Come on, how bad is GFWL really? I think everyone over exaggerates. I have an account and it is by no means "draconian". It's extremely easy. You load your game, sign in, and play. There, done. Just because it may not be a very graceful type DRM doesn't mean it's the worst thing to happen ever. I use it for GTA4 and RES 5. Not a problem to be had.Do4600 said:
Dark Souls Port Brings Console Problems to PC
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Oh. My. God. Do you even know what framerate is? You really, truly can't get your head around the idea that no one here cares about graphics, can you? So you're just assuming that framerate = graphics because 'It must be what those spoilt/elitist pc gamers are complaining about!'.thethird0611 said:
I was referring to the game. For some reason I didn't even think the game had cutscenes actually, apart from possibly an opening one. This is just further evidence you don't know what framerate is and are commenting out of ignorance.thethird0611 said:
I'm sorry, I didn't realise the game was free. They're not doing charity you know, this makes them money (although I question how much now that it's confirmed the game will be unplayable for a lot of people). If they want my money, they have to offer something that's worth it, it's really that simple.thethird0611 said:
Thanks, I like to think I don't deserve to be physically assaulted by a game. This game is really not consequential to me, there was just a big fuss about it so I thought 'I may as well have a look' and after this I've just thought 'Meh, I can live without'.thethird0611 said:
That doesn't even deserve a response. I'm just going to say Sturgeon's Law, and leave you to your own devices. That is, assuming you don't go off and ask someone else what to think about it.thethird0611 said:
If it's at 30fps, it isn't some of the best gameplay, and you simply can't argue that. The game might be good if it were a game rather than a slideshow, but I can easily get a better experience from pretty much every game ever. Because pretty much every game ever doesn't shoot itself in the foot by putting itself at a painful framerate, even console ports.thethird0611 said:
Okay I get it everyone is going to say "PC elitist" but I don't care, this is ridiculous. A PC game that is locked at 720p and 30fps is unacceptable. Those who play consoles might not get that because they're used to things that look terrible and run like slideshows, but it's not my fault that you guys have low standards. Xbox and PS3 users are accustomed to playing poorly-optimized games with shitty resolution and abysmal frame rates but the standards of PC gaming are higher - and if a company can't manage to port a game in such a way that it can meet those standards, which are not unreasonable and consist mainly of "run faster than a Powerpoint", then they shouldn't fucking do it.
The problem isn't that PC gamers have a sense of entitlement; it's that console gamers have grown used to games that run like shit. When I purchase a PC game, I expect it to play to the strengths of my medium. If I wanted a slideshow with blown-out textures, I'd buy an overpriced gaming PC from 2007, which is, of course, what console gamers did when they bought the PS3.
The problem isn't that PC gamers have a sense of entitlement; it's that console gamers have grown used to games that run like shit. When I purchase a PC game, I expect it to play to the strengths of my medium. If I wanted a slideshow with blown-out textures, I'd buy an overpriced gaming PC from 2007, which is, of course, what console gamers did when they bought the PS3.
Have you even played a game at 30 FPS? Or are you just assuming it's unplayable because 60 FPS feels so good? There's a nice videognihton said:
here that shows you how it plays at that "oh so unplayable" 30 FPS. And please stop referring to the game a slideshow. The analogy is so idiotic.Witty Name Here said:
Not you too! Stop it. Please. Stop. Just, augh.... Watch the video and stop...peruvianskys said:
This exactly. The problem isn't people having unreasonably high expectations, it's console gamers being exposed almost entirely to tripe to the point that they think it's unreasonable (or 'entitled' as it's the ignorants' favourite buzzword) to expect something that isn't terrible.peruvianskys said:
I actually recently bought L.A Noire on Steam, being impressed by what I'd seen and heard of it, I entered the game and immediately noticed in the opening cutscene that the game was a slideshow. I didn't even know that the game limited framerate, but I could tell in less than a second because it was that painfully noticeable.Scumpernickle said:
Yeah, consoles are running on dated hardware, and yes, any computer built after 2009 outperforms them, but the games aren't "shit". Graphics, framerate, control, functionality, whatever you want to talk about, is not shit on consoles. Would you call a NES shit? How about a PS2? So why call something dated shit? Just because it inconveniences you now?gnihton said:
I also remember somebody saying that the devs themselves said not to expect a stellar port. Yet everyone expects something better than the consoles.
