Cheating in relationships

[Varrdy]

My mantra is that if cheating occurs in a relationship then that relationship is over. No ifs, no buts.

While I am aware that very few things are that black and white but if cheating occurs then there is something seriously wrong. I will also state that, hand on heart, I have never cheated on any of my girlfriends (what few there have been), regardless of circumstances. I will admit that I have slept with someone who WAS in a relationship (I was single at the time) but in my defence that "relationship" was going down in flames and was all but over anyway. It wasn't pretty but I still should have known better and I'm not proud of it.

Anyway - I've heard several reasons why people cheat and this is by no means an exhaustive list, they just seem to be the most common ones I hear.

- Can't stay faithful? No excuse - you shouldn't have gotten into a relationship if you knew you wouldn't be able to stay faithful. What if you own up before entering into the relationship, I hear you say. I say do you really think anyone in their right mind would enter into a relationship with someone who just admitted they can't or won't be faithful? Of course not, so you stay quiet and end up breaking someone's heart later on just so you can get your jollies. Not cool.

- It's not really cheating if... - Speaking to someone else or giving them a friendly hug isn't cheating, sure but some people really do take the piss with this one and / or convince themselves that it's not really cheating if they only swap nude images, only do oral / anal, use condoms, do it in a hotel and not their own home blah blah blah...the lines are fairly clear and if you can't see them or find yourself coming up with all manner of denial-ridden statements in a pathetic excuse to move the line then you are in for one big reality check, assuming you actually care. I'm guessing you don't...

- He / She is abusive - I have no illusions about how horrible it can be to be in an abusive relationship as I have seen what it does to people with my own eyes and I strongly urge people in this situation to get the hell out of it, ASAP! It can be scary but there are so many people ready and waiting to help you get away from an abusive partner and get them to stay the hell away from you, too. There is NO excuse for being abusive to your partner but people who are will have a long list of them, which they will see as valid. Cheating on them, no matter how horrible they are, will only pour fuel on the fire and you will end up being the one who is burned. As I said above, if the relationship has gotten to that point then it's time to pull the plug regardless! Get a clean break, take a time-out and get your head together wherever possible and then think about finding someone else, if you want to.

- Well he/she cheated on me... - See above. If things are at that point then I think it's just time to call it a day. Don't lower yourself to their level...

- The spark has gone / he/she doesn't show me any affection any more / he/she has gone right off sex - Then TALK to each other! If there are problems then the last thing you want to do is involve someone else who isn't a professional counsellor! All relationships hit snags and there could be a medical reasons, modern day stresses or you might just have to face up to the fact that one or both parties have fallen out of love with the other. Either way, you need to stand up and face the problems together, not sweep them under the rug, hide from them and/or just go find someone else to get your funsies.

- Well it WAS my Stag-Do / Hen-night - Frankly, anyone who uses this doozy needs a frying pan round the back of the head.

While I can say I never cheated on someone, I can't say with 100% certainty that I wasn't although I have no proof or admission to the contrary - I was dumped (by email) for someone else though so I have my suspicions. In any case I have seen what cheating does to people and I can say that it's a horrible thing to see.

 

[Cavouku]

I've never been cheated on, but in the past I've made girls cheat on their boyfriends with me. Anybody want the villain's viewpoint?

After a while though, you do tent to feel like the villain. You get sucked into these situations.

...

I guess I strayed a bit from the OT, hunh? I guess I'm the enabler, so feel free to take your hate out on me too.

At least you guys weren't the ones cheating.

I can tell you, whatever guilt pangs you guys are feeling, it just doesn't compare to being the bastard doing it. You always have that going for you.

Again; I was like 15, and everything happened online. I still feel like having my head smeared across a wall when it comes up, and every so often, I just remind myself about it. You feel like you never deserve to be with anyone, ever again, even for a fling. At least, in my experience, thankfully limited as it is.

...I think I'm gonna shower for a while.

