Uncharted 2

[ButtonedDownParadox]

Uhhh...Yahtzee is playing fast and loose with several of the plot points. (Drake being responsible for Jeff's demise, killing Lazarevic, Drake being responsible for Elena's injuries, not caring about any of the aforementioned things...)

But it's his judgement and I'm not going to change it. Nor do I have any interest to.

 

[Daeger]

Can't say I can really properly comment on this, as I haven't played the game or its predecessor. But I will say that making the main character a douchebag only works...wait, no, it never works.

No More Heroes

 

[MissAshley]

Thank you, Yahtzee, for perfectly explaining something I can not:

Why this game just feels "cold" to me.

 

[Fluffy0883]

Hell personally I can't believe people base their buying decisions on ANYONE'S reviews.

Amen to that.
On another note, this community actually seems pretty reserved for a Gaming forum. I might hang around. -lol-

 

[Woodsey]

Interesting that you label some of those with unique stories, whilst criticizing them earlier for being unoriginal and uncreative. Similarly interesting how the biggest compliment the game has received is that it's pretty, visual, and cinematic--all good qualities, but there's no good word to be had for gameplay. One would think an acclaimed game would have acclaim about the gameplay...hmmm...

There's been plenty of acclaim for the gameplay.

All I've heard is that it's functional, or suited, or fitting--hardly acclaim.

Alright, well I've heard it's almost entirely unoriginal but is exceptionally good.

 

[Smokescreen]

You know, I just realized that the photo of Yahtzee for this series has a much fuller beard than the man in the DC video does.

Yahtzee, you scamp, are you trying to make yourself look better for the ladies? Or have the editors of the Escapist decided to 'play up' your obvious masculinity by filling in and trimming that goatee of yours?

C'mon. You can tell us.

 

[Littaly]

So, I have to wonder if Yahtzee hates Han Solo as much as Drake. Same smug attitude. Same money-driven motivation. Same willingness to kill whomever he "needs" to kill.

The thing about Han-Solo is that he evolves as a character over the course of the movies. He is deliberately an money-driven (bad)ass(hole) so that they can make him all squishy later on.

I guess they tried to take a tiny step in that direction with Uncharted 2 (not shooting guards, saving Jeff etc.) but it all came off as kind of half-arsed.

That said. I don't think Uncharted has a good story, and I don't think Drake is a great character. But, and this is important, they are a good match for this type of game. You cannot compare movies to games the same way you cannot compare books to movies. In a game the plot has to share the spotlight with gameplay. Gamers and games alike value plot to different degrees, but the fact still remains, it can not be just plot, then it's not a game.

What I always liked about Uncharted is the way it's balanced. It's puzzled together so that neither shooting, cutscenes, platforming or puzzling becomes boring or drags on. In short: It's very fast paced and has a good flow. For this the whole "charismatic son-of-a-B looking for a treasure" works very well. We're familiar with the setting, it doesn't need much explaining. We can just jump right into it and get on with the game without having to worry about what's happening or why it's happening, yet it's still unpredictable enough to keep us playing.

The very same thing goes for the characters and dialog. They wouldn't last a second in an RPG, but here they are just deep enough to keep us interested in between the shootouts and just shallow enough to make sense before the game is over.

Look, I'm not saying I don't enjoy a good story , Dragon Age was pretty much the opposite of this and I loved that game. There are efforts to be made with Uncharted's story as well as it's character, but it all needs to be within the context of the game.

 

[Something Amyss]

On the one hand, Yahtzee's right. I haven't played Uncharted 2 yet, but I found him unlikeable in the first and find it likely I will dislike him in the second. I feel this way a lot. I find a lot of characters to be 2D pretending to be 3D. it's old. It's tiresome.

And on the other hand, when it comes to a video game, plot usually comes second. I'm going to use the example of Saints Row 2, where none of the characters are really all that realistic, the main character is a two dimensional sociopath, and the only thing I can say about the story is it's a mildly amusing way to kill some time between sessions of killing people.

I guess the point is that I consider the story to most games to be about as tacked on as the single player experience in most shooters. But that brings me back to the first hand.