TLDR: Dated =/= Shit
I guess you didn't read my slideshow rant there.gnihton said:
You know, movies run at 30 FPS (a hair under actually). How's that for a nice slideshow boyo?
I have not played a game that was capped at 30 FPS although sometimes my game spikes and the FPS goes that low and to be quite frank it is painful when that happens. As for your video, when I set it to 720p and open it up on full screen ya it is certainly playable but it is not something I would pay $40 for.Scumpernickle said:
Also considering, as many others have pointed out, they are ignoring certain standards that have been set for several years now console port or not, I believe people have a right to complain. If the next CoD or Battlefield came out and had no multiplayer in it, do you think people would not complain and be "ok" with it?
Ultimately I find it rather depressing that people need to tell me what I like and what is good to me.
Things like FPS and texture resolutions can be worked around assuming that GFWL doesn't pick it up as something modified and bans your ass. My reason for not getting it is that I just don't like GFWL, poor performance is partly a deal breaker for me too, but as I said, you can generally work around those.Do4600 said:
It's not literally a slide show but they refer to the amount of time between frames which can affect the perception of movement. Ever had an experience with consistently higher frame rates? In a lot of cases, being restricted to 30 fps not only affects visual quality, but can also cause a significant amount of input lag. People playing with controllers don't usually notice because of analogue sticks. The dead zone with controllers offsets it and you don't notice it as much.Meaning of Karma said:
The input lag I mentioned is very noticeable in FPS games, especially when playing with a mouse and keyboard where you expect your movements to be 1:1 with your mouse movements.
Keep in mind that not everyone experiences this, but when you're accustomed to double the number of frames per second, it becomes very noticeable. In some cases, especially in mine, it causes headaches/migraines or nausea.
To be fair, a lot of people are responding to the comments regarding the FPS cap with an understandable degree of ignorance. In fact, a lot of the accusations being made towards PC gamers being "Entitled" or "Elitist" is fairly ignorant. Wanting a game that performs well with high end hardware isn't entitled. How would you react if one of your xbox/ps3 games ran like crap? You would be complaining your ass off I'm sure. It's not a matter of "You should be grateful" bullshit, it's a matter of being able to provide a decent product, which so far this is shaping up to be less than optimal.Meaning of Karma said:
As Zipa has shown, people simply don't understand the difference and are quick to jump to conclusions without knowing the facts.
Lol in the absolute worst case scenario, PC gamers know that the game will work and still be just as fun as the console version.
Exactly WHY should I be outraged that they are not giving one side an advantage in this? OH WAIT your getting new content for free anyway -_-
Exactly WHY should I be outraged that they are not giving one side an advantage in this? OH WAIT your getting new content for free anyway -_-
Yeah but last time I looked games aren't movies.Julius-Seizure said:
Thing is, and I've never understand why it comes up so rarely in fps pissing contests, is that a higher frame rate allows for more responsive controls... it's to do with instuction sets being processed between frame renders.
I didn't demean From... I mean, I can demean them if it's important to you that I do so but I'd rather continue to point an accusatory finger at Bandai Namco *spits*.
Here's the thing, From might be inexperienced with PCs, they might not have been given sufficient resource, and yeah, they probably are doing the best they can with what they were given. I won't argue that.
From are probably completely blameless in all this and don't deserve the shit being thrown at them...
... BUT
Even taking all that into consideration, even if we take it as gospel truth, it doesn't excuse the fact that some fuckpuddle, somewhere (most likely at Bandai Namco in this case), thinks it's perfectly fine to keep pushing copy-paste ports on PC gamers... not to mention adding GFWL on top of that.
Fan patches don't count, though. It's got to be official support.
