Mass Effect 3: The Process

Biodeamon

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Oh god, i haven't bought Mass Effect 3 yet. what is this horrible eldritch abomination of an ending we're talking about?! the suspense is killing me. DON'T SPOIL IT FOR ME!
 

search_rip

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Jan 6, 2009
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if Mass Effect 3 teach us something is that at the end everything you love will crush your heart :'( *grabs more icecream*
 

Trishbot

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Wolfram23 said:
I don't get it. Can someone explain to me, a person who has not played Mass Effect, what the big deal is? I read about the endings on some spoiler thing and I just don't understand the issue. Is it because it's hard to get the happy ending? You can't deal with a depressing ending? Other?
http://www.play-mag.co.uk/general/why-the-mass-effect-3-ending-sucked/

There are a LOT of problems with the ending. Believe it or not, most people aren't upset that the ending isn't happy. It's the many OTHER problems. This site does a very good job of summing them all up... and there's a lot to cover about why these endings just don't work. At all.
 

i am not god

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Exactly that, you're damn right guys.

I need a Garrus body pillow thing like that to get over it. Probably never will.
 

Canadian Fodder

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May 19, 2009
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How dare they send us through that emotional rollercoaster and then give us that damned ending. If I could just block out the last 10 min, everything would be all right.
 

VonKlaw

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SirBryghtside said:
I liked the ending. What the hell makes it 'universally wrong' that I'm not seeing?!

...then again, I liked the ending of Deus Ex: Human Revolution, too. So maybe I'm just an idiot.
Atleast the ending of DE:HR was going to be relatively pointless since it was a prequel and all.
 

feauxx

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Sep 7, 2010
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sordcooper said:
uh, yeah, control was the paragon option, you take control of the reapers and can therefore send them all back to dark space and stop the war outright. Besides, only merge or destroy ended up with the relays being blown up i think. Still, all awful endings
that's the thing. the blue/control/paragon option was represented by the illusive man. the red/destroy/renegade option is represented by captain anderson. obviously this hints at something being very wrong and warped about the representation of these choices. captain anderson is a true paragon and the illusive man is and obvious renegade. the child seems to agree most with the control and synthesis option. he admits the illusive man was indoctrinated so it's safe to say that with the illusive man trying to convince shepard the reapers can be controlled it was actually the reapers indoctrination speaking. the synthesis option is what would happen if the reapers aren't stopped, they will process all organic life. if you choose control the same thing will happen cause just minutes earlier you told the illusive man that the reapers can't be controlled, they'll just let you think that cause you'll be indoctrinated. captain anderson tells you not to listen to the illusive man and fight to the end to stop the reapers. this ending also gives the little extra scene of shepard still being alive in the rubble of london on earth.

i personally think everything from the point that harbinger shows up and knocks you out is tainted with indoctrination. everything changes at that point. camera, gameplay, hud, ammo, your armor is gone, the blurry vision, the oily black stuff on the side of the screen when the illusive man speaks, your armor is gone and suddenly you can breathe in space as well. i could go on and on about this probably. but yeah, i think there is a lot more to it. the child haunts your dreams, going up in flames and ultimately setting you on fire too in the last dream, shepards downfall. because of this i think all endings are bad, with the destroy option being the canonically correct one. destroying the reapers has been your main goal since the very beginning. my guess is the story isn't finished.
 

Daft Ghosty

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Trishbot said:
*Me before beating ME3* - "Man, what whiners! All these people are so entitled! C'mon, they wouldn't have been satisfied with any ending! Bioware fans are the worst! They exaggerate everything. No way are the endings THAT bad!"

*Me after beating ME3* - "Oh, go to hell, Bioware. You go straight to hell. Do not pass Go. Do not collect 200 dollars. Go directly to hell."

I'm starting to think the ending of Neon Genesis Evangelion was better... and they got death threats over that.
This ^^^

I'd have to agree. It's one of the few stories where I got to the end, and was pissed by the ending so much that I sold off all my NGE dvd box sets, and set about blocking the show from my mind, and forgetting that it ever was. My only hope currently with ME3 is to hold onto a fan fic ending someone wrote, b/c I don't see Bioware fixing this insult.
 

Jhonny Malkav

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You know guys, I see at least two ironic things here
1) Catalyst was right about creations always turning on theire creators! That would be ME3 and Bioware/EA. Goes for organics vs synthetics too =)
2) (Thought about it after seeing the ME race quizze) Shepard tried to save galaxy against impossible odds. Now the entire galactic population tries to save him insted.