Just because the story isn't necessarily essential to the gameplay experience doesn't mean that Drake is any less awful as a character. It doesn't make bad stories good. Really, I'm amazed that anyone would think that the difference in medium would make bad characters any better. It's not even really more understandable, especially since the stories are being pushed as part of the experience now. They should be better than a throw away direct-to-DVD movie, or be panned as such. Bad characters are bad characters. Bad plots are bad plots.

And while I'll play a game despite a lacking story, that really excuses nothing, even from my "Press whatever button skips this tripe" point of view.

 

[Nomanslander]

Not to justify Uncharted 2, which was stupid, but not much originality in games this year, even among what you named

Borderlands: Wasteland space planet and lost treasure- not original
Modern Warfare 2: Creatively executed, but pretty much ripped off of Tom Clancy's works, I felt like I was playing Splinter Cell: Bullet Hose edition
Brooetal Legend: Rips off of pretty much everything in heavy metal
Batman: Arkham Asylum: Hasn't this thing been done in the comics, movies, and tv shows a million times already?
Darkest of Days: You got me, this was pretty original
Overlord 2: Same as the first game, so not really original
Infamous: Ripped off Prototype
Prototype: Ripped off Infamous
Bionic Commando: The name speaks for itself
Velvet Assassin: Kind of original, but loses points for being based on a real person
Madworld: Deathmatch tv show. I think Manhunt did something like this.

have no fear, the nitpick train is here!

Borderlands: Wasteland space planet and lost treasure- not original
-for the life of me, i cant recall the last game where you were searching for lost treasure on inhospitaple wasteland planet...

Modern Warfare 2: Creatively executed, but pretty much ripped off of Tom Clancy's works, I felt like I was playing Splinter Cell: Bullet Hose edition
- Dont have that much knowledge on Clancy's works but I'd hazard to guess that the general atmosphere is around in evry wargame... difficult to say

Brooetal Legend: Rips off of pretty much everything in heavy metal
-ahh my friend, but he was refering to its originality in GAMES, not in general world (on side note wtf would classify as original nowdays anyway EVRYthings been done with something, just not WITH evrything)

Batman: Arkham Asylum: Hasn't this thing been done in the comics, movies, and tv shows a million times already?
-once more youre list does not include games, name last game where you assumed the role of a crimefighter who infiltrates asylum taken over by its inhabitants.

Darkest of Days: You got me, this was pretty original
- no arguments here

Infamous: Ripped off Prototype
Prototype: Ripped off Infamous
-true enough, but when its two games amids hundreds of others I think we can call the story original. Also the stories arent exactly identical...

Bionic Commando: The name speaks for itself
-true enough

Velvet Assassin: Kind of original, but loses points for being based on a real person
-eeh so how does that change the fact that its original in GAMES..?

Madworld: Deathmatch tv show. I think Manhunt did something like this.
-Agreed but once again its two games amids hundreds

Movies and TV shows are a media we're all exposed to just as much as video games, just because games are separate shouldn't mean game developers can rip off stuff seen and done to death in other medias all they want.

Being exposed to the same formulaic story lines and plots seen in TV shows and movies just cheapens the experience.

 

[Pete Oddly]

It's funny; I like Nathan Drake's character for the exact same reasons Yahtzee hates him.

I think I might be an asshole.

 

[Flamma Man]

So, I have to wonder if Yahtzee hates Han Solo as much as Drake. Same smug attitude. Same money-driven motivation. Same willingness to kill whomever he "needs" to kill.

...

Did you watch the Star Wars movies films at all?

 

[TundraWolf]

Madworld: Deathmatch tv show. I think Manhunt did something like this.

There are differences between the two, but I get the point. Still, can you name any other games like those? Just because it's happened once doesn't make it unoriginal. It's stuff that has happened twenty times over or more that gets old (space marine fighting alien hordes, for instance).

You mean, futuristics game shows as "game premise" to justify mass killing? Ok... Here are some:
- Fatal Review
- F-Zero
- Madworld
- MegaRace
- MTV Celebrity Deadmatch
- Rage
- Ratchet Deadlocked
- Serious Sam
- Smash TV
- The Grid
- Unreal Tournament
- Whacked!
- Zhadnost: The People's Party

Not to menction the entire premise is lifted of The Running Man (that has its own game), which on itself must have come from somewhere...

