BioWare Co-Founder Promises Closure For Mass Effect 3

[Zortack]

Why is it when people demand that a company's product live up to the MULTIPLE AND REPEATED PROMISES that the company made, assholes like you show up to belittle and demean us?

"Artistic License" is not a criticism proof shield that can be thrown up to justify bullshit.

The endings are nonsensical (within the context of the story), provide NONE of the closure we were promised, render the previous games completely irrelevant, and generally smack of just plain bad writing.

To answer your question, it's because my mother never hugged me as a child. Actually, that isn't true, my mother was/is a wonderful, caring woman. There are several reasons Really. I think the argument is wrong, so I am opposing it. I think that the issues people are having with ME3 stem from an inability to understand the concepts being presented and I think a clarified ending would compromise the integrity of the story. There are also traits of nerd culture that I am repulsed by, gaining traction through stuff like this, and most importantly it sets a president that threatens all forms of expression artistic or otherwise.

I didn't say that is was "criticism proof," I personally hated Jack's new haircut, but to argue artistic value there needs to be more than just technical nitpicks and continuity errors.

The bottom line is that the fans did not create this game, Bioware did, it is not the fans' decision how it ends. This entitlement to a "good ending" are, at best misguided fanaticism and childish petulance, but more accurately described as aggressive bullying.

The "philosophy" of the endings or "message" has been attacked by many people who've shown to have a better grasp of philosophical theory than any supporter I've come across. Most supporters usually just stop at "you don't understand" or "it's about hope".

The ending's teleological views on evolution (yes, these are mutually exclusive) aswell as it's social darwinist approach to the nature of conlict is something you'd expect in a 19th century novel not in a 21st century game.

Anyone with even the slighest capacity for critical thought can see these endings for what they are, rushed, poorly thought out heaps of nonsense.

 

[Gameonicon]

MovieBob has had a few interesting things to say about the ending on twitter, I'll post them here:

In response to this:

"Congratulations, "Mass Effect" crybabies. You've officially set the entire medium back a DECADE as an art form. Also, Bioware? SHAME on you for caving. You've chosen to make coloring books instead of The Mona Lisa."

and about fans wanting and demanding a new ending:

"Look, a medium can produce ART or it can produce PRODUCT. If games can be changed at the whims of fanboys, then they are just product and we have no right to demand that Ebert etc take them (or US) seriously."

Some interesting stuff.

Then Bob should realise that the same thing happened to comics, his favourite "artform"
and by this logic neither movies (director cuts), comics (reboots) and games can be considered art. Isn't he one of the biggest crybabies complaining about Wonder Woman, Green Lantern, Transformers?

"Look, a medium can produce ART or it can produce PRODUCT. If games can be changed at the whims of fanboys, then they are just product and we have no right to demand that Ebert etc take them (or US) seriously."

He is contradicting himself. A medium can produce art and it can produce a product. No medium produces only one "thing". He argues also if it turns out to be a product the medium itself doesn't have to be taken seriously? Sorry no! "Transformers" is a product, "Breaking the Waves" is art, and both can coexist. This is just another "inconsistent industry insider defense speech".

 

[Britisheagle]

Hell I love Mass Effect, and that includes the third installment but was absolutely let down by the endings. It was awesome up till the magic elevator and everything that followed.

I will pay for DLC, even though I feel I shouldn't have to that gives proper closure. If not could Bioware at least release a statement or a video that explains the ending and all of it's plot holes?

I had heard about the rubbish ending, it was hard to miss, so was expecting the worst and was still let down. That's gotta say something. Initially I was unphased by it. Then as I thought about it more and more I realised what a load of shit it had been. Oh well.

 

[Ziadaine_v1legacy]

I've never jumped onto the Mass Effect band wagon yet, but bloody hell there is alot of bitching. I'll assume the ending was as big of a cliff hanger then Pirates 2 was, but bloody hell they spent a lot of time working on it, it's not like DaVinci went "oh dear, no one likes my planes, I'll guess I'll do what they want me to do and make stone carvings from a thistle."

Point is, give them time. It's been out for what, a week or two? If its so bad, go make a mod and do it yourself. :\

 

[Wintermute_v1legacy]

The way I see it, Bioware will roll with the Indoctrination Theory and say "Yea! that's been our masterplan all along!" , but I'll never believe it, especially if it takes them too long to release something. Too many things in it just seem too convenient to me and I believe they're just examples of bad writing. Think about it. Just like Lost, this game thing ended up getting too big, with too many characters and plot lines. Not to mention it's not even written by the same guy.