Russia is with u on this one. Go team :p
 
Dec 14, 2009
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Trishbot said:
*Me before beating ME3* - "Man, what whiners! All these people are so entitled! C'mon, they wouldn't have been satisfied with any ending! Bioware fans are the worst! They exaggerate everything. No way are the endings THAT bad!"

*Me after beating ME3* - "Oh, go to hell, Bioware. You go straight to hell. Do not pass Go. Do not collect 200 dollars. Go directly to hell."

I'm starting to think the ending of Neon Genesis Evangelion was better... and they got death threats over that.
Oh man, that's exactly my thought process.

I didn't think anything short of a corporeal being manifesting and kicking me in the balls would ruin the game for me.

But they did. Bioware fucked up big time.

I still love the game, but damn.

It could have been so much better. I don't even care if it was a cheesy 'A New Hope' ending, so long as I got some closure.
 

FFHAuthor

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Adam Jensen said:
Loonerinoes said:
I'll just leave this right here for all you lovely ragers. :)

http://penny-arcade.com/report/editorial-article/why-the-ending-of-mass-effect-3-was-satifying-and-worthy-of-the-series-mass
We don't hate the ending just because it didn't provide any sense of closure, we hate it because logically it didn't make any sense. There are more loopholes in that ending then stars in the fuckin' galaxy.
I've begun to look at the counter argument to all those statements of 'if you hate the ME3 ending you're an uncultured fool who just wants mary-sue endings!' along these lines:

If you were to splice the last fifteen minutes of The Return of the King onto Return of the Jedi gives you the same ending tone, in theory, bad guys lose, good guys die, some people sacrificed themselves and redeemed themselves in a way. In essence the story gets resolved the same way, with the same form, triumph over massive oppressive evil in the face of terrifying odds. Honestly, it's the same theme...but it's not the same characters, it's not the same setting, it's not the same plot, it's not the same struggle, if you look at the specifics, you notice it's different, it's out of place, it doesn't fit, it's alien to the entire film.

THAT is the same thing that happened with the ME3 ending. Is your character sacrificing himself in the face of overwhelming odds? Yes. Is he choosing from options placed before him? Yes. Is he trying to be the hero and win? Yes. Those all fit with the Mass Effect series completely. But the mechanics aren't what defines a game built on story and characters. It's just that Luke Skywalker isn't Frodo. Saruron isn't the Emperor. A long time Ago in a Galaxy Far Far Away isn't Middle Earth.

Fine, all the 'cultured' and 'all knowing' critics of the Game industry might be able to say 'well, that's how the game HAD to end, with Shepard's death!' are kind of missing the things that matter more than generic themes and tone in a story; plot, characters, motivation, setting, consistency of the universe.

Daft Ghosty said:
My only hope currently with ME3 is to hold onto a fan fic ending someone wrote, b/c I don't see Bioware fixing this insult.
Which one are you going with? I just hammered out the start to my own yesterday.
 

Xathos

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Zachary Amaranth said:
Bang on, guys. I am so loving you right now.

DVS BSTrD said:
Okay now you guys are really starting to scare me. Hold me Garrus!
It's not gay if it's with a Turian.
I always just assumed everyone was gay for Garrus, or its not gay if its with Garrus. =)

Anyways...yeah, I think this is how I feel. Not to the extent of Erin, but its been like 3 days since I beat the game...and I'm still not sure what to think.

I know a lot of people are hoping that the ending is just some secret Indoctrination test or something, but that doesn't make too much sense to me. Likewise, the original ending from the original writer Drew, I felt was really predictable since ME2 and I'm actually glad they changed it (though I wish they didn't drop the plot point entirely).

Mass Effect 3 was just...just awesome. It hit a lot of points really well, and it captured the feel of an overpowering invasion almost perfectly. The writing and dialogue was still excellent, the crew interaction was much better and more involving, none of the side missions or story missions felt like they didn't belong.

But the ending starting from the elevator sequence...ugh. So disjointed that it felt like it literally pulled me away from the experience forever, especially in future playthroughs. Every time I see something mass effect related (mostly songs), I can't help but feel depressed.

And the thing is, the after credits don't bother me. The tali thing, import bugs, day one DLC, occasional glitched mission, technical problems, the Catalyst(to an extent), all of that I could ignore. Hell, I could forgive the endings, and actually didn't mind whether I got a happy or depressed ending. It was the lack of closure that killed me. Yes, the endings are bull crap and the Normandy situation makes no sense, but if I at least got SOMETHING regarding everyone (preferably NOT something like the Dragon Age text ending explanations) then I could at least be angry, but somewhat glad.

But if you want more insight into my feelings of the matter, hit the very obvious spoiler below...granted most of this has been said before. Also, quite a long, long read. Sorry.



