This is Why Criticizing Anita Sarkheesian is Irrelevant and Pointless
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While I do agree that Anita has a right to her complaints, and that she does have some valid points in her vidoes, she doesn't get a pass this time. She is mad because Microsoft didn't reveal any games with a female protagonist. This is silly because an E3 reveal doesn't cover everything and they are under no obligation to reveal games to meet some kind of "gender quota". It's silly to get mad at a company for not revealing something that they were never obligated to reveal or talk about. At this point she is just being silly.
Then the fact that she keeps taking the hateful and spiteful comments and highlighting them. It's like she's trying to show us how "tough" and "virtuous" she is for going up against the vile hoards of the internet. It's the simple idea of "You cannot reveal virtue by trying to reveal virtue." She calls attention to those attacking her so she can then say, "See, look at me, look at how I fend of these trolls! Aren't I so great?" Which is sad, because I think she does have something to offer to the discussion, it's just that she always goes about it in the wrong way.
EDIT - Also... Mirror's Edge 2. Female. She may be Asian but she is still Female. Stop being Racist Anita. Or you know wait til the very end before you send out snarky comments.
Then the fact that she keeps taking the hateful and spiteful comments and highlighting them. It's like she's trying to show us how "tough" and "virtuous" she is for going up against the vile hoards of the internet. It's the simple idea of "You cannot reveal virtue by trying to reveal virtue." She calls attention to those attacking her so she can then say, "See, look at me, look at how I fend of these trolls! Aren't I so great?" Which is sad, because I think she does have something to offer to the discussion, it's just that she always goes about it in the wrong way.
EDIT - Also... Mirror's Edge 2. Female. She may be Asian but she is still Female. Stop being Racist Anita. Or you know wait til the very end before you send out snarky comments.
Well, let's just say that Little Miss Sarkastik Sunshine here isn't the sharpest tool in the shed when it comes to crunch time, actual effort or applying anything that deserves the label 'scientific approach'. She has a track history of being rather lazy, jumping to conclusions and not really even trying to back thesis, theory and observations up properly. She just applies her chosen slice of feminist (misandrist, revolutionary, communist) lore to whatever happens to catch her attention for a little while, spouts her stuff, gets applause from similarly inclined minds, on with the show, yay.ninjarafter said:
Anything and everything that can be used to 'prove' her point will immediately be used. Anything that contradics it will, most probably, be either ignored or get dismissed with little or no explanation. It's how totalitarian systems tend to function. Just watch her space, the hardcore lulz are guaranteed to come, as they are inevitable.
Which doesn't validate anything. The fact that people are willing to hate and dispute her even if she is clearly right is THEIR problem, not HERS. They cannot claim she MADE them act like this.The-Traveling-Bard said:
Yes and my point still stands, you can be decent in online forums without being a dickhead. To demonstrate I apologize if I came across as too personal or offensive to you.
To be fair though she bases a lot of her views on other works.
Except presumably for the gay cavemen, yes?
1. You won't hear me defending that either.
2. There was a big controversy over that as well.
3. The shitty behavior of a shitty show doesn't undo the shittiness of direct hateful insults being fired at people.
'This ***** is making my dick soft' is not honest social commentary!
My point is that none of those tweets were jokes. They were direct hateful insults full of bigoted language and slurs designed to intimidate and bully a person into submission.
If these are jokes then the big bully who punches the smaller kids and takes their lunch money is Dylan Moran.
When I was in pre-school I was taught that bullies should be called out on their bullying. That is what Sarkeesian is doing, whether or not you agree with her or not don't mistake 'fuck you, you stupid **** I hope you get raped' as open mike night at the local comedy club.
Ahahahahahahaha. She's a joke, "these reactions show the male privilege in the gaming community". It's like she's a cartoon figure. A cartoon damsel in distress at that, she can't help but show how much she's a victim of the ebil internet. Come on white knights rescue the damsel!
;-; If you would be so kindly as to message me how you do this so we can have a better discussion. It would be great!Vrex360 said:
( I hope you're not getting angry.) Anywho back on topic.
