Jimquisition: Gamer Guys

[Itchi_da_killa]

I like the flip Jim!

My friends and I have never had issues with this subject, but I have come across guys that snicker about girl gamers. It seems to be a problem among guys that can't get dates. Me and my circle don't have bad luck with ladies and many of my girl-friends have spent a lot of time gaming with me.

This subject does make me miss cutie I was with a few years ago. She was way better at Killzone 2 and Battlefield: Bad Company 2. I would get really mad but then I would think, "wow, this is kind of hot".

 

[jmarquiso]

"Guys leading me on with their muscular buns and slick calf muscles."
"using their supple, smooth bodies and elegant nipples to sell themselves on sex appeal"


Jim....it's time for you to come out of there.

(<3)

OT: Well, I didn't think that this was such a problem. I'd've thought that everyone could get on nicely, liking the things they like and peacefully letting others do the same. But if Jim's having to do a video on it, I may well have been wrong.

FYI: Jim's been "out" awhile.

 

[DrThodt]

Uhh..this is still a thing?

Come on, the problem is a little more widespread than what genitals you own while playing with your controller, it's just how internet culture works. People filter themselves into small niche groups, then find another group to pick on, it's how the internet has worked since it's become popular. Weeaboos pick on furries, goons pick on weeaboos, everyone picks on bronies. Join any niche internet community, and you will see examples of this.

Yes, none of it is right, or justified, but you will not fix such a problem simply trimming at the weeds that pop out of the soil. To fix a problem like this one, you have to pull the roots out.

 

[ShadowHamster]

I agree here, a phrase I hear way too often for saying 'out of all the call of duty games I prefer the first one, the more recent ones seem to have lost the plot of what the game was about' that "Oh you're one of those guys..."

On the other hand I never finished Zelda or Mario, mostly because when I was young we never had a console, I got to play games on my father's work computer after hours, meaning that what most memorably what I got to play was along the lines of Doom and Quake, and later Age of Empires.

So then you get scoffed for being an old gamer who dislikes the way the industry is going, but then get scoffed for not playing the same titles the others did. A few friends are in the same situation, we get flak from all directions and ended up withdrawing from the community as a whole, playing by ourselves or amongst ourselves.

That being said, what is a true gamer, does our dedication to making the best of a situation, finding a way to play games even when we had such restricted access not count. That by the time we could have our own PCs, we spent the majority of our free time in a garage to LAN, sometimes for weeks on end. Does that not warrant the term gamer?

My point here being that if I was to be given Jim's test I'd likely fail, but then it doesn't change the fact that I've been gaming since I could create cognitive thought and have dedicated my life to it.

I realise that it's satire to a degree and that it's disproportional but at the end of the day true feeling lays behind it and in effect is an attitude no different to those you describe so flatteringly.

But his point with the test is there shouldn't BE a test. It's not just that it's sarcastic, but also that the whole "test" thing is ridiculous. We are now gauging how much like you have for the things you like so the club can stay all exclusive? I'm a gamer, but really gaming gets in the way of activities that are actually productive to me, we all have these things we do that aren't necessarily productive. My point is who gets all worked up where they fit into that niche?

Don't get all hurt when people don't intend to disclude you. He is talking specifically to the "all boys club" jerks who don't want to give up their shiny exclusivity. Save your hurt feelings for the real jerks.

 

[JarinArenos]

Uhh..this is still a thing?

Come on, the problem is a little more widespread than what genitals you own while playing with your controller, it's just how internet culture works. People filter themselves into small niche groups, then find another group to pick on, it's how the internet has worked since it's become popular. Weeaboos pick on furries, goons pick on weeaboos, everyone picks on bronies. Join any niche internet community, and you will see examples of this.

Yes, none of it is right, or justified, but you will not fix such a problem simply trimming at the weeds that pop out of the soil. To fix a problem like this one, you have to pull the roots out.

Firstly, 40%+ of the gaming population shouldn't be a niche, perceived or otherwise. Secondly, until there's a grand high dictator-for-life of the gaming industry, pulling a problem out by the roots is nothing more than a fancy way of saying "ignore the problem and maybe it'll go away". All we have is various kinds of weedkiller (criticism and supporting non-weeds when possible).

 

[SonicWaffle]

Why only OUTCASTS play games here we game here because we're outcasts and she's not just not one of us she's categorically from appearance never going to HAVE To be one of us. I mean if a white couple joins a black church I assure you they will both stand out AND get talked about.

I'm having a really hard time understanding you, here. Gamers are outcasts not because we play games and games are regarded distastefully by popular culture, but because we're physically unappealing? Are you suggesting that video games are the province of ugly people, and that we're social outcasts because of it?