I felt absolutely horrible, that I was screwing everybody over in every ending. These decisions I felt, were just a tad too big for Shepard to make. Of course, they are also extremely vague.

The Destroy ending gets rid of all synthetics, but Legion had sacrificed his Identity in order to help the Geth. Doing that would be a big Screw You to him, what he stood for, and everything you sacrificed during those Geth/Quarian missions. Likewise, we don't know how much synthetic things are destroyed. Is it just AI? Does it encompass all technology like VIs, Omnitools, and the various implants soldiers have?

The Control ending seemed preferable, but how could I assume I could totally control the reapers? Do I become the Catalyst itself and tell them all what to do? I am constantly conversing with the Reapers for the rest of their lives or something? Am I now the head Reaper in charge? Or do I just send them away for a while? Plus, even though TIM was technically right, the fact that I had told him how stupid he was only 3 minutes before hand made me seem like a big hypocrite if I were to choose. Also, it was HIS idea. Not touching that with a ten foot pole.

The Synthesis ending seems like "the best" ending, especially if you have been a Paragon Shepard for most of the game. But how does it manage to affect all Organics? The other two endings affected just the Reapers and Synthetics, which I could buy. But this plan somehow involves rewriting the DNA of all life with almost no explanation? And since I'm putting my whole being into this, does that mean people will actually know what I have done? Am I like...sort of a part of everyone or something? And how much of a change are we talking about? Can we converse in a sort of hivemind now like the Geth? If so, can we do the same to the Reapers?

So besides all of that not getting answered, we have a new problem: The Mass Relays. Now, I'm fine with the Mass Relays not working/being destroyed. I totally believe the galaxy can build new ones (ever the optimist that I am), but its pretty vague on HOW they are destroyed. When we destroyed the Alpha Relay in Arrival, we killed 300,000 Batarians. Granted, we shot a big asteroid at it, but does the same apply to the other Relays? Is the explosion going to be smaller, bigger, or the same as in Arrival? If its bigger or the same, guess what? We killed pretty much everyone because in EVERY ending, the Relays get destroyed. Think about how Tuchanka, Rannoch, Sur'kesh, and even Earth, are all next to those relays. Is everyone there dead? If so, then curing the Genophage and bringing peace between the Quarian and the Geth seem almost pointless. Hell, the whole "Take Earth Back" that's been hammered in the marketing and in the game now means nothing since Earth is screwed.

But let's assume that the destruction of the Relays doesn't kill everyone in the vicinity. The Relays send the energy forward to the next Relays, and the resulting discharge simply causes the Relays to crumble in a ball of fire. OK, I can buy that; but how would I know for sure? This Reaper AI told me so? Even if this thing isn't threatening me, I can't trust what it says. How would I, or Shepard for that matter, know what would happen? What about the Quarians and Turians that are on Earth? If they are stranded there, how are they going to survive without proper food? Are we somehow able to make food tailored to them? If not, do they mostly just die off?

And this Reaper AI thing. I actually, don't have TOO big a problem with it. Even the whole plot of the Reapers being Organic who turned into Synthetic/Organic hybrids to stop (read, kill and transform) Organics from repeating the mistake of making Synthetics is OK. Sure its hypocritical and flawed, but I can understand it to a point. Many see that because it exists, that Sovereign, the big bad of ME1 is now useless, but that isn't the case. Sovereign was actively seeking a way to bring the Reapers through the Citadel because the Reaper Signal that went to the Keepers to activate it was blocked/changed. Its OK to assume that the Reaper AI sends the signal to the Keepers to do the job; like with the Relays, its a shame they don't tell us this outright, but lets assume. The problem I have is its attitude. We get to it, and all it says is "Yeah, you won, we totally lost"? They still have Reapers in other systems, and Shepard is pretty much spent at this point. The Reaper AI has no evil motive whatsoever to try and stop or dissuade me? Its actually trying to help me? I GUESS I can sort of get it, but not really. Then it presents you with 3 different alternatives, but all of them sort of seem like they win anyway. Destroy Synthetic Life? Well, that's sort of been their goal but not really; plus you are possibly destroying all tech in the galaxy, which is almost like being wiped out in a sense. Synthesis? That's technically what the Reapers are in the first place, only on a much smaller scale body wise. Control? Well well, isn't that exactly like Indoctrination. Again, it was an idea brought up by TIM as he was being controlled by the Reapers.

