of the system is that upgrading armour is reduced to something purely aesthetic, so you don't have to worry about looking mismatched or having bad stats because you don't want to look the same as everyone else. But you are still compelled to level up and get new armour because of the increased ability to add enchantments to either the new armour or the set that you already own and prefer. It means you don't have to choose between looking good and having the best stats, and it still leaves the carrot of increased stats for levelling up and getting new loot. But with this system you get to choose whether that loot reward is the actual armour or just the stat bonuses that comes with them.
This may require further explanation.

The way I read it, it looked like you were suggesting that armor would have no stats, but have X number of slots with a set of restrictions on what enhancements (gems?) can be placed in them. Gems would be dropped by monsters, as well as new armor, which give you access to more slots to equip gems to?

The thing is, that sounds just really... off. If you get a low level set, wouldn't it be useless after you get another set that is higher level? Or is the armor itself not restricted in any way other than its basic armor type (as in, every piece of light armor shares the same restrictions on gem usage, as well as all other types having their own restrictions) and perhaps there's an equipment leveling system where, as you use a type of armor more, you gain the ability to add more, better gems to it?

I guess I could see it working that way. It doesn't sound like it would be any simpler or necessrily better, but a enhancement system could add depth to equipping your character while also streamlining the stat-adding process. Instead of digging through piles of equips to find the one with better X and Y, you can throw on the coolest looking armor and start plugging the stats you're after into it.
The main downside would be that no armor could be different or surprising, then. There's something pretty cool about the current sort of system where you could get a set of armor whose stats do something completely different than other armors of that type. For example, a heavy armor set that adds a life drain to your basic attack to make you a self-sustaining tank. Or a really low defense set of light armor that gives you a base 50% chance to negate damage upon getting hit. Sure, this system could have the same potential, but it's a lot less fun and interesting to find a new piece of armor if you don't get to check out its unique effects.
 

Scrustle

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Eventidal said:
Scrustle said:
Eventidal said:
The power isn't connected to the armour sets. It's connected to the gems to enchant them. The point of the system is that upgrading armour is reduced to something purely aesthetic, so you don't have to worry about looking mismatched or having bad stats because you don't want to look the same as everyone else. But you are still compelled to level up and get new armour because of the increased ability to add enchantments to either the new armour or the set that you already own and prefer. It means you don't have to choose between looking good and having the best stats, and it still leaves the carrot of increased stats for levelling up and getting new loot. But with this system you get to choose whether that loot reward is the actual armour or just the stat bonuses that comes with them.
This may require further explanation.

The way I read it, it looked like you were suggesting that armor would have no stats, but have X number of slots with a set of restrictions on what enhancements (gems?) can be placed in them. Gems would be dropped by monsters, as well as new armor, which give you access to more slots to equip gems to?

The thing is, that sounds just really... off. If you get a low level set, wouldn't it be useless after you get another set that is higher level? Or is the armor itself not restricted in any way other than its basic armor type (as in, every piece of light armor shares the same restrictions on gem usage, as well as all other types having their own restrictions) and perhaps there's an equipment leveling system where, as you use a type of armor more, you gain the ability to add more, better gems to it?

I guess I could see it working that way. It doesn't sound like it would be any simpler or necessrily better, but a enhancement system could add depth to equipping your character while also streamlining the stat-adding process. Instead of digging through piles of equips to find the one with better X and Y, you can throw on the coolest looking armor and start plugging the stats you're after into it.
The main downside would be that no armor could be different or surprising, then. There's something pretty cool about the current sort of system where you could get a set of armor whose stats do something completely different than other armors of that type. For example, a heavy armor set that adds a life drain to your basic attack to make you a self-sustaining tank. Or a really low defense set of light armor that gives you a base 50% chance to negate damage upon getting hit. Sure, this system could have the same potential, but it's a lot less fun and interesting to find a new piece of armor if you don't get to check out its unique effects.
That's more or less it. For example when you get to level 10 higher level armour and gems start to become available. The higher level armour would have say, 3 slots for gems opposed to the highest level armour you could get before which only had 2 slots. But when you level up you also gain a skill point which allows you to add an extra gem slot in to a lower level example of a certain class of armour. So if you choose to you will be able to have any style of armour you want and it will still have the best potential for protection. This skill point would be applied to an entire class of armour, so if you decide to switch armour sets at any point you won't lose out on gem slots. But you still need to specialise in a certain class.

Armour would still be unique because gems wouldn't just be things like "+20 defence points", there would be others with more traditional and interesting effects, like the examples you described. So these effects work like side-grades and you can create something interesting and unique, as if you were creating an enchanted item like in other RPGs. But this way you are free to choose what your armour looks like.

It may not be the best system ever but I think it would be a great way to solve the problem of having everyone look the same and people not looking how they want, which still makes sense within the context of the game.
 

Vampire cat

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Ashannon Blackthorn said:
I have an issue with this whole thread... even getting off the original topic of female over sexualization in video games.

Kahunaburger is the lead one for this, I showed this thread and his comments ot my Korean room mate who is a quiet 22 year old female exchange student. All she could say is why is he so racist toward my culture?

And Kuhuna and other like him(her?) are. Korean culture is not American. They have much different views on what is acceptable sexually then Americans do. (to a lesser extent Canadians and Europeans but Americans tend to go right off the prude scale quite easily)

Now before Kahunaburger starts yelling I support paedos or somesuch. I don't. I think paedophiles should be executed. If found guilty beyond doubt, bullet to the head.

I'm also aware not everyone thinks like me, or every culture is the same as mine.

So I disprove of paedophilia? Yes I do. DO I think the makers of Tera are pandering to paedos with that loli foxgirl crap? No. and anyone who blindly screams they are is a fucking idiot at best or a fucking idiot racist at worst.

Try and keep some perspectives here people and realize not every human on the planet views things the same way as you do.

I'm curious to see the ratio of Americans to either Canadians, Europeans or asians in this thread. I think it would be kind of interesting and telling in some ways.
Honestly, I was caught a bit offguard on the whole Elin subject. It didn't even occur to me that this was "sexualization of children", all I thought was "so cute! ... but, could I have a longer skirt? Just a little?"

My roomie was watching me play this game and he got really "flail flail" at the lack of clothing, and said he was "disapointed" in my choice of character. I was right up there with him giggling at the lightly dressed males and females before though, but in context I don't find them all that silly anymore. It's a bit strange at times yeah but it doesn't bother me at all, and some in this thread at least seem extremely bothered by it.

Also, movies and TV seem to get more and more sexualized. I don't see why ALL gaming has to move in the other direction? Currently we have a pretty good spead with all kinds of difrent games and art styles, why would we want to confine it because a couple of people are insecure about their sexuality or something? Thats not fair, I don't know why people are against it and I guess I wont understand even if they try to explain it to me.