Samus Aran part...
Mainly the frustration with male nerd gatekeeping. It IS wrong and a problem, to a degree. Most girls in gaming I know are perfectly legit. Others just dabblers, others are tangentially related (they like cosplay and its between conventions and this social gathering seems okay and they know who they cosplay as). They are all accepted. BUT also there is natural part where someone who who looks and acts say totally against nerd type joins.

You're operating under the assumption that there is a "nerd type" beyond "someone who likes nerdy things". Does someone have to look like Urkel before we accept that they might actually like video games?

Lets say Brad Pitt got on an interview and professed his gamer credentials. It would seem ridiculous, at least to me.

Why? Is this the beauty/outcast thing again? Vin Deisel is pretty much the epitome of the musclebound jock stereotype, and the guy loves D&D. I wouldn't be surprised at all if Brad Pitt said he liked to play video games; they are an entertainment medium with something for everyone.

Male nerds are doing that to females who have been IN the culture and the vast swaths joining in recently. At least part of the initial rejection is they are new and different. And its underlining all response to them (women are reacting as a collective, experiencing as a collective, responded to as a collective).
If somemone looks like they could hack it as normal and NOT socially rejected it feels off they just take a shirt FROM the socially rejected and they are part of group that's trendy (so not just socially accepted but usually with the power).

So it is an appearance thing. Someone who looks "normal" can't possibly be a nerd because they don't know how we poor, marginalised few have suffered!? I'm sorry, but it's nonsense. Most nerds I know look and act totally "normal". There's no way to know what someone is into just by looking at them, because even if they're wearing, say, a Nuka Cola t-shirt you can't extrapolate that they also love anime and were always picked last for team sports.

Then add in the activities. Gamers gather to share stats and game, sometimes, or discuss geek ephemera. But can you have that conversation with the person who looks like she would be anywhere but here? I mean she has that tshirt but.. uhm okay. That's assuming no cosplay, not glompme signs, no cross fandom stuff.

That depends. Is she interested in having that conversation? You can't judge that based on how "normal" you think she looks. She might be a supermodel decked out in designer fashions and still have a better K/D ratio on CoD than you do. She might be wearing a Batman t-shirt just because she likes the logo and has never read a comic in her life. If a girl wants to have a conversation with you about geek culture, it's probably a safe bet that she wants to talk about geek culture because it interests her; after all, if we're as ugly as you seem to be saying, what other reason would she have for talking to us than because she wanted to chat about things that interest her?

 

[DrThodt]

Firstly, 40%+ of the gaming population shouldn't be a niche, perceived or otherwise. Secondly, until there's a grand high dictator-for-life of the gaming industry, pulling a problem out by the roots is nothing more than a fancy way of saying "ignore the problem and maybe it'll go away". All we have is various kinds of weedkiller (criticism and supporting non-weeds when possible).

Is it really 40%+ of the gaming population that reacts in this way? If that's really the case, there really is no hope for it. As far as a valid solution, I'm really just leaning towards a more sociological approach, not simply getting into shouting wars that no one wins. I've seen such tactics applied, and the minority always just ends up oppressed, and feeling alienated from their own community. Sound familiar?

 

[Gamer_152]

I fuckin' loved this one Jim, excellent use of Holmes as well.

 

[Darmani]

Why only OUTCASTS play games here we game here because we're outcasts and she's not just not one of us she's categorically from appearance never going to HAVE To be one of us. I mean if a white couple joins a black church I assure you they will both stand out AND get talked about.

Are you being held in gaming against your will?
Never `having` to be one of us? As if it's some terrible thing to resort to?
You don't sound like you enjoy it.

You know, you might have had a point if only conventionally attractive women who are new to gaming got this fake shit, but they don't. I'm kind of a plain-jane myself, and not new at all to gaming- and I was an OUTCAST too, and I still get this crap.
And it has to stop.

Agreed. Sorry I ever did it. Just saying it happens for a reason and its not some unsympathetic ones. The message is still right. Stop gatekeeping its horrible. Stop assuming any girl you see isn't part of the deal, that's sexist. Don't quiz her, you may personally only be dealing iwth fear or skepticism but she's been going through this hour after hour for ten years and its unwelcoming.

 

[Doug]

I am alittle perplexed - is the whole "OMG, lots of fake girl gamers" thing a thing again/still? I thought it'd died away already.

 

[RJ Dalton]

It was a good setup for a joke, but you wore it down to the point of it not being funny before the video was finished. I got a little more than halfway through the rant before I got bored with it.

