Here's something else....
'I absolutely suck at video games': Hidetaka Miyazaki discusses how he prepped for Elden Ring: Shadow of the Erdtree
A man of the people.
www.pcgamer.com
The Shattered Elden Ring Thread: Tarnished Edition - (Shadow of the Erdtree p. 85)
- Thread starter hanselthecaretaker
- Start date
www.pcgamer.com
Yup that’s from the Guardian article I posted on the other thread, but works here too.Here's something else....
'I absolutely suck at video games': Hidetaka Miyazaki discusses how he prepped for Elden Ring: Shadow of the Erdtree
A man of the people.
Not sure how true but I read somewhere that when Sekiro was made, every boss had to be beatable by Miyazaki. One of the FROM devs flat out said he was bad.
So now im about 20 hours into the DLC.
The DLCs at first looked big, but I couldn’t really explore all of them as i kept running into clifs and was forced to find passages to go down. And i think that kind of goes against what made the base game great.
Take Caelid for example; You can either walk their, find the chest with trap teleportation, or use that portal behind the church to go to Beastial Sanctum, cross the bridge with the dragom, and then keep heading south to reach it. The base game always had these alternate paths you can take to reach certain areas.
Not in the DLC; it looks like they want us to follow a very specific path? If this was a non-open world souls games I wouldn’t have a issue with this, but having a specific paths makes it 1. Pointless to even have a big open areas and 2. It removes the unique experiences of players reaching the same destination. Granted I kinda hate sandbox-level of freedom when it comes to traversing (i.e. BOTW/TOTK), but i feel they could’ve gave us more room here.
As for the difficulty, i think the complaints are coming from how much damage the mons can dish out. There are ones with really annoying mechanics, but 90% of all the enemies ive came across (both bosses and regular mobs) had basic attacks, but dealing tons of damage.
It’s so weird, because Sekiro is an mechanically- difficult game, but it only had minor vocals on its difficulty. And most of the souls game always were this way, especially in NG+ runs where the enemies aren’t given new mechanics, but continues to deal more damage
The DLCs at first looked big, but I couldn’t really explore all of them as i kept running into clifs and was forced to find passages to go down. And i think that kind of goes against what made the base game great.
Take Caelid for example; You can either walk their, find the chest with trap teleportation, or use that portal behind the church to go to Beastial Sanctum, cross the bridge with the dragom, and then keep heading south to reach it. The base game always had these alternate paths you can take to reach certain areas.
Not in the DLC; it looks like they want us to follow a very specific path? If this was a non-open world souls games I wouldn’t have a issue with this, but having a specific paths makes it 1. Pointless to even have a big open areas and 2. It removes the unique experiences of players reaching the same destination. Granted I kinda hate sandbox-level of freedom when it comes to traversing (i.e. BOTW/TOTK), but i feel they could’ve gave us more room here.
As for the difficulty, i think the complaints are coming from how much damage the mons can dish out. There are ones with really annoying mechanics, but 90% of all the enemies ive came across (both bosses and regular mobs) had basic attacks, but dealing tons of damage.
It’s so weird, because Sekiro is an mechanically- difficult game, but it only had minor vocals on its difficulty. And most of the souls game always were this way, especially in NG+ runs where the enemies aren’t given new mechanics, but continues to deal more damage
- Apr 1, 2009
- 14,664
- 3,585
- 118
- Gender
- Whatever, just wash your hands.
You will quickly find your ways into those areas and they are full of things to explore. Its only slightly more directed then the base game, still tons of freedom.
I’ve gotten into the area north and east of Ensis castle without beating the main boss (Rellana). Only discovered it trying to find a map fragment and looking for ways to get to it. That wrapped around and it led to the other side of the chasm with all the stone steps were that led down to the bottom of it. I think the main thing that’s different here is they traded the breadth of base game for more depth here. I’ve only played about five or six hours but it feels like I’ve covered a lot more ground that what is shown on the map, simply because it doesn’t show the layers very well. The rudimentary map style fits the game thematically but it would’ve been nice if this could’ve been shown better.