Fair point; I stand corrected. To be fair, most of those games are racing games and Rage isn't going to have the whole killing-monsters-for-TV as the main premise of the game, but I do concede that the idea has been done to death. My bad.

Having said that, though, there are still main differences between the plots of both MadWorld and Manhunt, as well as the rest of the ones you mentioned. For one, a lot of the ones you listed don't have stories at all (racing games are all racing, sometimes racing-combat, but little-to-no story), or, at best, have a very basic premise that they use to justify the mass slaughter that comes in actual gameplay (I'm thinking Unreal Tournament here). Don't get me wrong, I have as much fun with those games as the next guy (especially Unreal Tournament), but that doesn't mean that they have noteworthy stories.

Debating semantics when it comes to stories is a non-issue, though. As I said in my previous post, generalizing plots into categories like that doesn't help develop story-telling in games. Comparing the story in Manhunt to the very basic premise in Unreal Tournament is about the equivalent of comparing the story in Batman: Arkham Asylum to the premise of Rock Band; one has a deep, compelling story that involves you and draws you into it's world, while the other has a basic premise behind it but does not have a story through actual gameplay. It's just silly to make that comparison.

 

[JC175]

Can't say I can really properly comment on this, as I haven't played the game or its predecessor. But I will say that making the main character a douchebag only works...wait, no, it never works.

No More Heroes

I'll see that and raise you a Far Cry. I wanted to punch Jack Carver in the balls that whole game.

 

[Chunko]

I didn't watch this one because I didn't want the game spoiled. Can someone tell me if the spoilers are minor or major, and tell me if I should read it or not?

 

[NeoShinGundam]

"I want to see more of Nathan Drake than a wisecracking bubble that grunts a lot."

Wasn't that Bruce Willis's character John McClane from "Die Hard?" Actually, I WOULD watch a movie about a "wisecracking bubble that grunts a lot."

 

[erlend_sh]

Haven't had much to say about ZP videos or articles as of yet, but for this one I'll chime in with praise and agreement. Definitely your best article so far for me; maybe it had something to do with the self-conscious decision to not digress several times?

Anywho, nice job on this one.

 

[Niska]

Yeah Drake is awesome and a great shot and all but I completely agree with Yahtzee. The guys an insufferable twat who thinks that it's OK to murder innocents and scores of people for his own personal gain. The whole killing of some random security guard in the tutorial got to me especially the guy probably had a house, a family and a pet he cared about. Unlike Drake who probably sleeps in hotels and stuffs dollar bills down the throats of dying prostitutes.

 

[redrook]

You know, I have never played Uncharted or Uncharted 2 but the way you describe Drake, makes me like him. I happen to enjoy the idea of a complete prick who fucks over everyone around himself just getting his way when he should rightly be dropped to the bottom of a ravine somewhere. The injustice of that alone is hilarious to me I guess. I think just by your hatred for him you've somehow endeared me to an otherwise bland, lifeless, character by making him seem so bad, dumb and horrible that he is funny. It reminds me of watching a shittastic action movie where the lead is some big guy who shoots everyone for no apparent reason and at the end wins, but they never really give him any reason to shoot half of them and fail to discuss the millions of laws he has broken and the people/property he has needlessly destroyed for some obscure personal vendetta or gain. I feel like if somehow, in those kinds of stories, someone simply acknowledged this it would make the concept somehow better, though in reality I doubt it would be that simple.

 

[AgentNein]

First off I completely disagree with Yahtzee on this one. No big deal, that happens all the time. It's the way he makes Drake look like this cold blooded murderer, in all but one case, every person he meets is trying to kill him, and he's defending himself. That's key here. Granted, one could still argue the ethics of killing others when one's own life is threatened, the worth of these soldier's lives who are so ready to open fire and kill people, etc... but yeah, lots of grey area here.

That's not what I want to talk about though, instead what Yahtzee made me realize is how much I appreciate the characters in Borderlands. There really is no weird disconnect between how they are and what they do. They're crazy assholes, not really much different than the other crazy assholes roaming the wastelands. Now I still like Drake and I think one could argue that his 'murders' are justified (although that one poor guard at the beginning of the game is in my opinion a huge freaking oversight by the developers), that many bodies on your hands has to make you I don't know, at least a little cracked.