 

[Quellist]

Actually this sorta fell a little flat on me as a gamer geek who is bitter that the people who used to take the piss out of me in school for being a gamer are now the target audience for most triple A titles....

Gender issues aside ofc and i do see what Jim was getting at which is a different point entirely

 

[SonicWaffle]

Is it really 40%+ of the gaming population that reacts in this way? If that's really the case, there really is no hope for it.

I think the 40%+ figure was meant to indicate female gamers, rather than gamers who get all shitty about female gamers.

 

[Goliath100]

My point remains the same - why does the priority need to be adaptation at all? If novels work better than movies as the basis for a video game, then shouldn't something designed with a video game in mind be a better fit than either? Rather than adapting books because they might work better, we should be coming up with new ideas that will work better because that's what they were written for.

In a ideal world all that would be true, but we don't leave in a ideal world.
1: There will always be adaptations from one medium to another.
2: Great adaptations demand creative thinking. It's a easy way for innovation too.

 

[RichardThompson]

I found this was quite good, but taking a juxtaposing scenario to bring light to the mediocrity of "dying nerd culture" and "hate to girl gamers" made it a little difficult to follow; I found myself getting a bit muddled up when you flipped from one topic to another at very short notice.

 

[Imp_Emissary]

Jim could never fit in there. He's too.....Awesome! Yeah, awesome....
<__>

Anyway, xD Ya killed me again Jim! You really don't do thing half way, do you?

Thank God for you Jim. [sub](And I don't just say that because it makes me look like a Geek Boy. I also really mean it. ;D)[/sub]

Did we learn our lesson then?

I have no idea what your talking about.

Also, don't mean to kill your hopes, but Jim is already married. Or he was the last time I checked.

 

[Vegosiux]

But again I ask: is that any excuse to treat people who have done nothing wrong poorly? If you have psychological baggage, then you should either deal with it, or at least accept responsibility for what happens. If someone has a bad experience with a black person, that doesn't make them becoming a flaming racist "okay." They're still going to be responsible for what they say and do, and being racist is still not acceptable. If they can't bring themselves to treat people with respect, then the only responsible course of action is to get help and separate themselves from those situations as much as possible.

But that's just the thing. Where's the line between simply "being cautious around black people because of a prior bad experience" and "being a bigoted racist"? And remember, in this case, this is a case not of "being black" but "utilizing traits commonly attributed to black people". There's a difference and the people who know it can shamelessly take advantage of it.

A "gurrrl gamer" isn't necessarily female, they're simply someone who's utilizing female sex-appeal in order to get ahead. Guys do that too. Quite commonly, actually.

So if a person's baggage regarding women is really so great that it's preventing them from treating them with a certain level of respect and decorum, then they need to isolate themselves until they've got it under control.

Oh no. No no no no no. I'm sorry, but you're off the mark here. Isolation will only serve to make the confirmation bias worse. It's a vicious cycle, and isolation is not something you'd want to enforce unless the person in question is clearly and obviously a physical danger to themselves and people around them.

You can't just run around for your entire life being a total asshole and hiding behind "Oh, but I have issues with my past!" every time someone calls you out on it.

Agreed on this one. But, to go on with an analogy, as a rule of thumb if you meet such a person, write down a therapist number for them and hand it to them; and only go medieval on their ass if they refuse to see reason.

 

[SonicWaffle]

My point remains the same - why does the priority need to be adaptation at all? If novels work better than movies as the basis for a video game, then shouldn't something designed with a video game in mind be a better fit than either? Rather than adapting books because they might work better, we should be coming up with new ideas that will work better because that's what they were written for.

In a ideal world all that would be true, but we don't leave in a ideal world.

I don't see what that has to do with anything. We don't live in a perfect world, so we might as well content ourselves with adapted versions of proven stories rather than strive to create new stories that are a better fit for the medium? Great Expectations is a popular book with clear long-lasting appeal, but would you rather play the FPS adaptation or a totally new game I've just made about Bubbalicious, a levitating horse who can fire flaming daffodils out of his ears? One might be a great story, but that won't necessarily translate to a great game story, whereas the story for Bubba's Equine Quest was created to be a video game and therefore the narrative structure is designed to fit a game rather than the game having to be fit in around the narrative.

1: There will always be adaptations from one medium to another.

Correct. This does not mean those adaptations should take precedence over new IP.

2: Great adaptations demand creative thinking. It's a easy way for innovation too.

But great adaptations, as you pointed out earlier in this thread, are few and far between. What we get more often is an game being hampered to fit around the established story rather than being designed to work hand-in-hand with the medium of video games.