Another Elden Ring Parody Video from Keef.
Seraphim17 with another self-imposed challenge run.
Seraphim17 with another self-imposed challenge run.
Pinned by Zullie the Witch
@ZullietheWitch 1 hour ago (edited)
According to Miyazaki, Messmer's existence and the history of the Land of Shadow was written before development on the base game even started, still building off GRRM's writings. The idea the colosseums may once have foreshadowed the backstory of the DLC is both entirely possible and also somewhat staggering to think about, and then it's even more bizarre that they removed that little hint anyway.
The animation rig on this thing must’ve had FROM wishing they’d made a new game engine.
I've not played the DLC much at all yet, so can't really speak to the validity of any of these points, and neither can I agree or disagree, but here ya go.
(And I checked this time, @hanselthecaretaker2; this one hasn't been posted yet!)
(And I checked this time, @hanselthecaretaker2; this one hasn't been posted yet!)
I'm nowhere near done yet either, but have put a few hours in and a handful of bosses. So far it's difficult in that I've saved a couple field bosses for later, and rebirthed for an easy win on a main boss. Most of what I've seen is like a continuation from late game, but I'm sure that will change at some point.
The biggest thing is a good amount of people seem to be expecting to instantly figure everything out to make things easier. It's an open world game with a ton of new stuff to try. In terms of challenge on late game bosses it's really not much different than fighting Sigrun in GoW who was tough even on normal but could be considered a nightmare on Challenge or GMGOW. People eventually learned. There's already videos of people getting no hit runs on every boss in the game, with different builds. The final boss is apparently resistant to magic but someone with an INT build was using one of the new shield weapons with the new deflect physik and Scholar's shield, almost playing it like Sekiro to good effect.
Granted there will probably be more patches as time goes on, but even when these games were simpler with easier tells they had parts that felt impossible until they weren't. It's more a matter of how much patience one has for this type of game, after seven of them now. I'm still enjoying it, but will surely welcome FROM doing something different in the future, and hopefully on a new engine.
I still don't know from personal experience, but some of his criticisms seem fundamentally sound. It does make sense that the jarring change to "natural" progression players have been accustomed to might be construed as "too hard." I mean, for like a couple hundred hours, players have been taught that increasing stats and upgrading weapons/summons helps you over difficulty spikes. Now, with this being endgame DLC, most players are at the point where leveling up most stats results in a nominal-if-any appreciable difference, and most of us have our weapons at max... what are we expected to do to improve our odds other than changing our entire playstyle?
He's right; it almost sounds like FROM took our tried and tested tools away, and has thrown us into a brand new fire, which in any other case would be a stroke of genius, i.e.: a new type of experience in the familiar environment of an existing game, but in this case, it seems it's being received (by some) as "C'MON, MAN!!" And I get that. I'm already dreading the idea that me, my trusty Bloodhound's Fang, and Tiche/Mimic Tear might not be good enough. Like remembering times with an ex-lover on a Ferris wheel or sharing an ice cream cone on a park bench while your new "lover" has you tied to a bed with a ball gag in your mouth and your nuts in a vice; you knew what love was, and someone is trying to convince you this is still love.
I don't anticipate making it very far in this DLC; I accept that. I'm just going to appreciate what I can and form my own opinions as I go.
He’s certainly got a point, but it’s ultimately the crux of being an open world game with tons of player agency with how to proceed. They openly stated before release that a new scaling system would be there to help relive the feeling of starting base game again (something’s too hard, explore for stuff and come back to it later). First example being the tree sentinel is basically now the giant fire basket thing. There’s even a nifty trick to beating those things easier that the sentinel didn’t really have.
They could’ve instead just made it more linear in terms of progression like the past games, but that wouldn’t have fit the game’s identity. OTOH there is certainly a lot of empty space for no reason other than to pad scale and play time. I guess it boils down to how much mileage people get out of open world games and how well it rewards their curiosity and patience.
