Venezuela
- Thread starter dreng3
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- Apr 1, 2009
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- Whatever, just wash your hands.
No one was going to attack the US through Venezuela. No one was going to attack the US period.
- Apr 1, 2009
- 16,466
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- Gender
- Whatever, just wash your hands.
Everyone knows that Maduro was a piece of shit. But everyone also expects trump to fuck things up.
Possibly, ultimately they mostly just want the resources, if they're entirely selfish and just want as much oil as possible, the best way is to simply re open the market and let US company take over the industry while keeping the country stable. That would suck because Venezualean wouldn't profit from their natural bounty, but currently they aren't profiting from it either.
While its true that history says intervention rarely work out well, dictatorship also rarely work out well. Without intervention, the realistic paths for Venezuela were north Korea/Russia/Iran/Cuba or Syria. I imagine from the point of view of the average Venezuelan, they've just traded one illegitimate government who use force to stay in power for another illegitimate government who used force to get in power. Manduro legitimacy wasn't "shaky" it was non existent, Its hard to say, but its very likely that if there was a free vote for Venezualean to either keep Manduro or have the US coup, they may have picked the US coup. iirc the legitimate winner of the last election was actually pushing the US to do more forceful intervention to depose the Manduro regime. And the other way people "vote" is with their feet, and they were very much "voting" against the previous trajectory of their country.
This is a shit situation for Venezuelan no doubt, but there simply weren't any non shit future situations for them, and plenty of the alternative were worse than this.
Or Spain or South Korea or all the other countries that got rid of their dictatorship without foreign intervention. Dictatorships are inherently less stable than monarchies or democracies. And Maduroism had nothing for past Maduro. It already had a hard time keeping in power.
Not the kind of shit I want to see from a person this close to the US government the same day they did an "intervention" in Venezuela. Granted, I don't particularly agree with my PM, but I'd rather she didn't get kidnapped by some overgrown man-child and his
I think that Kattie Miller freak should get arrested the moment she arrives on European soil and get ''asked'' what she meant with this. And maybe lock her up in the coldest part of Greenland they can find if they're THAT interested in seeing the place for themselves.
Firstly, the US doesn't want to help Ukraine against Russia that much.
Secondly, Venezuela is officially at peace. It's no small thing to mount a defence against a surprise attack during peacetime, nobody knows what is going on or wants to take responsibility. And kidnapping a head of state in a surprise military attack is rather unusual. The Nazis got Norway pretty quickly in large part due to this kind of thing (admittedly Quisling helped a lot). You want to be firing SAMs around without orders when you don't know what is going on?
Russia, however, is at war, and would be expecting attacks, and thus would have prepared for them. Sure, sometimes they'd be firing off missiles they shouldn't be, but whatever. Not limited to Russia, the US Navy shot down a F/A-18 last year.
Having said that, one imagines a lot of nations are going to be setting up protocols for when someone launches surprise attacks at their heads of state now.
For fuck's sake, don't be so utterly absurd.
This is the thinking of people who confuse Hollywood and reality, and "Red Dawn" and "Olympus Has Fallen" are fiction. No state is going to fire missiles at, carry out raids against, or otherwise meaningfully attack the USA unless it wants reprisals far larger than any damage it inflicts: and that means that no states are going to do that. Criminals and terrorists might launch attacks because they can "hide" amongst innocents, but states and state actors have identifiable personnel and assets that that can be targetted and taken or destroyed in retaliation. No-one's stupid enough to pick a military fight with the world's leading military power.
One thing that's noteworthy is that despite the unmistakable decline of the west the competition is in even worse shape. Venezuela fell in hours, Bibi took out most Iranian proxies with ease and Russia exposed itself as a paper tiger.
Useless fucking "opposition"
They're not mad that Trump invaded another country. They're mad that Trump didn't get permission before invading another country...
Oh, add North Korea to that. Though Russia failed in its short war, it looks like it's going to win the long one, by stubbornness if nothing else.
And getting the Venezuelan leadership (were they ever seen as a competitor to the West) is one thing, perhaps not the easiest, but if the US means to assert meaningful and long-term control of the control afterwards, that's a very different matter.
- Apr 1, 2009
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- Whatever, just wash your hands.
Actually think about the messages here. There is no trying to appeal to emotion, no "oh how dare you invade another sovereign country, have you no shame?" cause we all know he has no shame, its how he got elected. Both are saying this is presidential over reach and is acting as a distraction. They are both saying this is another crime added.
Though, he's got not shame over committing crimes either. OTOH, yeah, calling out a PotUS for attacking another country for no good reason isn't going to work, that's their job.
I would prefer an opposition party that actually opposes war instead of just being opposed to not getting permission to go to war.
I mean there's really no ground for half of congress to stand on for opposing this in any serious way. Obama torched Libya and asked for approval after, and congress said he shouldn't have done that, but gave him the money to continue anyway. What's anybody going to say now?
- Apr 1, 2009
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- Whatever, just wash your hands.
You get 20 republicans on board then they can do something about it, but till then all they have is words. Or give them more democrats in the mid terms.
With the numbers they have all they could do is wag their fingers and say "how dare you, have you no decency?" And, no they have no decency.
Russia has conducted cyberattacks on US infrastructure.
And if China were to invade Taiwan, they could escalate by using drones against the US from various locations such as Venezuela and Cuba. Or even from the farmland they keep buying near US bases.
- Apr 1, 2009
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- Whatever, just wash your hands.
So has China, but no one is going to physically attack the US. Or military is too mighty and the oceans ensure that any buildup is easily known about.
Sure they could. And face massive reprisal. Why do you think the Cold War never really went hot?