She is at fault completely. Since other people have also clearly she is just feeding to trolls to feed her own agenda that makes her worse than fucking Hitler. Preying on the weak and stupid because they don't know any better? Lawl. How low can you go.
Do you notice her face on the CNN news when the Lady told her "have you ever heard of don't feed the trolls?"
Her face just went "OH SHIT. I AM CAUGHT" but people are too stupid to read into what really went behind on that news cast that day. That YES Anita is literally using the hate to feed her agenda.
She's just has bad as School Shooters.
Oh! Nobody is listening to me! I'm going to go shoot up a school so people will pay attention to me.
ME, ME, ME, ME, ME.
It's also a worse fact that her SELF A PERSON FIGHTING ABOUT SEXIST IS ACTUALLY MOTHERFUCKING SEXIST!
She clearly states in her video that the only reason why man go after their loved ones is to fulfill a masculine duty that has been wounded.
Despite.. you know. The person took away the person they loved, built a family with, and other crap.
NOPE MASCULINE DUTY!
Let's not talk about gays. :b We don't need another flame war do we? Hahaha.
Even gays need a women to pass on their genetic Legacy.
Sex isn't about love yo. It's about baby making.
Okay, well yes. It's not a honest social commentary but that also wasn't my point.
My point is people are going to make fun of you regardless of who you are.
Anita isn't a fucking victim because she is a girl. She a victim of her own demise and stupidity which I will never, ever find acceptable and righteous by no means. America in general LOVES to play the victim game and it's down right sickening and disgusting how people can buy into this bullshit.
Anywho onto the actual angry comments.
Yeah, but do you honestly truly believe those people are actually sexist?
Or do you think they're just angry that this idiotic girl is trying to oppress her will on other people?
Do you think that the hate their have for Anita comes from any male superior thinking.
HELL! Do you even think for a second they even took a neno second to think about what they just posted?
All girls belong in the kitchen.
^ took me about a second to right that. No thought, no feeling, no complex secret hidden agenda behind it. Nothing.
People will say what they want on the internet because they get punished for it.
People also say things without thinking.
People do a lot of stupid things.
Jokes/insults. Fine.
Threats? Yeah, i'll agree with you. That's going too far. I'm asshole. I'm not a total asshole.
Anita asked for this shit.
Anita KNEW and is playing us ALL to get her way. That's the bottom line.
The fact she is *clearly trolling with that twitter posts proves it* because there was a few games when the main character was female.
IN FACT THEY EVEN HAD A FEMALE PLAYING IN- GAME WITH OTHER MALES BEING ALL NICE BUDDY, BUDDY.
While I'm not trying to defend some of those tweets, which were pretty scummy, not all of them were actually that bad or insulting. I don't think "Stop pushing your feminist agenda in video games" (8 on her list), "shut up" (11&12) "so what?" (20) or "Who cares?" (22) are direct, hateful insults. I think the inclusion of such tweets in her list "which exemplify the male privilege and male entitlement endemic in the gaming community today" is either padding, becuase there weren't enough actual offensive tweets for her victim complex, or that she's militant enough to not be able to differentiate between disagreement and hate speech.Vrex360 said:
I almost, ALMOST feel like jumping on twitter just to say that I think Anita should stop acting like a school shooter, and if she has a problem with me saying something like that. Come do a live interview with me.Megalodon said:
Scummy reponses from scummy people (the twitter trolls), but it's pretty tiresome how she pretends its because she is a woman criticising games, rather than an issue people have with her specifically as an individual. She has a persecution complex of an almost astounding degree, or else she is just a very clever and manipulative person.
People go onto twitter and tell celebrities that they wish that their kids would get cancer and other nasty things, it doesn't "prove" anything at all. Except that anonymity causes people to act nastily, which most of us have known for years.
She is completely blinkered by sexism and is incapable of looking at anything beyond it.
Or to put it another way, if somebody such as Susan Arendt had said what Anita did, she would not have received these kinds of responses. If it was purely down to misogyny on behalf of gamers, then this kind of thing would happen to all who complain about it, not just a select few.
