"Games Cause Rape" Psychiatrist Defends Her Position

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oldtaku

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Jan 7, 2011
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Speaking of 'condescension and dismissal,' she'd have been better falling on back on either 'Well it was Fox, what do you want?' or the implied 'I have a vagina, your arguments are invalid.'

Yes, I realize how flamey that is - I'm only half serious. But I am half serious.
 

Niccolo

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Dec 15, 2007
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Frank_Sinatra_ said:
Cain_Zeros said:
Frank_Sinatra_ said:
Dr.Liberman said:
When the Columbine murders took place, there were national polls where people voted on what they believed caused the two young men to kill. Media violence ranked high on the list
Huh... Apparently to her a "national poll" counts as a "study."
ROIGHT! Well then I'm going to have a "national poll" over the cuteness of bunnies and then call it a study!

I R DOKTOR NAO.
The difference being that bunnies actually are cute, so you'd be calling a "national poll" a "study" to support fact, rather than utter bullshit.
Shit... I didn't think anyone would call me out on my bullshit.
HOLY COW! I just made a parallel between that author and my random act of stupidity.
Thank you for helping me laugh much harder at her expense tonight.
xD
For bonus points, make sure to write your 'study' using correct units: Kittens (symbol k) are the standard unit of measurement of cuteness and are normally utilised as millikittens.
 

Jamous

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Apr 14, 2009
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She really is rather silly isn't she.... Ugh.

Also, nice evidence; even they concluded there was no obvious correlation....
 

restoshammyman

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Jan 5, 2009
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so she claims its true coz a study shows ppl think its real?
most ppl think chocolate gives dogs worms (it doesn't, its just like nerve gas to em)

if reality was what we believed it to be, the world would be a much better place.
 

Fearzone

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Dec 3, 2008
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It's fun watching people like her squirm under the light. I'm hoping she will, eventually, produce a couple of studies "proving" media violence causes actual violence, so we can have fun ripping those to shreds too.

To cite, off the top of her head, a poll taken around the Columbine shootings is really pathetic, as if there were nothing better she could even generally reference--like a professor or team doing actual research in the field. Given she has testified before Congress, she should know of at least a few.
 

TehChuckles

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Jan 12, 2011
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you know... I used to get angry about this type of "Doctor", waving around wild claims like they were proven facts. but now I just rest peacefully. humoured by knowing even with these doctors P.H.D.s and Diplomas. the the rest of the worlds population is still smarter than them and not as a group effort either.

although I do worry in specific situations... like when the government takes these people seriously as doctors and not as over exalted businessmen with a unjustified disliking towards certain industries.
 

Fearzone

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Dec 3, 2008
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For fun I looked up her medical license to see if she was a foreign medical grad, because what she said sounded pretty dumb. She got her medical training from the Catholic School of Louvain in 1975. If she grew up in Belgium I guess that's alright.
 

Woem

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May 28, 2009
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"I did not have them on my fingertips - not because I didn't know they existed - but because I thought that everyone already knew about these studies and I had them filed away." Yes, because when you write an essay you do not keep a bibliography, or a footnote which references the book and exact page you're quoting or referring to.
 

comadorcrack

The Master of Speilingz
Mar 19, 2009
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I see... Well she is a physiatrist so we have to assume she has some knowledge of the human psyche. But frankly, the studies she chose to back up her arguments do seem very suspect. Especially when you consider the other studies done on the subject have found no proven link. In fact a study done in my home country (The Byron Review) has taken this as a forgone conclusion and started looking at what good can video games (the media more generally) do for children.
 

Mattchris7885

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Jul 8, 2009
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I will say look at the what she has supporting her claims, the official stand point of the APA (which is completely unbiased and consider every adult who plays games, in any form, as wrong as we all should've grown out of this) a study that says:

"It appears that VVGs only adversely affect some individual and those who are
affected have a preexisting disposition (i.e., high neuroticism, low
agreeableness, and low conscientiousness) which make them susceptible
to such violent media."

People in this state will be affected by anything. And an article for a game that a majority of gamers were disgusted about. She has failed to proove anything or even suggest a causal link. These studies don't support a single thing, they are showing the good doctor's ignorance on this subject.

If these people are to be believed there was no violence or rape or anything like that before there was television or video game media.
 

Live4Lotus

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Dec 5, 2009
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It took her a whole week to find two studies...that should be proof enough of how wrong she is; give me a week and I can find two studies that prove the earth is flat, two studies that prove bigfoot exists, and mathematical formulas that prove that god exists and that there is life on other planets.

All is well tho...I almost want violent video games to go away. Get rid of games where you save the world from an evil dictator, and people will have more time to focus on saving the real world from real evil dictators. Block porn too...that will cause a huge jump in rapes, and maybe then we can stop talking about the whole abortion thing when the president's daughter needs an abortion because she was raped. Oh, and bring back alcohol prohibition; it didn't work any worse than any of the other prohibitions, so we might as well go all out and make sure that the cartels get as much money as possible...that is clearly the goal behind current drug laws anyway.

