What is with Jrpg's?

[Doug]

I am wondering about these main characters in many of the Jrpg's. You know the ones, these guy's who are whiny, weepy, very effeminate and lack confidence with women. These guy's who you must play as, who somehow get the girl.

I presume its because Final Fantasy started doing it, and like Halo with FPS's, the vast majority of cloned products tried to copy it as much as they could... But then again, I'm not a fan of JRPGs at all, so I can't really answer beyond my typical 'the Japanese are strange, do not question it' answer.

 

[Bloodstain]

There's more character development with a whiny character.

What can a brave, experienced leader develop into? A more brave, experienced leader?

Whereas the whiny guy can become more mature, responsible, etc.

Besides, not all JRPG protagonists are whiny, insecure guys. It's kind of a cliché, I think.

 

[TheRundownRabbit]

The only thing I have a proble with is the doofy hair styles, do these guys need 50 bottles of hair gel or what

 

[Zetswe]

Hmm....ya most JRPGS's are like that but not all.There are some good one's that avoid that type of main character.So OT I think it come down to the times now the target age's like this kind of hero.Were we the older JRPG's want cool ruff badass main character.I think it come's down to what type sell's more the type we like does not sell like the new one does.It's sad but true whiny sell's badass does not all we can do is wait for this fad to end.Then maybe we can get a good FINAL FANTASY!.....but that's a hopeless dream lol.

 

[Samcanuck]

You think girls don't like effeminate guys? I don't want to say you are living under a rock but...

In other words, some girls like effeminate guys a lot, in fact some girls only like those kind of guys.

The majority don't in the realie real world. As far as I have seen in my time. You telling me most women like lack of confidence or a guy who doesn't seem like they can or will protect them?

The guys end up kicking ass and saving the world, just because they doubt themselves verbally doesn't mean they do literally. It largely depends on what type of girl anyway, not all girls like the stereotype of being a helpless girl needing a man to protect them.

Look man, go out to a bar...people watch a bit. I'm just saying what I have seen and experianced. Women tend to not even look twice at the unsure guy. You might think differently, but I have heard and seen everything on the contrary. Not sure where you are coming from...but I personally think you are fooling yourself to think that most women regard effeminate/weak traits as attractive. Doesn't mean women are weak for that. Jesus...look at 100% of nature for goodness sake!

You are taking this extremely personally, I am starting to wonder if you are an extremely masculine man having trouble getting women's attention.

Especially considering you made a ridiculous jump in logic by completely failing to notice this part of what I said:

It largely depends on what type of girl anyway.

Nature also doesn't mean much to humans any more, we have evolved beyond natural selection and all that. This is made clear by the fact that rather than letting the old and weak die like nature intended we give them drugs and treatment to prolong their life. As well as the fact that we look after those who are mentally and physically able rather than shun them as all "natural" beings do.

Actually, I'm quite easy going right now. I'm thinking that you are a the type of person I am talking about. Emo I guess the kid's are calling it. And I think you are taking a few facts and stretching them to find some way of logic. We have an age limit of an average of 72, as opposed to something like 35 in the 1800's, due to medican and sanitation. None of this has any relevance to the question of a mature women (or one over 20) vs a highschool girl who wants a barbie doll for a month. Natural selection depends on survivablilty, but key personality traits are the question at hand. These are realized at affar, and most presume a weak character equals a weak person. If you havent noticed this, I do not understand you. And if you are not a female, why are you even attempting to answer the question?

And I wouldn't know very much about difficulty in the getting a girl department these day's. I'm happily commonlaw married, and have been with my fiancee just over 8 years. I am not sure your story, but I think you are confusing an average person (not a supermacho guy, jesus), and an effeminant guy. Very different personalities.

 

[Samcanuck]

I am wondering about these main characters in many of the Jrpg's. You know the ones, these guy's who are whiny, weepy, very effeminate and lack confidence with women.

...like who, exactly? I'm curious.

FF7, 8, 10, Star Ocean 2 main characters are examples.

...Cloud, Squall, and Tidus? Seriously?

I mean, I thought you were going to list someone who's at least three of those traits (admittedly, I haven't played any of the Star Ocean games, so I might have to concede that). Squall comes kinda close with whiny and insecure, but if you think he looks like effeminate, damn you must hang out with some butch women. Same with Tidus, except he acts pretty damn normal. And I can only assume that you're calling Cloud whiny because you've only seen Advent Children or something. That movie is starting to feel like a net negative.

Ryu from breath of Fire or Chrono are exceptions.

As are Kalas from Baten Kaitos, Lloyd from Tales of Symphonia, Vyse from Skies of Arcadia, Cless from Tales of Phantasia, Locke from Final Fantasy VI, Sora from Kingdom Hearts, the hero from Dragon Quest 8, etc.

Maya from Septerra Core and Terra from Final Fantasy VI might count, unless they're disqualified for being women.

See the differance between the two groups? C.T and B.O.F have traits like the tough soldier/monk, and are main characters. If you can't see a difference, there is no point arguing, you just can't see what many others (including myself) see.

Your thesis failed the instant you chose to name Cloud Strife instead of Emil Castagnier.

Jesus, they are examples that are my own view. How in the hell can you exactly fail an interpretaion? If you know of characters I am talking about, than whats your deal. Answer the question and move along. Jesus.

 

[Samcanuck]

Because effeminate looking guys were/ are all the rage in Japan. (And judging by the popularity of some vampire novels/ movies, this is also true in the West).