Dead Rising 2 was an okay PC port. A bit clunky on the volumetrics but otherwise not much I can remember about it to complain about... Sort of surprising in a way, seeing as it's a Capcom title... who didn't think to add mouse support for their RE 4 PC port.
Man, the next time a PS3 game has *ahem* 'launch performance issues' (it's like erectile dysfunction for games!), and it's always the PS3 version that has the problem, I'm going to be tempted to use the 'you should be grateful' routine.Waaghpowa said:
well if the uppity PC fans don't buy it after they demanded it, the developers won't even bother to release any more ports. They have implied as much in the past, and it's why they were hesitant to make the port in the first place. Too many PC gamers are never happy with what they get, and will burn the developer too much.Viper114 said:
It's a company taking it's first foray into putting on the PC game at all, let alone a port, and they get nothing but hate from it. I hope they never do anything nice for you guys again.
Pfffft. No. We're talking about PUBLISHERS here... specifically, the douchenozzles at Bandai Namco.Julius-Seizure said:
Too few sales will result in the all-too-predictable "PIRATES! PIRATES! PIRATES ARE WHY WE DON'T DO PC GAMES!" song and dance routine (which, unfortunately, still doesn't include the song "I am the Very Model of A Modern Software Publisher.")
Enough sales will result in "Hahaha... they'll still pay for copy-paste ports? MORE COPY-PASTE PORTS!"
A nice,post, but it has nothing to do with my post. So, care to explain why you quoted me?thesilentman said:
More OT
This isn't so much as question about graphics, but about principle.
I think that we all can agree that this is a ultra hardcore bad port. I didn't not say that the game is bad, but that the port is bad.
Buying the game would be rewarding the developer for giving me a bad port. I won't do that. I won't reward a lazy person. Or a person that doesn't deserve the reward. Maybe they did all they could, but that still isn't an excuse for missing the BASIC things that PC ports have. No limit on the frame rate, changeable resolution (which does shit), changing the controls... those are standards for over a decade. If they can't meat that, I can't give them my money.
Also, it's sad to see how low the standard for console gamer is. The gameplay can be the best thing since sliced bread, but that doesn't fix all the technical problems that the game has. Again, it's not about the graphics, it's about the principle. I won't reward someone for a broken product.
And they didn't have any experience isn't a excuse. Outsourcing is done on a regular basis in this day and age. It's cheap-ish, fast, practical and covers all the mistakes you would make. There is no excuse for not doing that if you admit not knowing to do PC ports. Whether is't FROM or Bandai who didn't think about it, I don't care. Buying the game is still rewarding a sloppy job.
And sending them a "it's okay to sell us a broken port" signal is the last thing I want to use. Every successful bad port is a message that they can lower the standard.
EDIT:
Another thing.
A petition is NOT demanding anything. A petition is there to show the developer interest in a product. But the developer needs to take into account the standard of those people who are signing a petition, because those people expect a product that will meat their standard.
EDIT2:
To make it clear, 30 FPS and lower resolutions CAN be fine for console games, but it's impossible bad for PC games.
Unlike you, I'm at best 1m away from my monitor. Even the tiniest mistakes are huge. Any fps drop is visible. While a drop from 60 to 50 isn't anything huge, a drop from 30 to 20, or even 25 is just unforgiving.
There is also the thing that most modern TV's smoother the picture out (usually blurring it, but still does the job) while PC monitors don't do that. But it could be just my imagination on the last part.
There is also the thing that I'm used to higher fps. But not only because of the smoother experience in the picture, but also because of the much more responsive controls. Once you get used to such responsive controls, getting back isn't something I would pay for.
You are not imagining it, as I posted on the last page TVs and PC monitors work totally differently. TVs use interlaced video which basically means that its really running at 60fps on a 30fps image. Monitors however don't use the same technology so what looks good on a TV at 30fps looks like ass on a PC monitor.BiH-Kira said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interlaced_video - This is what TVs use
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_scan - This is what monitors use.
Despite what people are saying in this thread its nothing to do with graphics at all its down to the differences between the console and PC tech and there is little you can do about it unless you have the facility to hook up a normal TV to a PC. (or wait for someone to crack it)