Some seek to improve the system by degrees, others hope to burn it to the ground and start over...it seems that Fox News is in the second group...and I am just hoping that they get burned in the fire.
 

Iglock

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Mar 23, 2009
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Wow.

Even after reading the title I thought this must be about her issuing an apology- surely no one would be dumb enough to persist with what is so obviously a load of fabricated crap.

I guess I was wrong.

I do love how she tries to justify her comments though.
No evidence? "Oh, I didn't have them at the time." (yeah right)

Then, even better, she goes on to justify why she didn't have this "evidence".
"Oh, I knew they existed, but I though it was common knowledge"
So what she's implying is that it's not her fault that everyone else is an idiot for not already knowing about these pathetic excuses for "evidence".

...

Oh! I she what she's doing there...
 

Sennz0r

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May 25, 2008
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"national poll"? Really? So the biased view of the masses (which is biased, mind, by the connection the media made between motive and the killer's hobbies) is what passes for evidence these days? Also those linked studies are inconclusive, and regarding Rapelay Japan has an entirely different view on this matter than the western world. Is that game even being sold around here?

There, all you arguments have once again been proven invalid (I'd use more words, but I'm hungry).
 

Shuswah_Noir

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Nov 20, 2009
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Umm... Since when do public polls hold any evidence about why two people who are dead did anything? There is zero evidence in polls anyway. But to put a poll out about why people think they went on a murderous rampage is not only wrong, but it wont hold any truth, it is just insanity.
 

Sonicron

Do the buttwalk!
Mar 11, 2009
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I say this as an academic, not as a gamer:
Go die in a fire, Lieberman. If this really is your modus operandi, you're a disgrace to the entire scientific community.
 

Beccax

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Feb 8, 2011
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Right well first of all you idiot the phrase is 'at my fingertips' not 'on my fingertips'. You reading made up stories on your finger tips are you? Bit small? Maybe that's why you can?t get your facts right.

Also, you said and this is verbatim "The increase in rapes can be attributed in large part to the playing out of [sexual] scenes in videogames". All the studies mentioned, were primarily about violence, and little to do with your original statement of largely increasing rape, which the reports didn't even say. in regard to the first report linked, when they were specifically referring to videos games, they said 'video games etc...', the one part that mentions rape talks about "media", so that is all of media; films, books, tv, magazines etc. Video games clearly weren't singled out because of the lack of a significant causal link, and the way to make the link significant was to group all of media together.

The second, when it discusses rape in relation to violent video games comes under the section, psychoticism, basically saying those who are already pre-disposed to being psychotic, given the right environment, will have an increased likelihood of doing psychotic things. Well everybody in psychology already knew that, and it is environment, that is everything from a stressful relationship, to being bullied. Video games have nothing to do with this at all; they are just being classed as an environment and being blamed by an obviously bias researcher.

As already pointed out by the readers of Escapist, the FBI stats show she is speaking nonsense. Even if there was an increase, anyone who has ever done stats will know that you cannot draw causal links between two variables without more research. Stats identify trends and can suggest links, but do not prove anything unless it is out rightly comparing the two. Like Durkheim's study into suicide, one cannot say that people commit suicide less because of religion creating social cohesion, when other social factors like coroners not putting the cause of death as suicide as it would have negative and damning ramifications on the family, families hiding suicide notes because it will damage the family name and so on are playing a major role in the creation of these statistics. Maybe any localised increase is due to a women?s aid centre opening, I remember when they first started opening the centres to look after abused women, rape stats in those areas rose. Was it die to the recent release of a video game, or because the centres provided a safe place for women to take refuge after attacks, where they encouraged and supported them if they wanted to report it when the normally wouldn't.

Frankly, this women is getting on my nerves and its bad scientists, like her (though I feel sick calling her one), and probably the studies she is quoting (I haven't had time to go through each one cited on the documents posted, but I will), as I have yet been handed any well performed research that provides links between video games creating rapists, murderers, thieves etc, make people hate psychologists. If it's not idiots on TV spouting their half understanding of archaic theories like Freud, it's people like her who just deal in half-truths and bad scientific method.

(Sorry for the long/ ranty post)xx
 

Regiment

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Nov 9, 2009
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Having done actual scientific research, I can say with certainty that you never, ever say "I have proof for this that you all know about, so I won't show it." You need to cite your sources. You can't say "everyone knows video games cause rape, therefore video games cause rape." You can't even say "I have argued against video game violence before, therefore video games cause rape." You need to say, for example, "According to Bob Smith [cite study], the number of rapes has increased significantly since violent video games existed" or "When asked, 97% of rapist at Prisons X, Y, and Z admitted to basing their crimes on acts found in video games."

Also, yeah, they're proven that violent psychopaths often like violent games, but never that violent games create violent psychopaths. Case in point: nearly every person between 13 and 30.