At first, the Reapers are all like "our motivations are too sophisticated, you could never understand us" *puts on hipster glasses*... and that was fine. It gave the impression that you don't wanna fuck with them. But then in ME 3 we are told their motivations are... destroying organics so they won't create synthetics that will destroy organics? Holy shit, that's so deep.

Anyway, at the end of the day, your choices never mattered so I'm not really upset that the ending was shit. The fact you can just save/reload makes every choice you make useless. Consider saving Kaidan or Ashley. Player choice! And who cares, the only difference that choice makes is who gets to have a cameo in the next games. The same thing happens with everything else. The council, Wrex, Rachni queen, etc. It doesn't matter because in the next game the only difference is that instead of Wrex, you get a guy named Not Wrex. And maybe one or two different lines of dialogue.

I've replayed ME1 many times over the years, but I just played my first Renegade Shepard in ME1 recently, and it makes absolutely no difference. I can be a total asshole and I'll still get all the side quests and shit.

Your choices don't matter at the end of the ME 3 because they never did at any point in the series.

And that little prompt at the end of the game saying "Commander Shepard saved the Galaxy! He was a hero! (by the way, there's DLC coming)" left me thinking what the fuck, fighting games have more conclusive endings than this.

 

[Gameonicon]

Then Bob should realise that the same thing happened to comics, his favourite "artform"
and by this logic neither movies (director cuts), comics (reboots) and games can be considered art. Isn't he one of the biggest crybabies complaining about Wonder Woman, Green Lantern, Transformers?

Reboots and director's cuts are nowhere near the same thing. A reboot is a reinterpretation of a longstanding character or arc. A Director's Cut is a cut of a film that was intended to be the true vision of the director, but had to be cut due to budget or studio constraints.

You are right but sometimes a directors cut ( http://www.mentalfloss.com/blogs/archives/90132 ) changes the whole context of a movie and in the case of ME3 fans feel like they have got the "theatrical" version where some things are missing and don't make sense.

 

[Kanatatsu]

Anyone else annoyed he keeps referring to endingS, as if the game actually had multiple endings?

(and pls, nerds, don't point out he's "technically" correct, mmkay? that misses the point entirely)

 

[Corporal Yakob]

I just want to know what drapes Tali will hang in her brand new house on Rannoch.

But an epilogue explaining what happened to the major characters and races of the galaxy would be nice too: damnit, I cried too much at too many times during the game to be left hanging now!

 

[Gameonicon]

Not the same situation, regardless if it changes a lot, or a little from the original. In a Director's Cut, it's what the artist (this case the director) originally wanted with the film. This is not something Bioware originally wanted, it's something the fans hollered for, complained, whined and petitioned Bioware to change.

Actually we do not know for sure what they have orginaly planned to do. We often don't know if there is a Director's Cut version or not. It is often released by the publisher/studio because of the success, the fanbase and most importantly for monetization.

 

[Aiddon_v1legacy]

the only way I will accept a revised ending is if they go straight into Harlan Ellison territory and make is SUPER depressing. Otherwise Bioware are officially eunuchs who have demonstrated that if fans don't get something keeps them in their safe little bubbles then they can just kick and scream because they KNOW someone might cave. FUCK GAMERS.

 

[DeadlyYellow]

Everyone's dead and everything you did in the previous games was irrelevant.

How much more closure do you need?

 

[Thoric485]

I hoped he would promise closure for BioWare.

 

[Ross Fixxed]

Everyone's dead and everything you did in the previous games was irrelevant.

How much more closure do you need?

Joker, EDI and Garrus are alive at the end (EDI being alive on destruction makes no sense but anyway). Actually the whole Normandy thing made no sense to be fair.

Shepherd took a breath right at the end so maybe he's not actually dead. This is too vague to be anything more than guess.

The 'stargazer' and child are alive on that planet the Normandy crashed on (or at least it looks a bit like it) so live does go on.... Why not buy some DLC to find out?

The rest of the crew might be alive, it's never shown at all.

There's no closure for anyone really, at least in my save game.

I'd like to know what happened all the characters still alive, and all the races I encountered. Can they rebuild their homeworlds, what about the fleets stuck on or near earth and so on?

I'm sure there's lots more, that's just a few reasons I don't believe there was closure.

 

[Riff Moonraker]

this is so dumb... you have no right to make them change the ending, if they do then you've all just proved that it is not art, and history will remember it forever.

I disagree. I have EVERY right to vocalize my opinion on it. After all, if it wasnt for my money, and all the other gamers money that went into the first game, there wouldnt have BEEN a second game. Ergo, I am a direct contributor to the life of the game.