EDIT: Rereading that makes me sound like an attention hogger. I want you guys to know that you're really not the problem. The one who cheats is. That girl I cheated with isn't really much more than a variable in the equation, and (not looking to belittle you or anything) so were you guys. It probably only matters if you're friends with the cheater's partner, or otherwise in a position that demands some honesty. The rest is on the cheater, and how they're handling their relationship.

 

[SilverUchiha]

I've always found cheating to be like an insane amount of work for short-term gratification and nothing more. Having never done it, I always equated juggling women to trying to be a double agent (or triple). You have to keep both sides happy and unaware of what you're doing to the other. You have to also come up with elaborate stories as to why you're not around. Not to mention you have to live your life, eat, sleep, work, etc. I can't imagine any of that being worth it. But I'm also a lazy sod who thinks that the work to get even a single relationship (while ultimately worthwhile with the right person) is a lot of work. The idea of being with more than one person AND trying to keep it secret... nope.

Not to mention the whole, doing it makes you an ass to the person you're with. Even more so if they're still willing to be with you and you keep cheating on them.

 

[UsefulPlayer 1]

"We accept the love we think we deserve." --from Perks of Being a Wallflower

I think about that line a lot after watching the movie. Not just in relation to cheating, but being in a relationship you don't like. It's really hard to say when it is time to get out of a relationship. Cheating is usually a pretty big point though. In the movie, I think it was more about domestic violence, which is probably a million times worse.

 

[Rattja]

There really isn't any reason to stay with someone that cheats. It's not something that "just happens" that no one has control over. If you can't control the actions of your own body, then you have a rather big problem and can't be trusted.
Unless you got raped, there is no excuse, not even alcohol.

If you break up because your significant other cheated on you is it ok to post every detail on the internet for all to see, including names?

This? No, just no.

Yes it has happened to me. Four times to be exact, with four different girls.
Take one, girl jumps into bed with a friend of mine while I am away for a week.
Take two, girl complains about being ill for a good while, then comes out and says it was pregnancy with her ex.
Take three, girl "could not wait" and runs off to get married for "security".
Take four, girl goes to Austria for a service year and the second skype call I get is her with a dude practically ontop of her.

In all of these I've just cut contact right there and then. There is really nothing to talk about at that point, at least not in my opinion. But I have never once retaliated, talked about it with names or anything.

The point I want to make here is that no matter what the other person does, and for whatever reasons they have, there is no way it justifys you retaliating in any way. Two wrongs does not make a right and all that.
Best to do is just to walk away from the situation. No matter how much it might hurt, and no matter how mad you are, just... walk away. Don't be horrible to a horrible person, nothing good comes out of that, be the bigger person.

 

[maxben]

I am joining the consensus, it is definitely the lies. My last girl cheated on me, but she broke down in 3 days and confessed everything. I took it rather well because she worked hard at repairing that trust. The long term or serial cheater is despicable and I have no idea how someone could deal with that. In our case the problem was that her sex drive was much higher than mine so after the whole incident (maybe a month later) we set down and made some ground rules on this. a) She couldn't have sex with someone I disapproved of. This was very important for me. Example: Her abusive ex. b) And if I ever feel like the third wheel she has to make a decision and cut someone off (no questions, ifs, or buts). c) I generally did not want to hear details about it. With all that it worked fine for another two years and actually solved our sex drive mis-match quite well so I didn't feel pressured and stressed. I only used rule a once, and rule b never came into effect because I was always her number one priority. We broke up for other reasons and are still friends.

At the end of the day it's just sex, a relationship is so much more. BUT, a relationship must equal trust, without one you don't have the other.

 

[CrimsonBlaze]

Spoiler: Why stay in a relationship when you know someone is cheating?

Why stay in a relationship when you know someone is cheating?