In hindsight, an investigate option with this thing would have worked out really well. However, I guess Bioware didn't want to boggle us down with some technobabble or big long winded explanations at the end, which I can understand. However, throughout the game, and actually the series, Shepard has done almost the impossible. They said he couldn't go to Ilos and/or stop Sovereign, and he/she did just that. They said going through the Omega 4 relay was certain death, he/she came back (with various success of course). In Mass Effect 3, Shepard believes it'll be quite hard, mostly impossible to possible win against the Reapers...and he's/she's right? Shepard has nothing to say back to this AI? He/She can't bring up that they are now working together WITH Synthetics like the Geth so the whole cycle thing is bull crap? There isn't some other option that Shepard can't find?

Now, I'm fine with a downer ending. But for Shepard to just believe this AI thing without resistance? Seems a bit off.

Harbinger. Poor Harbinger. He was the big bad of ME2, but has no lines or anything super important besides shooting a laser at Shepard. I don't really understand why. Maybe budget reasons? I totally thought he was going to ASSUME DIRECT CONTROL over TIM's body or the AI and try to do something.

And of course, the Normandy situation. Again, due to the vagueness of it all, the whole thing looks stupid. Joker somehow got to Earth, picked up all of my team mates(who again, due to the vagueness of it all, I thought were all dead when Harbinger showed up), all uninjured by the way, then turned to the Mass Relay and started going through it, in the span of less than 10 minutes? He somehow, knew that a big beam of energy would shoot out from the Crucible/Citadel, and despite its speed and energy, was able to outrun it for a time? Perhaps it would make sense if I had warned him on the way to making my decision, or overheard him say he was coming to my location but still. I have no problem with the Normandy surviving on a nice planet...but if they are the only ones left in the galaxy (when taking into account Mass Relay destruction) then isn't the crew a bit too small to repopulate? Again, the concept of food has to come up for Tali and Garrus, we have no idea if they will survive.

There are just other small points that annoy me. The Echo Shard Javik gives you on Earth doing absolutely nothing in the end. The fact that despite this game having more connection to your crew than the other games, you have to do everything after Harbinger alone. The idea that you have to make these big 3 choices, with no input from anyone other than an AI belonging to the enemy and just yourself. The fact that the Normandy and your crew do pretty much NOTHING in regards to try and help you in the last 10 minutes. Smaller plot points like Aria not doing anything in regards to try and take back Omega seem to scream a bit of DLC (which technically isn't a bad thing if done right), the Yahg showing up but do nothing at all even though they seemed really interesting. The Dark Energy plot line from the 2nd game not really doing anything at all, even if the original plot line had changed. Would have like to see something regarding the Omega 4 or the Reaper IFF considering ME3 took the time to actually go back to old familiar places that were pretty important. Or maybe Ashley having quite a bit more to say to the crew instead of just hanging around doing nothing. Again, all of this is just super small annoyances that don't really hinder the game, just my personal stuff.

Whew, felt good to get all of THAT off my chest.

Mass Effect 3 truly was awesome, and I'm really glad that I got to experience and play such an epic game series. I would even encourage a lot of people to try it out! I don't even know if I will ever experience such attachment to characters or care about the universe in other games as I did for Mass Effect. And yet, the ending has left such a scar, that I don't know if it will ever heal (unless there is some DLC for more endings or something, and they would have to be on the same quality of writing and dialogue as the rest of the game of course).
 

Hat Man

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Nov 18, 2009
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Pretty much my feelings on the matter exactly, except I don''t have a hugging pillow.

I wonder where I could pick up one of Tali, just to complete the picture.
 

Valanthe

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Akichi Daikashima said:
People are just afraid to let go I guess, I for one, was a bit sad, but all good stories need an ending...
It's less that we're afraid to let go, and more that if this is what we worked up to, then why did we bother?

I cannot speak for everyone, but I can speak for myself. I did expect a 'happy' ending, with Shepard flying off into the sunset. I expected an ending true to the series. One that would leave me sad that the journey was over, but glad to have made it. Shakespeare's Romeo and Juliet comes to mind. The end is tragic, but it leaves off with hope, Their sacrifice, made through love, has finally brought an end to this bitter, pointless war that has already claimed the lives of great men. You do not smile at that ending, but in your heart you know that it was worth it, and that story proves that you do not need to smile at an ending for it to be good.

What we are given is something else entirely. We are given an ending where not a single choice made by any character matters, everything we have worked, bled and sacrificed for is absolutely pointless and has absolutely no bearing on these three choices before which, no matter what we choose, further invalidates the story told. I could write an essay on why the ending to Mass Effect 3 is a literary travesty, and perhaps one day I'll have the opportunity, But I've already subjected you to a large enough wall of text, so I will simply leave off in saying that the ending to this series makes me cry, but these tears are not the same I shed when Juliet cried "Oh happy dagger!" These are the tears I shed when a story which I would very happily rank alongside Shakespeare, Tolkien, and Lewis, so utterly collapses in the final scene to nearly make me ot want to experience it again.
 

