Veganism...why?

[Shockolate]

I think that sometimes there are medical reasons.

For example, I've heard that popular pro-wrestler and vegan Bryan Danielson (AKA Daniel Bryan) is vegan because of his poor immune system caused my several liver infections and that being vegan helps him.

I don't know any other details though.

 

[Eamar]

(As an aside, the aforementioned current vegan friend was seriously overweight until recently. I'm still trying to work out what she was eating...)

My best guess off the cuff without knowing anything else would be that they were eating a lot of breads, grains, or other processed foods containing wheat. Have to get those calories somewhere when you aren't eating animal proteins and fats. Wheat just happens to be the worst possible thing health conscious people usually eat in large quantities because they don't realize it makes them fat and sick.

Yeah, I guess that's probably it. Also, sugar is vegan and we all know how disastrous that is in terms of calories

Actually, now that you mention it I lost weight when I stopped being vegetarian. Even when I was actively trying to avoid over-reliance on pasta, bread etc and aiming for a balanced diet I fell short. I can only imagine the sheer amount of time and effort it must take a full-blown vegan to stay balanced :S

EDIT:

Finally... have you ever seen an overweight vegan? I certainly haven't, although I'm sure there'd be one or two exceptions to the rule.

See this conversation

 

[LittleShe-Bear]

(As an aside, the aforementioned current vegan friend was seriously overweight until recently. I'm still trying to work out what she was eating...)

My best guess off the cuff without knowing anything else would be that they were eating a lot of breads, grains, or other processed foods containing wheat. Have to get those calories somewhere when you aren't eating animal proteins and fats. Wheat just happens to be the worst possible thing health conscious people usually eat in large quantities because they don't realize it makes them fat and sick.

Yeah, I guess that's probably it. Also, sugar is vegan and we all know how disastrous that is in terms of calories

Actually, now that you mention it I lost weight when I stopped being vegetarian. Even when I was actively trying to avoid over-reliance on pasta, bread etc and aiming for a balanced diet I fell short. I can only imagine the sheer amount of time and effort it must take a full-blown vegan to stay balanced :S

Different metabolisms work in different ways, I'd guess. I'm a total sugar and carbs fiend but I lost loads of weight when I became vegan. I suspect the sudden lack of cheese had something to do with it.

 

[Eamar]

[
Different metabolisms work in different ways, I'd guess. I'm a total sugar and carbs fiend but I lost loads of weight when I became vegan. I suspect the sudden lack of cheese had something to do with it.

I'm not really sold on the metabolisms argument in all cases (seriously, this friend was BIG. No way you could blame it on metabolism, she was just plain eating too much, as she herself has admitted since losing the weight). I imagine it has more to do with activity levels and how much cheese you were eating

[small]Captcha: turkey sandwich. Well, I guess we know where captcha stands on this issue...[/small]

 

[Yopaz]

Ah, one of my favourite arguments. As far as I can interpret my friend's impossibly cheery explanation, it's something to do with exploiting animals being bad. That cow you mentioned? Pumped full of hormones to keep her body making milk and a lot more of said milk. Very naughty.

Do you think that is universal? Where I live it's illegal to use hormone treatment on animals. It is illegal to let your animals live in filth or discomfort. We have to provide mattresses for our cows so they don't hurt their hoofs by standing on a hard floor all the time. It's also mandatory to let our cows graze outside during summers. You are also ignoring the fact that we have this thing called organic farming where they use nothing artificial at all.

Then of course there's the question, do you think the cows would be better off if we let them go free?

 

[Paradoxrifts]

Why?

Because people who like to feel morally superior to other people, statistically hailing from the socioeconomic middle-class or higher, get an ideology boner whenever they succeed in driving up the price of meat and dairy for those people who can least afford the price increases. Because students, unemployed, working families or even pensioners don't deserve access to an affordable natural human diet.

I've yet to meet a single Vegan in the flesh that wasn't ankle deep into animal rights.

 

[peruvianskys]

One: Disclaimer about animals. Tbh I don't give a fuck about chickens. Elephants? Different matter. For me it is a sense of self. Elephants have a concept of death, they should be protected. Apes have a sense of self, same applies. From what we can tell, Dolphins have both a sense of self and language, they should be protected.

See where I am going? I care about the welfare of animals that I currently think have got to the point where we should give a fuck about them.

So what criteria do you have for what animals deserve to be cared about and what animals don't?

Two: I mostly avoid animal products but, well, as the disclaimer said, I dont give a damn about a few animals. Things like chickens. Fish. Crabs. Do you care if someone swats a fly or stands on a cockroach?

I think it would probably be better not to, but I don't ascribe the same significance to it. But chickens and fish can feel pain as well.

Three: Now to an interesting point. I assume you avoid the majority of modern medicine. I assume you avoid using any haircare or skincare products. I assume your shoes are made of hemp, you own nothing made of wool or silk, hell, if all of the above aint true then you too are a hypocrite.