There are a lot of reasons for why people tend to do this. The first and more common one is the "I love them" syndrome. In the beginning of a relationship, your significant other will usually be kind, gentle, understanding and head-over-heels for you, but after some time, they reveal their true colors. Many people will not like the 'true selves' of their partner, but are so infatuated with the stranger that they first met that they will continue to stick around in hopes that they will be with them once more. They also fear the pain of the heart break that will follow if they one day decide to truly leave them.

Another reason is that they do not feel confident enough to find another partner. Whether this notion is entirely brought upon by self-esteem issues or implanted directly by all manner of abuse (physical, mental, verbal, spiritual, etc.) inflicted by their partner, some individuals believe that they will never be able to find someone else that could make them truly happy. So rather than feel the sting of rejection that comes from dating and looking for another partner, they tend to 'stick to what they know.'

One other reason why people tend to stick around in a toxic relationship is due to family and financial obligations. Some couples are unfortunate enough to bear children into the relationship or go through financial struggles. Since they are convinced that they cannot sustain a family and a steady income on their own, they tend to ride out their misery in order to 'keep the family together with a roof over their heads,' despite the various amounts of help the exist out there from the government or family. In the end, it's best for the kids and financially to go their separate ways because the relationship can stem to hurt the children, which can be used as pawns in bitter divorces or separations.

Spoiler: Why do you have to suspend all reason in order to stay in the relationship?

Why do you have to suspend all reason in order to stay in the relationship?

Again, because some individuals are so roped into the person that they became interested in the beginning that they believe that they might randomly appear again, despite that individual never existing. Since their partner could pretend to be a nice, caring, and loving individual, they believe that they can do so in real life. However, this will never be the case, because if an individual can get away with cheating, there's very little to stop them from doing it in the future. Even worse is that if they are caught and promptly forgiven without any consequences, they are most likely to do it again without secrecy. It's a vicious cycle that needs to end with the couple setting boundaries and consequences to the person cheating or breaking up all together until they change.

Spoiler: If you break up because your significant other cheated on you is it ok to post every detail on the internet for all to see, including names?

If you break up because your significant other cheated on you is it ok to post every detail on the internet for all to see, including names?

Yes and no:

Yes, it might make you feel better and in many cases, they might deserve it, but the only risk that you run is that the same can be done to you, only it could be in the form of lies. If you want to post something, post that your former partner is a cheater, that they slept with X number of people (without including names, unless there's a reason to) throughout the duration of your relationship in order to warn others interested in dating them.

Make your post sound like a public service announcement and not a jealous, spite-driven rant.

No, depending on the circumstance of the situation, it is not necessary. Instead of wasting time and energy on someone that means nothing to you, concentrate your efforts on doing things that make you happy and possibly start dating sometime in the future.

 

[Nanondorf]

Let us begin by accepting the fact that people are full of shit. When the restriction of a relationship is exclusivity, someone is bound to be tempted by the promise of "forbidden fruit" so to speak. Personally, I would not restrict my partner from seeing other people, since they're unlikely to observe that restriction in the long run anyway.
I understand that the main issue in this thread is the breach of trust, but we are talking about other people, so
it is to be expected.

Even so, I am of the opinion that cheating in mutually exclusive relationships means the relationship has run its course, since the social contract holding it together has been breached. Replying to the main question of the thread:

- There is no need to stay in a relationship under such circumstances.

- Suspending reasonable thinking for the sake of said relationship is stupid, as it only serves to further torment the one being cheated on.

-An act of revenge such as posting details on the internet, including names, is nothing more than a act of vengeance that will end up being detrimental for all parties involved. Not only is disclosure of information on the internet a damn dangerous thing (as our favorite scandal has demonstrated), but it's also damn petty. One would do better to just part ways and keep his pride intact.

 

[Eacaraxe_v1legacy]

You guys are missing one big part of this, at least in the context of Zoe Quinn's behavior raising the topic. She didn't just cheat on him. Lying is a fundamental part of, and necessary condition for, cheating on a partner or significant other, so there's little point in discussing lies.