BX3

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Jeebus, I've been hearing about this dreaded ending pretty much everywhere, was it that bad?
What the hell happened? Did the entire franchise turn out to be a dream all along or something?

[You'll have to forgive my ignorance. I don't follow the series at all.]
 

pheerless

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Mar 13, 2012
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Still depressed or angry...depending on the day. I love this comic, gave me a little smile in these dark times. LOL. Anyone here should cruise over to the Bioware forums and check out the rage over there, epic doesn't describe it.
 

ArchBlade

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Sep 20, 2008
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This is startlingly accurate, given my experience.

SO UH... Where can I get a Garrus body pillow? Just out of curiosity...
 

Darkmantle

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BX3 said:
Jeebus, I've been hearing about this dreaded ending pretty much everywhere, was it that bad?
What the hell happened? Did the entire franchise turn out to be a dream all along or something?

[You'll have to forgive my ignorance. I don't follow the series at all.]
the basic issue is that the finale of the game is essentially "well you are fucked, but please, press buttons A B or C to choose your ending cinematic"

Did you play a model citizen? Doesn't matter same ABC

Did you play a violent Arrogant Prick? doesn't matter ABC

did you speed run the games? Doesn't matter ABC

Did you painstakingly complete EVERY sidequest? doesn't matter, ABC
 

Carboncrown

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feauxx said:
sordcooper said:
uh, yeah, control was the paragon option, you take control of the reapers and can therefore send them all back to dark space and stop the war outright. Besides, only merge or destroy ended up with the relays being blown up i think. Still, all awful endings
that's the thing. the blue/control/paragon option was represented by the illusive man. the red/destroy/renegade option is represented by captain anderson. obviously this hints at something being very wrong and warped about the representation of these choices. captain anderson is a true paragon and the illusive man is and obvious renegade. the child seems to agree most with the control and synthesis option. he admits the illusive man was indoctrinated so it's safe to say that with the illusive man trying to convince shepard the reapers can be controlled it was actually the reapers indoctrination speaking. the synthesis option is what would happen if the reapers aren't stopped, they will process all organic life. if you choose control the same thing will happen cause just minutes earlier you told the illusive man that the reapers can't be controlled, they'll just let you think that cause you'll be indoctrinated. captain anderson tells you not to listen to the illusive man and fight to the end to stop the reapers. this ending also gives the little extra scene of shepard still being alive in the rubble of london on earth.

i personally think everything from the point that harbinger shows up and knocks you out is tainted with indoctrination. everything changes at that point. camera, gameplay, hud, ammo, your armor is gone, the blurry vision, the oily black stuff on the side of the screen when the illusive man speaks, your armor is gone and suddenly you can breathe in space as well. i could go on and on about this probably. but yeah, i think there is a lot more to it. the child haunts your dreams, going up in flames and ultimately setting you on fire too in the last dream, shepards downfall. because of this i think all endings are bad, with the destroy option being the canonically correct one. destroying the reapers has been your main goal since the very beginning. my guess is the story isn't finished.
I'm sorry... but it's time to move on from denial, my friend. It's just bad writing and endless plotholes.

Destroy is renegade, because the geth, EDI(we'll for some reason not EDI) and all other possible existing synthetics will die. That's ending it no matter the cost. Also, Shepard can survive.
Control is paragon, because you - for sure - sacrifice yourself and idealistically belive in co-existance with the Geth 'n stuff.

Both represented by the people who wanted to commit them, for the same reasons.

Synthesis ends the cycle. Of course you already might've disproved the whole circular-time thing and impossibility of co-existance with the Geth-Quarian peace. Still brings a new age and a level of existance.

Sure, Control and Synthesis just ending in CRITICAL MISSION FAILURE - YOU WERE INDOCTRINATED and a glorious cinematic of all life being destroyed would've been a better ending IMO, but... it just didn't. We saw the relays explode and the whole stargazer bit, it happened.

What really bothers me though is how they fucked up the whole concept of AI. They reduced it to just becoming exactly like humans for both the Geth and EDI. Not that I was expecting anything better after they reduced the Reapers into giant fucking gene-samples in Mass Effect 2.

[sub]Disclaimer: It was still a good game. I enjoyed everything exept the beginning and ending cinematics and anything involving Kai Leng.[/sub]

EDIT: After procrastinating on reddit researching this invensively, I have to admit I'm torn... I WANT TO BELIEVE