People go onto twitter and tell celebrities that they wish that their kids would get cancer and other nasty things, it doesn't "prove" anything at all. Except that anonymity causes people to act nastily, which most of us have known for years.
She is completely blinkered by sexism and is incapable of looking at anything beyond it.
Or to put it another way, if somebody such as Susan Arendt had said what Anita did, she would not have received these kinds of responses. If it was purely down to misogyny on behalf of gamers, then this kind of thing would happen to all who complain about it, not just a select few.
It's okay, really. I should probably sign off soon anyway, I have study I should be doing.The-Traveling-Bard said:;-; If you would be so kindly as to message me how you do this so we can have a better discussion. It would be great!
Can we leave Hitler out of this please? I hate Hitler, dude was a dick.
But again I don't see how she's feeding the trolls, considering people will take anything she says and find some way to make a controversy out of it (as you said) it seems unfair to hold up the idea of her feeding the trolls if she's at a point where she literally can't say or do anything without being trolled.
Can't really comment on that, didn't see it.
Except, you know, she hasn't killed anybody. So substantially different.
I didn't interpete it that way, I saw it more as her saying that what should have been a relationship comes across more like a maculine possession thing largely because the female characters are given so little screentime or presence that they barely register as much more than a plot device.
The difference between a damsel we barely know getting kidnapped or a characters wife/girlfriend dying at the start of the story and it actually having emotional weight is how it is portrayed. Like in Gears of War 2, Dom's wife is given virtually no character at all. We see her once, in a dream and we barely get any idea of what she's like, her relationship with him, her own personality her backstory or anything. We know she exists and Dom wants to get her back and... that's about it. She's not a character she's the idea of a character. Similar to Nicole in the first Dead Space, we know about her.
Because of their lack of characterization it is hard to gtake seriously this whole 'loved one' thing especially when usually the female lead dying is just set up for the male character to shout 'noooo' then go back to killing more baddies again.
Hell she mentioned Damsels that subvert the trope showing up in a later video and maybe she could bring up Cortana in Halo 4, as much as I've complained about that the central theme of Cortana slowly dying is handled really well. It's not just set up for Masterchief to get angry, we see how Cortana reacts to her encroaching finite existence as well and it actually gets pretty deep and even sad. Plus we already know Chief and Cortana's relationship because it had spent three games building up on it, she is a character in her own right. Not just a thing to be stolen or killed to start up a plot.
That, I think, was Sarkeesian's poi- wait a minute! I said no talking about her views. You tricked me!
Perhaps but surely you have to admit the very specific way people target her is because she's a girl, right?
quote]Yeah, but do you honestly truly believe those people are actually sexist?[/quote]
Yep. I'm sorry I just can't excuse some of the attitudes shown in those comments.
That's probably what they tell themselves but if they honestly think youtube videos are going to destroy gaming they are not only sexist but also hilariously paranoid.
No, just plain ol' idiotic sexism.
Perhaps but they really should have because now they are being publicly vilified for that I do not feel sorry for them.
Perhaps but when you shout that down as a way to angrily refute someone talking about sexism suddenly it looks pretty bad.
Part of the reason why I;m actually kind of glad she's highlighting these comments because at least now people will know they are reprehensible turd monsters.
Yep, but they should think before they type. I actually gave it serious thought before I posted for the first time on this thread for example and I was careful to mention I wasn't addressing anyone in this thread specifically.
No argument here. Just that 'stupid' and 'sexist' are not mutually exclusive.
Well that's good of them I guess. I admit I didn't see the Xbone e3 footage because looking at the Xbone keeps creating an image of the death of modern art in the name of a quick buck which depresses me but I will give them that if it's true.
Regardless, her latest Tweet just seems to seethe with inflammatory material as if she's trying to spark something. Why do we give this Twat attention anyways?The_Scrivener said:
I don't particularly care for her and her horrible representation of feminism. Christ almighty, half the time she utters anything about sexism she makes herself look like the stereotypical feminist most misogynistic males paint them out to be.