Key here is the fact she emotionally abused him and kept him in a cycle of abuse for months to facilitate cheating on him. Abuse and infidelity do correlate -- strongly -- and one is often used to facilitate the other (cheating as a form of abuse, and abusing to facilitate cheating).

 

[Norithics]

My S.O. and I can't be cheated on. We're both 'open' toward other people, though those people tend to have to be really good friends of ours. It feels natural to us, because just like no one person can emotionally sustain another by themselves, the same goes for sexual aspects for a lot of people.

But it is worth noting that when this arrangement came about, it was a totally honest one. To be real, it isn't about the sex: It's about the lying.

 

[littlewisp]

Huh. I guess, an alternative perspective. Something I've done. Something that's been done to me.

Eight years. Not a lot, when you look at the course of a lifetime, but still a good chunk of time.

I have a very high libido. Awhile back, so did my boyfriend. Everything was great. . .until he stopped wanting anything. I thought, I should be patient. I was accepting. I told him you know, stereotypes aside, it's okay for a guy to not want sex all the time. He started going downhill, emotionally. I listened to him, I tried to help, I tried to get him to talk to friends -- anything. The mere mention of counseling sent him into a breakdown; he couldn't accept the idea of needing counseling, even when he admitted that he felt something was wrong with him.

When I told him that sex is part of how I showed my love for him, he said he didn't want the relationship to just be about sex. He all but told me that me wanting sex was selfish.

So I tried to cut back on it. I tried to hold myself down. I would hide my needs from him, take care of it privately, try not to touch him when we laid in bed; I used to be proactive. I used to try to start stuff. The look in his eyes . . . I stopped. I stopped mentioning it, I started to pretend that I didn't want it from him, that everything was okay. Every time I tried to talk about it, he looked like I was killing him. So I stopped.

I told myself I was being selfish to want more. He's a good guy. But when your partner loses that look when he looks at you, when he has no response to you when you buy sexy anything, when his compliments sound platonic and slightly bored. . .when you lie next to him naked and nothing is there -- it hurts. Slowly but surely, it worms its way into you and you start feeling like you're nothing. Because then you start wondering -- what is romance? What makes this any different from a platonic friendship where you're sharing financial responsibilities? It got to the point where I started asking friends (the kind who are honest, and blunt) if I was desirable. If it was me. If there was something wrong with me. And even when they told me no it's not you and yes you're desirable, deep down I couldn't believe it, because the person who I wanted that from was showing just the opposite.

And it wasn't just that. He's depressed. He doesn't want counseling. He tells me he would be nothing without me. I feel suffocated. I can't share my problems -- he can't take them. And I have always tried to be good with communicating, with talking things through. When your partner can't handle that and won't get counseling. . .when he says that he wouldn't make it without you, that you're the only thing keeping him going, when you're afraid to share your stress with him because you question whether or not he'll be able to handle it --

I didn't physically cheat, no. I emotionally cheated. I opened myself up to another man. For the first time in those eight years, I cried about that relationship with someone else. I let him tell me things that, to me, would constitute cheating. I told him things that, were the shoe on the other foot, I would consider cheating.

Is it okay? No, of course not.

Did it show me that unless something drastic changes, this relationship is unhealthy for me? Yes. I feel smothered, suffocated, unable to move forward. He tells me I'm the only one in the world who keeps him going. I am working full time and schooling full time. I have my own stresses that put me on the edge, and when I am out of my mind, he jokingly complains to others about how awful I'm being, in front of me. Rather than tell me how he feels when it's just us, he airs it in public, when we're in front of other people. It just. . .it hurts.

It isn't always so simple a thing as not being able to keep it in your pants. It is still awful, I am not denying that, but sometimes it's a little more complicated.

And yes, I am working up the courage to tell him. I am afraid he will hurt himself. I love him, but I just can't do this any more.