That doesn't matter. They made a product, you decided to buy it. Once your money left your hand, it is no longer your money anymore; it is now their money and they can do whatever the hell they want with it.

They are well within their right to say "screw you, we aren't going to change the ending. We're going to buy a couple giant pools filled with chocolate pudding for the whole staff to jump in."

They could have made an ending where Shepard rides into battle on a baby elephant that shoots diamonds out of its butt, and they still wouldn't have to answer to anybody or change a thing if they didn't want to.

I really feel sorry for BioWare, because I really thought they were strong writers/artists. Only weak willed artists change their work to appease a rabidly angry rabble.

You give no valid reason to prove you are right, except you pretty much just say thats how it is. You're wrong. *I* chose to buy the first game, as well as the second, and the third, not to mention the DLC. I am a direct contributor to their success. We, as consumers, have a very valid right to complain if the product failed to deliver either through our opinions, or through our actions. Dont get me wrong, I am not hating on Bioware, by any means. Mass Effect 3 was surpassing the other two up until the very end. The plotholes are ridiculous, the endings are almost completely the same, and make NO sense whatsoever.

 

[Strazdas]

So basically what hes saying is "we know you didnt like it, buy it anyway"

two news about same thing in a day, the drama seems to still burn strong. it woudl be funny if it werent sad.

 

[Machine Man 1992]

Oh boy this is turning into a shitstorm, TIME TO MEDIATE!

Main argument(s) to change the ending(s): Bioware violated the promises they made to consumers before the game launched. The endings are completely out of left field, full of plot holes, retroactively ruin the other games, and are generally poorly written. Bioware should create DLC to change the endings. At this point, whether or not they fans will pay for the DLC varies, some say yes, others no.

Main argument(s) to keep the endings(s): Bioware are artists and therefore fans have no right to demand change to Bioware's work. Others argue that the fans demanding change are just upset that the end wasn't sunshine and roses and that they didn't "get" it. most other arguments are just ad hominim attacks for lack of an actual point.

Now, both sides have their points; Anti-ending people are right in that as paying customers they have a right to demand a satisfactory product that they paid money for, especially in light of the promises the developer made. Pro-ending people are right in that it is Bioware's work of art and demanding that they make changes to it is histrionic and selfish.

But that's just it, Bioware, while artists, are also a business and as a business their motivation is money. They stand to lose in the long run by alienating and ignoring the fans who bought their products and through their money made Mass Effect 3 possible. By changing the endings, Bioware stands to gain major brownie points, repairing their relation ship with the fans and guaranteeing future profits.

 

[Tomeran]

Its always nice to see Bioware admit there's a problem, even if its just the usual vague PR-talk.

But there's one really scary part with that statement. This:

"Even so, the passionate reaction of some of our most loyal players to the current endings in Mass Effect 3 is something that genuinely surprised us."

Sweet Moses, this scares me more then if the freaky little kid from "The Ring" would crawl out of my TV.

 

[Deviluk]

anc[is]

Artistic integrity? That's what fans are asking for in the first place.

Creating an ending that adds plot holes, opens up new questions and contradicts previously established lore, all the while completely ignoring the choices made throughout the game and leaving Shepard and the crews fate on a cliffhanger is hardly full of it.

This. The rest of your painting is really good Bioware. But the bottom right hand corner, where you apparently just ran out of time and drew a dick and a dog turd in MS paint? Not so much.

This and This. Time for them to remember that their art form is interactive, and therefore can't have the exact same ending for everyone, and a sucky one at that.

 

[iLazy]

I just want to know what the fuck happened to everyone D: Is that so much to ask?

 

[Don quixote's mule]

The "philosophy" of the endings or "message" has been attacked by many people who've shown to have a better grasp of philosophical theory than any supporter I've come across. Most supporters usually just stop at "you don't understand" or "it's about hope".

The ending's teleological views on evolution (yes, these are mutually exclusive) aswell as it's social darwinist approach to the nature of conlict is something you'd expect in a 19th century novel not in a 21st century game.

Anyone with even the slighest capacity for critical thought can see these endings for what they are, rushed, poorly thought out heaps of nonsense.

See, this is good a clear, calm, and rational argument. Honestly, thank you Zortack. If you would, could you link the arguments you referenced? I would love to read them for myself.

Truth be told, the actual value of the piece is irrelevant. It is wrong to demand that Bioware change the endings, under any circumstance. This is a matter of free speech, censorship, and the future of video games as an artistic medium. If creative integrity is not respected, the medium cannot and should not be taken seriously. The arrogant, self-righteous, stupidity of the Gamer community on this, has only served to prove that "being a gamer" is not a legitimate lifestyle decision.