Everyone is a hypocrite. I care about the animals I think should be cared about. I dont give a damn about those that have no sense of self-awareness.

First off, self-awareness is a complex and messy concept. However, the majority of scientific evidence regarding the neurobiology of pigs, cows, chickens, etc. show that they have the same capacity for suffering as we do. That is what's important.

Secondly, it's not an all-or-nothing game here. You are probably unable to go the rest of your entire life without lying, but that doesn't mean you should just give up trying to be truthful. There are a million little ways to be more compassionate and constructive in our lives, and I'm simply saying that veganism is a really easy, incredibly positive change that someone can make. I don't wear leather or use soaps/medicines tested on animals, for the record, but it wouldn't matter either way. Any move towards respecting the rights of animals is a positive one.

So, lets get back to another interesting point, what is your view on animal testing?

Particularly testing carried out on rats, hamsters, mice and cats.

I have the exact same position; if I wouldn't do it to a retarded child, I wouldn't do it to an animal. The benefit would have to be incredibly great to justify it.

 

[LittleShe-Bear]

[
Different metabolisms work in different ways, I'd guess. I'm a total sugar and carbs fiend but I lost loads of weight when I became vegan. I suspect the sudden lack of cheese had something to do with it.

I'm not really sold on the metabolisms argument in all cases (seriously, this friend was BIG. No way you could blame it on metabolism, she was just plain eating too much, as she herself has admitted since losing the weight). I imagine it has more to do with activity levels and how much cheese you were eating

[small]Captcha: turkey sandwich. Well, I guess we know where captcha stands on this issue...[/small]

I did eat a lot of cheese, it's true. I'll happily admit cheese is amazing, it was a total ***** to give up.

[small] Seriously, captcha? Turkey? It's so dry, of all the meats you could have chosen...[/small]

 

[orangeban]

Not a vegan, or even a vegetarian, but I suspect that it's probably for the same reason that you wouldn't eat a human or suckle their milk without their consent.

 

[peruvianskys]

I was a vegan for a short time a few years back, actually. The reason was clear: I had the hots for a girl who was a vegan herself.

Yeah, I think that's the reason about 90% of people get started on veganism =]

I wonder if you could trace it all back to a single vegan Eve.

 

[Eamar]

[
Different metabolisms work in different ways, I'd guess. I'm a total sugar and carbs fiend but I lost loads of weight when I became vegan. I suspect the sudden lack of cheese had something to do with it.

I'm not really sold on the metabolisms argument in all cases (seriously, this friend was BIG. No way you could blame it on metabolism, she was just plain eating too much, as she herself has admitted since losing the weight). I imagine it has more to do with activity levels and how much cheese you were eating

[small]Captcha: turkey sandwich. Well, I guess we know where captcha stands on this issue...[/small]

I did eat a lot of cheese, it's true. I'll happily admit cheese is amazing, it was a total ***** to give up.

Oh my god, cheese. OM NOM NOM. Urgh, sorry, that was a bit of a dick move. But I love cheese. Kudos to you for managing to give up something you love for your ideology though

[small] Seriously, captcha? Turkey? It's so dry, of all the meats you could have chosen...[/small]

[small]Agreed. It may be starting to achieve sentience, but captcha has a long way to go yet. Also why are we whispering?[/small]

 

[TehGingaNinja]

In one regard, it's great to have a standpoint that killing animals for food is wrong, but consider the opposite. If being a vegan was suddenly the default, then there would be chaos in rural areas. If people don't have uses for cattle, you think they would want them on their land? That land could be used for growing crops for example, and I doubt that many would give up their land as a wildlife haven without government incentive. Numbers would be severely reduced, in one sense preventing possible lives with worse conditions than they have now. As it stands, cattle are provided with shelter, healthcare, food and good living conditions. I grew up on a beef farm, so my opinion is tinted by my experience, I do applaud the efforts of people to not eat animals, just disagree with the practicality. As it stands the impact of vegetarians is just lowering the prices that animals get, supply and demand wise, which might affect the conditions that the cattle might be subjected to. It's kind of a sad situation we're in, eh?

 

[LilithSlave]

PoPiPo almost made me become a vegetarian, for moral reasons.

Tell me, is it moral to oppose Hatsune Miku?

But then I discovered bacon wrapped hot dog.

 

[Ledan]

Humans are animals. There is no magical difference between me and a cow. We both want things and we both suffer. That's all that I think should be required to make a creature worth moral consideration.

If there is no difference between humans and animals, then why should we act differently from other omnivores and not eat meat?

 

[him over there]

Personally I have no qualms about eating living things

Christ, at least wait until they're dead you monster.

That made me laugh at my own dis-ingenuousness far more than it should have.