Wait, which JRPG main character lacks confidence with women?
Cloud? Nope, he just didn't seem to care too much.
Squall? Maybe, I'll give you that one.
Zidane? Nope, quite the opposite in fact.
Tidus? Um, nope, he seemed fine with them.
Vaan? Never noticed. Didn't matter in the story anyway.
Fayt? Um, no.
Edge Maverick? Again, not seeing it.
Dart? Uh... hmmm.... not that I can recall.

Please enlighten me as this short list is only 1/8.

Shoulda put an 'And/or'. Man, half the people seem very picky about the questions wording, rather than understanding the jist and answering to the best of there abilities. Hard to have a decent conversation with people that do that.

 

[robmastaflex]

snip

None of the Star Ocean main characters that I know of are insecure with women. This would be weird in a game that has strong DATING SIM elements.

Claude is quite male.
Fayt actually looks quite decidedly male (if at least a teen one).
Edge Maverick is a bit more effeminate in the looks dept.

Never played Star Ocean 1 (I know... crazy!)

EDIT: Just thought I'd lend a hand.

I can help you with Star Ocean 1. Roddick is certainly not insecure with women. He happily buys them gifts and such like. The only character that's even remotely insecure around women in that game would be the one with a little sister complex. And I can definitely say Roddick isn't effeminate either.

 

[De Ronneman]

Maybe its like an underdog story. Wimpy sissies turn into ultra strong tough guys

That's the thing I don't get: They go in the story as total wimps, but as soon as a baddy spawns, they turn in to gun/swordwielding badasses who occasionally throw in a spell or two, cut open the corpses to take the potions out of their guts, then go as they were: freightened teens.

 

[Nanaki316]

I would agree about most main characters but the only one that comes to mind for me is Cloud.
I have this whole fangirlism about him. I know people refer to him as "emo" but I would just say he's more a tortured soul than anything and one of the characters you described that doesn't actually 'get the girl'. Even as an animated character I could still relate to him, that's the draw of him for me.

 

[robmastaflex]

Maybe its like an underdog story. Wimpy sissies turn into ultra strong tough guys

That's the thing I don't get: They go in the story as total wimps, but as soon as a baddy spawns, they turn in to gun/swordwielding badasses who occasionally throw in a spell or two, cut open the corpses to take the potions out of their guts, then go as they were: freightened teens.

That's one of the reasons I like Tales of the Abyss. The main character has had competent training with a sword, but has never killed another person before. The games plays on that part for quite a while.

 

[Zetswe]

Well you could tell us a character so we could have an idea of what kind your talking about.

 

[Samcanuck]

Well you could tell us a character so we could have an idea of what kind your talking about.

Squall...that seems to be the least likely fan favorite I catch flak on my opinion for.
Though Cloud, Squal, Tidus, Cecil and Star Ocean 2 guy are stacked on the list for me (although I have a fondness for Cloud)

 

[nick n stuff]

for some reason physically impossible hair is a seller. if it aint broke (but which i mean the FF robot drones will keep buying this shit) don't fix it

 

[Zetswe]

Well you could tell us a character so we could have an idea of what kind your talking about.

Squall...that seems to be the least likely fan favorite I catch flak on my opinion for.
Though Cloud, Squal, Tidus, Cecil and Star Ocean 2 guy are stacked on the list for me (although I have a fondness for Cloud)

Wow how is Cecil on there and Cloud in the game is ant-social not emo the movie messed that up.

 

[Tiny116]

Maybe because in real life its thats the type of person who would have the biggest journey in there particular challenge.
They may start off whiney
But do they end that way?

 

[Belthalmel]

Chrono shouldn't count for either group because he's a silent protagonist and thus didn't really have what you would call a personality per se. Squall was kind of, but remember the guy is 17; nobody is completely angst-less at 17. Cloud was a headcase so again, only really counts in Advent children. Tidus on the other hand, annoyed the bloody hell out of me for all the stated reasons. Other then those, I do agree that VII was where things started going downhill, though to be fair, it's usually the villains who are effeminate rather then the main characters.

 

[Wintermoot]

maybe girls like sensiteve guys

 

[Glademaster_v1legacy]

Seriously you haven't played a lot of JRPGs only very recent ones. Very few JRPGs have the whiny, weepy, spazzy, very effeminate and lack confidence with women you have described. In fact Zidane from FFIX was basically a womaniser and would have been if the target audience would have allowed for it. Cloud is actually an EX SOLDIER so that covers the military part although it could be said that he is a bit depresses and weepy at the start. Squall is the truly Emo protagonist but his look after yourself attitude works for him. This is only picking 3 games from the one series with very different protagonists that defy this apparent norm.

Well you could tell us a character so we could have an idea of what kind your talking about.

Squall...that seems to be the least likely fan favorite I catch flak on my opinion for.
Though Cloud, Squall, Tidus, Cecil and Star Ocean 2 guy are stacked on the list for me (although I have a fondness for Cloud)

Wow how is Cecil on there and Cloud in the game is ant-social not emo the movie messed that up.

The fact that he is also very self obsessed also confuses people but I do agree with you PRE Advent Children he is not emo. Just a bit depressed and self obsessed but then again he is a bit of a schizo as he is missing part of his memories but that is a story for another thread.

 

[Samcanuck]

Well you could tell us a character so we could have an idea of what kind your talking about.

Squall...that seems to be the least likely fan favorite I catch flak on my opinion for.
Though Cloud, Squal, Tidus, Cecil and Star Ocean 2 guy are stacked on the list for me (although I have a fondness for Cloud)

Wow how is Cecil on there and Cloud in the game is ant-social not emo the movie messed that up.

Strange no...but rent the DS version of FF2 and I'm sure you will walk away with the same impression. 2D sprites of the SNES (thankfully) couldn't get across the weepy, whiney personality traits that the DS version showed when in 3d.