So I'm now finished with the DLC and I can say that I still don't like it. You guys know that I wasn't a fan of Elden Ring originally because i felt that the open world didn't suit the Dark-Souls formula very well. The best parts of ER were the legacy dungeons which were basically just Dark Souls levels, and it's clear that is still where FromSoft's strength's lie.
I went into the DLC with my NG+3 bleed character and trusty mimic tear a bit worried because Rivers of Blood has gotten several nerfs since launch as has Mimic Tear. But it turns out I needn't worry, i melted everything and anything I came across. So for me the DLC was easy as shit. And as a result of my experience I don't give credit to any claims of people crying about how hard the game it. This game is fucking easy, people are just stupid about using ash summons or some shit. You are supposed to use the tools the game gives you to beat it, if you artificially wanna limit yourself then the difficulty is a YOU problem not a game problem.
To @Xprimentyl that video is pretty valid. And it highlights a problem that the overall ER game has, but to an even greater degree. Because the DLC does reward your exploration with mostly trash you'll never need or want. Gravewort's, worthless smithing stones, etc etc. But the DLC is worse in the sense that it doesn't offer you any reason to use the new shit it offers. There are 100 new weapons across a few different types, but the DLC is all end game level shit and the risk of fucking up the build you have that is working to try something you aren't comfortable with already is just silly.
Moon Knight is the first boss I fought in the DLC if you don't count the ghost gravewarden guy ten feet from the start of the DLC. Moon Knight is basically Artoris from DS1 but on crack. Which is whatever fine. Ring ring, Mimic Tear comes out, then I bleed the shit out of him, dead, I win. There was something that was about to happen with like a second phase around 30% or so, but I dunno, he died before he could do really anything. Which again highlights the overall issue with Elden Ring bosses I've had since the beginning.
ER was, for me, a game of melt or be melted. The bosses attack a shitload, deal insane levels of damage, and are hyper aggressive to boot. Which make sense when you consider all the "OP" weapons from the launch of the game. Rivers of Blood, Moonveil, Sword of Light and Shadow, Comet Azure, etc etc, there were tons of weapons in the game that would destroy shit. To me it made sense, because if the bosses were going to murder you quickly, you had to be able to murder them just as quickly in order to balance the fact that your average player wasn't going to dodge-roll their way out of these attack strings. So it became a trade-off where you could melt them the way they could melt you, and getting a solid build online was the way to go.
The DLC continues that. I've watched people quit, rage, cry, scream at bosses that I mopped the floor with in one or two attempts. But the one thing these people all had in common was they refused to use spirit ashes, and were not using weapon abilities. Asmongold for example was just jumping R2 spamming the whole time and while he eventually beat things it was painful to watch because it was like trying to have sex with a Crab latched to your nutsack. There was so reason to make it that frustrating for yourself. Then he goes on a rant about how it's just unfun to play, while at the same time refusing to use more of the toolset he has access to.
Anyway the DLC is more ER, but it's all the bad parts of ER without as much of the good. The bosses are ok, I don't understand the point of the giant fire fuckers in the middle of the zones, I killed one and got fuck all for doing it so I didn't bother with the others. they are a lot of health with only like 3 attacks you can just double jump over so I don't really get the point unless Fromsoft is trolling us. The exploration is worthless, the power gain is almost entirely pointless especially since it's limited to the DLC and is just a flat % boost that isn't enough to turn the tide for a struggling player without getting a LOT of them. I finished the DLC with 12 iirc, but I melted Moon Knight without any so I dunno how much of a difference they would have made if I tried Rahadan without any.
Also keep in mind it might be a scaling problem as well where my level 700 character in NG+ with max health and damage output was just broken over what scaling the DLC could offer. I don't know. I don't care.
I went into the DLC with my NG+3 bleed character and trusty mimic tear a bit worried because Rivers of Blood has gotten several nerfs since launch as has Mimic Tear. But it turns out I needn't worry, i melted everything and anything I came across. So for me the DLC was easy as shit. And as a result of my experience I don't give credit to any claims of people crying about how hard the game it. This game is fucking easy, people are just stupid about using ash summons or some shit. You are supposed to use the tools the game gives you to beat it, if you artificially wanna limit yourself then the difficulty is a YOU problem not a game problem.