It's just painful to watch.
And in response to Anita's idiotic tweet totally disregarding Mirror's Edge 2
I guess she missed Mirrors edge 2 being unveiled then?
You can still criticism her. Unless your criticism is "there is no misogyny in the gaming community at all" this doesn't really invalidate anything. It just shows once again that people are horrible.
You can still criticism her. Unless your criticism is "there is no misogyny in the gaming community at all" this doesn't really invalidate anything. It just shows once again that people are horrible.
While I agree too some extent a lot the comments she gets are misogynistic crap aimed at woman in general. Though of course sexism is everywhere not just in the gaming community and comments and twitter seem to attract the worst of people.Legion said:
That's because she is a woman, and misogynist comments are therefore far more insulting. Telling her to "stop whining and grow some balls" isn't going to have the same impact as it might on a guy for example. People use insults to hurt, therefore they choose the ones that are going to hurt the most.DementedSheep said:
It doesn't make those comments any less misogynistic, but it doesn't prove anything in regards to how sexist gamers are as a whole. There are tens of millions of them after all, so in terms of percentage we are talking 0.0(a lot of zeroes)1% of gamers who are expressing these kind of views, and very few express this kind of view to people who aren't like Anita, which suggests it's a personal attack rather than an "anti-women" ideal.
It doesn't make it any better, but she uses these things to try and prove a point, and her point is as valid as saying football (soccer) fans are racist, violent thugs due to the chanting and fighting that goes on. Sure there are many, but they are an absolutely tiny minority when it comes down to it. Yes those people are a problem, but her argument would be that "football fans" are a problem, as if it's a cultural thing as opposed to "some people are just nasty".
If she just said "Misogynist responses as usual" and linked them, I'd be completely on her side, but as always she has to try the "male privilege" and "male entitlement" line of argument, which is where her bias shows, and why I find myself at odds with her opinions.
I think people are misunderstanding something. She did not feed the trolls. She is the troll. And a good one. Raging and insulting is not trolling. At least it wasn't.
The aim of trolling is to get an inadequate response. And she achieves it with just one message on twitter. Fascinating.
Using all the hate of stupid people to prove her point even more. Smart move.
I don't understand what there is to rage about. For a smart person. She has a point(doesn't mean she is always right), she stirs up the bowels of the internet, and maybe, as a result, we will see less cringe-worthy plots in games. Until I see some negative effects from her activity, I support her idea.
And it's fun to observe internet drama. Especially if she knowingly puts herself in front of the hate train and manages to gain momentum from it.
And it's not like she went for this low-hanging fruit.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=P75YQHFnyKY
Not particularly offensive, but fake, tasteless and retarded, considering all of the feminist backlashes of the last 6 months.
The aim of trolling is to get an inadequate response. And she achieves it with just one message on twitter. Fascinating.
Using all the hate of stupid people to prove her point even more. Smart move.
I don't understand what there is to rage about. For a smart person. She has a point(doesn't mean she is always right), she stirs up the bowels of the internet, and maybe, as a result, we will see less cringe-worthy plots in games. Until I see some negative effects from her activity, I support her idea.
And it's fun to observe internet drama. Especially if she knowingly puts herself in front of the hate train and manages to gain momentum from it.
And it's not like she went for this low-hanging fruit.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=P75YQHFnyKY
Not particularly offensive, but fake, tasteless and retarded, considering all of the feminist backlashes of the last 6 months.
Mirror's Edge 2 was at EA's conference. Beyond Two Souls was at Sony's. She talks about Microsoft's conference.Tr3yk1ng said:
Stuff like "maybe when woman start being capable like men" doesn't strike me as using misogyny as personal attack to be insulting, its just seems like misogyny in genral and I do see this often when views like Anita's are bought up, not just to her.Legion said:
But yeah, you get this shit everywhere not just gaming and it isn't even indicative of sexism in society as a whole. Those with extreme negative views are always the loudest and most memorable group so the problem ends up looking far far bigger than it is