So yeah, to me, any sort of cheating signifies an end. Even for me, being the bad person. I can't trust him any more. I can't talk to him. I can't touch him. I can't get help for him.

Just a little something from the other side.

 

[x EvilErmine x]

...snipity...

my questions to you all,
Why stay in a relationship when you know someone is cheating?
Why do you have to suspend all reason in order to stay in the relationship?

Love makes us blind to the flaws of the ones that are the object of our affections. We kid ourselves, it was an accident, they wont do it again, it's my fault for not giving him/her enough attention. The mental gymnastics we do to justify it are staggering. It boils down to trust really, we share every part of us with the ones we love, we trust them with our secrets and let our guard down. It's just too painful to admit that you have made a mistake in trusting another so completely, so we don't we close our eyes and stick our fingers in our ears and pretend that it's not really happening, it never did, and everything is just fine...really.

If you break up because your significant other cheated on you is it ok to post every detail on the internet for all to see, including names?

No it's not ok, what happened between you is yours and your's alone, tell friends or family sure but to post it on the net is just seeking vengeance. I can see why people do it though (I've come really close to doing something similar my self in the past but on Facebook and not the whole internet), what's the phrase? Hell hath no fury like a lover spurned? Really it's shocking how close love and hate are to each other biochemically. It's not an excuses per say but logic and reason just take a back seat when the rage descends, you are in pain, this shit really hurts deep in your sole...somehow you have to make it stop, but you can't so what can you do? Make that bastard burn and feel your pain that's what.

These are tough questions and even I don't think I have my own answers, but it would be interesting to see if there are common patterns. Feel free to share your own completely ridiculous lies that you believed from a cheater.

The trick is time, no it doesn't heal all wounds but distance from the event does allow you to gain a measure of objectivity. Once when meany moons ago when I was with my first girlfriend she, you know what? I really don't want to pot this in public, if your curious then PM me and I'll tell you about it.

 

[Aramis Night]

Cheaters are on the same level as violent rapists and serial murderers as far as I'm concerned. They are the very definition of Evil. If you are incapable of honoring your own vows, what good are you? Why should anyone respect anything you ever have to say? You would have demonstrated your own untrustworthiness. If you are capable of betraying those whom you claim to love, Then I shudder to think how you would treat anyone you didn't love since obviously other people clearly mean so little to you in the best of circumstances. If you cannot master your own selfish urges or simply refuse to simply because they are "natural" or some similar excuse then you deserve to have your personhood renounced. The one thing that separates humans from animals is our ability to overcome our nature's. If you cannot or will not even for someone you claim to love than you are less than an animal and much less deserving of compassion since your clearly bankrupt in that department while an animal is still very much capable of compassion.

As for people that are involved with cheaters and know that they are sleeping with someone else's significant other... You are a vulture. You are nothing more than a parasite. Irrelevant of whatever you are being told about the significant other from the person your having sex with. You know damn well that nothing they tell you is likely the truth. All you are doing is helping spreading misery to others just so you can get off.

As to this notion that we shouldn't call out people who engage in this behavior I call BS. The point of calling people out for this or "slut shaming" if you prefer is not just for the sake of revenge on the part of the aggrieved party(which there is no good argument to deny them anyway). It is also done for the sake of getting the word out about bad actors so that others have the choice of making an informed decision about the trustworthiness of their associations. The only thing remaining silent on these matters accomplishes is helping the bad actors get away with lining up their next victim/s. Funny how whenever people engage in other bad behaviors there is this expectation that we should call them out on it(racism/sexism/etc) but suddenly when it comes to this, its considered bad form to call it out regardless of the personal harm done to innocents. Such hypocritical nonsense.

 

[Terminal Blue]

No that is wrong. To put it how wikipedia puts it, "Betrayal is the breaking or violation of a presumptive contract, trust, or confidence that produces moral and psychological conflict within a relationship amongst individuals, between organizations or between individuals and organizations."

Okay.. I think I see the problem here.

I kind of fundamentally reject the notion that relationships are contractual. I'm kind of aware in saying that that it puts me at odds with most of the poly community so don't take me as a spokesperson in this regard, but to me, this is what I am non-monogamous to escape, because the notion of preconditioned contractual obligations doesn't fit in with my conception of trust at all. I don't get the concept of marriage, for example, because I don't understand why you would ever tell someone you always wanted to be with them. That's not something you can ever really know the answer to, so why would you say it?

I take your point in a broader sense, though. I'm sure many people do see betrayal in those terms.

to put to it simply, when one says "betrayal" there is an implicit "of trust/commitment/contract" on the end.

For example, if a friend trusts me to look after their cat and I feed it paracetamol and kill it, they might not give a shit. They might be a callous bastard who says "fuck that cat, it was just a cat." But that doesn't mean I didn't betray their trust, it doesn't mean I didn't fail in the commitment I made to them.

I don't think you can generalize, even about a situation so extreme. For example, if you have severe mental health problems that's going to fundamentally change how I percieve your actions. It doesn't change the fact that you've killed my cat, but it does change whether or not I can contextualize it as betrayal in ways which can't be reduced to the killing of the cat as a breach of contract.

But this is getting very semantic.

Polyamorous is a pretty general term, there are a million different relationship models that fall under that banner. Bearing that in mind I don't know if we're talking about the same thing. I'm talking about committed relationships, both polyamorous and monogamous.
Because without commitment there cannot be infidelity.

I'm also talking about committed relationships. However, I don't think that's true. You can have a one night stand with someone and then feel betrayed by them, commitment or no. More importantly, however, I don't buy that this is a linear correlation, I don't buy that more commitment has to come with more fidelity and I don't buy that infidelity signals a lack of commitment. In fact, wouldn't genuine commitment be completely unconditional, entirely independent of what anyone involved actually does? I don't think that would be particularly healthy, but at the same time what good is trust if you can't trust someone to know when it's okay to break the rules?

What if a friend cost you a job opportunity you trusted them with, out of sheer absent mindedness? Would the trust you placed in them not be breached? Would you not be less likely to trust them with such things in the future?

Sure, I would be less likely to trust them, but why would I contextualize that as betrayal? It sounds like a pretty honest mistake. I don't see why an apology wouldn't cut it. Sure, it's a huge failure on their part and I'd be upset, but if I was committed to that friendship why would I not give them the benefit of the doubt, and if they kept making these kinds of mistakes.. well.. it kind of becomes my fault for putting this stuff in their hands.

Why is malice the key here? Malice isn't thought to be a common factor in infidelity.

Well.. this is kind of my point. Why would you ever feel betrayed by something which isn't actually meant to hurt you, which as far as I can see isn't actually about you at all? I mean.. I guess if it's some kind of weird revenge sex that would count, but if you genuinely trusted someone why would anything less even register?

I had another question I was going to ask. What if you had a child with someone, they were taking legal and financial responsibility for it along with yourself. And they left, never to see the child or support it financially again, in favor of another relationship?

I'd feel exactly the same as I would if they left to take part in a lifetime mission to Mars. Meaning, I'd feel extremely hurt, but I don't really see why their relationship would come into that.

I don't really have the expectation that anyone else is going to prioritize my happiness over their own. That's my job, as far as I see it. Obviously, in that situation I would want said person to stay and help me raise the kid, but I don't really see why I have the right to demand it or why the failure to do it would constitute a breach of contract, because I don't see where that contract was ever made. Of course, there are things I could demand in law in that situation which would actually be contractual obligations, but those aren't really for my benefit but more for the benefit of the child.

The issue here, again, is that I wouldn't have a child with someone if I thought they were going to bail so if they did bail that to me would violate my sense of who I thought they were, so I guess it would be a betrayal in that sense. But I don't really see why the act itself constitutes betrayal.

Jealousy happens because people realise that they can never know their partner like they know themselves. It happens because people realise that ultimately they can't control their partner's actions. It is those two facts that make people fear they will lose their relationship and thus, jealousy.

But if you know that's a possibility, why is it any different from any other bad thing that happens in your life?

Trust is a reliance. If you are not relying on your partner to do (or not to do) something then there can't really be any trust.

Why would you ever rely on anyone for anything you aren't prepared for them to fail at it?

That's a pretty cynical view of reality, I'm sure, but it's the only one I feel I can afford.

 

[Johnny Impact]

-Why stay in a relationship when you know someone is cheating?
Because some of us enjoy pain and abuse. Even feeling like you've been stabbed in the heart can seem better than feeling nothing at all. Others have somehow convinced themselves they deserve it. Abuse victims say things like, "He wouldn't hit me if I did better." Fucking WRONG. It's not about you failing to please him, because the thing that pleases him is finding an excuse to hit you again. Cheating victims tell themselves they're too fat, too uninteresting, too whatever to keep their partner from being disloyal, never understanding it's not about them at all.

I'm not one of them, mind you, I think those people are fools. I don't claim to be the perfect guy, nor do I demand everything on a silver platter, but I deserve better than to be cheated on, and I'm drop-kicking the duplicitous tramp into the next county the minute I find out about it.

-Why do you have to suspend all reason in order to stay in the relationship?
That's the wrong question. Relationships aren't about reason. They are about the exact opposite of reason. Your partner will make you crazy. The trick is finding someone who makes you the good kind of crazy.

-If you break up because your significant other cheated on you is it ok to post every detail on the internet including names?
Hmm. I wouldn't do that. I wouldn't keep it a secret, and I would definitely make any snide remark I felt like making, but disclosing the full details of infidelity to everyone you know (which in the age of social media also means everyone she knows, everyone those people know...) seems like a petty stab at vengeance, as likely to backfire on you as it would be to cause her harm. If you want vengeance, I say go Old Testament.

-Feel free to share your own completely ridiculous lies that you believed from a cheater.
Can't say I've ever been cheated on. However, I do have a story.

In my entire life, there have been exactly three occasions where women have approached me. All three times turned out to be practical jokes someone was playing at my expense. I'm not talking about the kind of practical joke your friends play on you, where it's truly meant in the spirit of fun, and you're laughing with them by the end. I mean public humiliation.

To give you one example, a girl in my high school once grabbed me and towed me out to the yard on some pretext of implied kissy-kissy. I don't remember what she said. I was confused about receiving attention from a girl, especially one whose name I barely knew. Despite traumatic flashbacks to the previous time a girl had spoken to me (another prank), I allowed myself to hope and went with her. When we got outside, I discovered we were not alone. There were over fifty students gathered. I knew that something was about to go horribly wrong, and I was right. She had written a three-page poem involving me masturbating in public, which she proceeded to read aloud. It was terrible, borderline illiterate, but that didn't matter. Everyone had a huge laugh at me. "Johnny + public masturbation" became a series of running jokes that lasted all the way through graduation. If any of those people knew where I was today, almost twenty years after high school, I have no doubt I'd still be hearing the fucking things. A day or two later, the girl cornered me again. She said one of her friends had dared her to do it, in a so-we're-cool-now-right kind of way, as if a flimsy excuse would fix everything. I wanted to do something to her, something worthy of a horror movie. Slice up her face so she would be ugly for the rest of her life, something like that.

That's what happens when women speak to me.

I'm sure you've heard the expression, "Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me." Well, I got fooled three times. I've had ample time to dwell on it and I still don't know exactly how much shame three times is. Shame squared, maybe? Regardless, I am down to my last molecule of dignity and I will not see it strapped to the altar of false hope and eviscerated for some shitbag's sadistic amusement. Ladies, I leave you alone, you leave me alone. That's the deal.

I suppose I did learn valuable lessons about the nonexistence of justice and the utter futility of hope.

 

[the December King]

A day or two later, the girl cornered me again. She said one of her friends had dared her to do it, in a so-we're-cool-now-right kind of way, as if a flimsy excuse would fix everything. I wanted to do something to her, something worthy of a horror movie. Slice up her face so she would be ugly for the rest of her life, something like that.

That's what happens when women speak to me.

I am so sorry that this happened to you, it sounds horrible! I WOULD have decked her in the stomach, were I you, the second time she cornered you- or at least walked away, as quickly as I could- her bullshit stories be damned.

I hope you have some more positive experiences with women though. They really aren't all that bad, I swear.

As for cheating, I despise it and so does my lady. We both agreed on that early on in the relationship, and we both agreed that it would end ours, if it ever became a thing. I guess that's that communication thing again, cropping up.

But as to airing it out on social media afterwards, I really don't see what the problem is, if you do decide to post about it. The cheated upon party has lost a sense of trust, a supposed partner, and a good deal of dignity and pride. This was avoidable, and perpetuated to hurt them, plain and simple. Why not make sure that the other parties get the same? It also lets people know what was done to you, and who did it- you know, for those people you know, to avoid being cheated on/ avoid scumbags in the future. The cheaters usually really regret nothing, except perhaps airing it earlier- clearly the cheating partner wasn't happy with the relationship as it was, at best was too weak to call it off before cheating, and well, the other party was a slut (man or woman). They get to walk away with no repercussions. The cheated upon is left emotionally fractured, perhaps ruined.

You know, this happens all the time, but the coverage isn't usually this 'high profile', unless it's actually tabloid movie star-type stuff. Books get written, specials get made, gosh, media loves this stuff. Though I don't think that kind of gossip and scandal has alot of effect over hiring-and-firing in general (I have NO data to back that up, that's all opinion, and I'd gladly reevaluate upon request/rebuttal).

EDIT: I should preface this by saying that, although I haven't been cheated on, I was in some really messed-up relationships, and had a chance upon reflection to decide where I stood on the subject.

 

[FieryTrainwreck]

Okay, how many people actually fucking read thezoepost?

If you read the thing, you realize pretty quickly that it's not about a jilted ex airing dirty laundry. It's about a pathologically manipulative woman wreaking fucking havoc on the lives of those around her while boasting an uncanny ability to dodge all responsibility for her horrendous behavior. I honestly don't believe Eron wanted to go public just for the sake of going public. He talks very openly about wrestling with the decision to post it online and his primary reason for doing so: to prevent her from inflicting further harm in the only conceivable manner that works, which is warning the public and backing up your contentions with loads of hard evidence. The alternative is to let her go on ruining marriages, gaslighting her romantic partners, etc. So Eron took the hit he knew he was going to take, but I'm still disappointed at how many have fallen in line with the overriding narrative that typically surrounds any revelations from an ex-boyfriend. Imagine if he'd been the one pulling all that shit and she was calling him out in public... how many people would be saying "don't air your dirty laundry" then?

Anyways, I've been in a relationship with a BPD girl (who was remarkably similar to Zoe), and it was honestly hell. I put up with it for far too long because I had seen glimpses of someone I truly cared about, but those glimpses were by far the exceptions. I'd say, for the most part, intensely attractive people can get away with murder when it comes to manipulating and deceiving plainer or less "important" partners - and sometimes they take full advantage of the fact. When that behavior becomes serialized, well, it rarely stops. And for me, the failure was trust. Not specific trust in her, mind you, but rather trust in the belief that there exists a base line of morality for all human beings operating in a given set of circumstances. When you rudely awaken to the harsh reality that some people are, in fact, selfish (borderline-sociopathic) users? Hopefully that's the end of your days getting shit on by the world.