To @Xprimentyl that video is pretty valid. And it highlights a problem that the overall ER game has, but to an even greater degree. Because the DLC does reward your exploration with mostly trash you'll never need or want. Gravewort's, worthless smithing stones, etc etc. But the DLC is worse in the sense that it doesn't offer you any reason to use the new shit it offers. There are 100 new weapons across a few different types, but the DLC is all end game level shit and the risk of fucking up the build you have that is working to try something you aren't comfortable with already is just silly.
Moon Knight is the first boss I fought in the DLC if you don't count the ghost gravewarden guy ten feet from the start of the DLC. Moon Knight is basically Artoris from DS1 but on crack. Which is whatever fine. Ring ring, Mimic Tear comes out, then I bleed the shit out of him, dead, I win. There was something that was about to happen with like a second phase around 30% or so, but I dunno, he died before he could do really anything. Which again highlights the overall issue with Elden Ring bosses I've had since the beginning.
ER was, for me, a game of melt or be melted. The bosses attack a shitload, deal insane levels of damage, and are hyper aggressive to boot. Which make sense when you consider all the "OP" weapons from the launch of the game. Rivers of Blood, Moonveil, Sword of Light and Shadow, Comet Azure, etc etc, there were tons of weapons in the game that would destroy shit. To me it made sense, because if the bosses were going to murder you quickly, you had to be able to murder them just as quickly in order to balance the fact that your average player wasn't going to dodge-roll their way out of these attack strings. So it became a trade-off where you could melt them the way they could melt you, and getting a solid build online was the way to go.
The DLC continues that. I've watched people quit, rage, cry, scream at bosses that I mopped the floor with in one or two attempts. But the one thing these people all had in common was they refused to use spirit ashes, and were not using weapon abilities. Asmongold for example was just jumping R2 spamming the whole time and while he eventually beat things it was painful to watch because it was like trying to have sex with a Crab latched to your nutsack. There was so reason to make it that frustrating for yourself. Then he goes on a rant about how it's just unfun to play, while at the same time refusing to use more of the toolset he has access to.
Anyway the DLC is more ER, but it's all the bad parts of ER without as much of the good. The bosses are ok, I don't understand the point of the giant fire fuckers in the middle of the zones, I killed one and got fuck all for doing it so I didn't bother with the others. they are a lot of health with only like 3 attacks you can just double jump over so I don't really get the point unless Fromsoft is trolling us. The exploration is worthless, the power gain is almost entirely pointless especially since it's limited to the DLC and is just a flat % boost that isn't enough to turn the tide for a struggling player without getting a LOT of them. I finished the DLC with 12 iirc, but I melted Moon Knight without any so I dunno how much of a difference they would have made if I tried Rahadan without any.
Also keep in mind it might be a scaling problem as well where my level 700 character in NG+ with max health and damage output was just broken over what scaling the DLC could offer. I don't know. I don't care.
Again, without sufficient experience in the DLC, it almost sounds like what many (including myself) chided as "too many options" in the base game with weapons, ashes of war, physik tears, summons, crafting, talismans, etc., this DLC demands: "we gave you everything, now USE everything."
I'm really going to have to "git gud," it seems. My build has been pretty static for a while; haven't experimented much with my options as it felt too "in the weeds" for my liking. Hell, I think I only use my physik flask for the "save your runes on death" benefit; never once have I used it for a performance bonus even though I know those options are there. It feels overwhelming to me, everything I CAN do, and it appears this DLC is going to demand I DO everything. Maybe this is yet another teachable moment, and FROM has yet again simply outsmarted us, like Mr. Miyagi tasking us to "paint the fence" only for us to learn two years later than painting the fence has practical utility in combat.
Can’t imagine you going through this whole thing without getting to hear that trophy chime
Anyways what level are you really? No way you grounded anywhere near 700 outside of a FF game lol.
Also those fire basket things, get up higher and toss a few hefty pots into ‘em.
Last edited: