Mass Effect Andromeda first impressions?

Loop Stricken

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oRevanchisto said:
Loop Stricken said:
Completed as much of the first planet as the trial allows. Seems okay, despite a few shonky areas and the humans looking like hot garbage.

My biggest complaint is, so far, I don't really care about anyone. The original Mass Effect had Tali, Garrus, Wrex, and Shepard themself.
This one? I kinda like oh crap I've forgotten the black dude's name is it Liam I don't know but he's the best of them and I forgot his name already.
You were introduced to Garrus, Wrex, and Tali within the first hour of ME1 and immediately loved them all?
Loved is a stretch (apart from Tali, she was an immediate favourite), but I did want to learn more about them. Was it because they were alien and new? Maybe.
Did I dislike Ashley and Kaiden because they were human, or because they were boring? Did I dislike Liara because she was boring, or because she was a lazy alien? Who can say.
 

Joccaren

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oRevanchisto said:
Those are some rose-tinted glasses some of ya'll are looking through, hell Tali is probably the most boring character in ME1 next to Kaidan and I'm talking about through the whole game not just her initial introduction. It's only in ME2 that she really comes into her own. I'm gonna call bullshit if say you were truly hooked into characters like Tali and Garrus after your first encounter with them. The only "hook" they had was the fact that they were aliens and thus were interested in learning more about their culture. But, for the most part, their actual personalities could hardly be gleaned from their first meet.
Introduction to Tali; We learn about her through Garrus and C-Sec, and learn more from Fist. We learn that she's a Quarian, she has information on Saren, and is trying to sell it to the Shadow Broker. Obviously, she needs the money for some reason. It also show's she's somewhat reckless and inexperienced, making that sort of decision.
Skip to actually meeting her. She handles herself in a fight, and says she could do as much, but thanks you anyway. She is shown to be a master level hacker of Geth, and explains that she's on her pilgrimage to bring back something of worth to her people. We learn that she is young and relatively inexperienced, but has some confidence with underlying insecurities. We also learn that she is determined and hard working, with her insisting on coming along with Shepard to help complete her pilgrimage, and to help fight Saren - she has a sense of justice as well. After that, yeah, she is a bit boring, being just a Quarian Culture exposition bot, but that first introduction teaches you who her character actually is.

Introduction to Garrus; First look is before the trial, where we learn that he has a boner for justice and is obviously not one for the 'by the books' way of doing things. He's talking about stalling the council, and that while he has no hard evidence his gut tells him its there and he needs to keep looking. He also acts professional, however, showing some respect towards his position and Shepard.
The next time we see Garrus, he's at the Med clinic trying to handle a hostage situation. He does things very gung-ho, using the distraction of Shepard walking in to snipe the assailant. We learn that he is definitely an 'ends justify the means' vigilante type, plays loose with the rules, however is also firmly on the side of protecting people. He is overconfident, and a bit reckless and brash, however skilled and intelligent nevertheless. He hates Saren. He hates fist. He doesn't mind too much who he works with, so long as they'll let him pursue justice.
Further discussions after that build up more of his justice boner, and reveal just how far he's willing to go with his vigilantism. Its all built off what is established in the first half hour though.

So, yeah, you do get some pretty good intros in ME1. Now, knowing you prefer drama first and action and explosions and gunplay, from your other comments on the series, I can understand how you'd miss a lot of this; there isn't a ton of drama in these introductions. There's a bit of dramatic tension thanks to the dangerous circumstances, but its resolved quite quickly. With it being slower and mostly based around talking and firing a handful of shots, as opposed to a fluid run and gun mission for 30 minutes punctuated by talking with characters, I can see how for some it may not be as engaging. Doesn't, however, mean that they weren't given good intros that made people quickly fall in love with the characters. ME1 was very well written for the most part. It ain't just rose tinted glasses that make people still love it; honestly its the only one of the ME series I can still play through, because it stands on its own merits perfectly and is a great experience. 2 is just a lost child with some good drama and atmosphere, which gets tired and predictable pretty quickly, while 3... The less said the better. Its not just nostalgia, ME1 was a genuinely great game.
 

esserin

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I'm definitely keeping my eye on this. Not buying it anytime soon just because I have a giant backlog of games to get through. Also, I always wait for full reviews from critics and non-idiotic players before actually buying a game.

The impression I'm getting from reviews is that it's like a mixture of DA:I and ME1. The first couple of hours are also apparently complete crap but improves later on. Its biggest strength is the gameplay and its biggest weakness is human (and asari) faces. Guess they thought they could get away with not mocaping their faces. Maybe, that'll push them to focus more on aliens and less on humans?

At the moment I'm definitely ambivalent about the whole thing.

Meiam said:
Joccaren said:
Important to note, ME:A was developed by a team that's almost entirely unrelated to bioware, it's from bioware Montreal which is very different from bioware Edmonton (the real bioware) for example the only part they worked on for ME3 was multiplayer and they didn't even exist when ME1 and 2 came out. This is essentially nothing more than EA slapping the bioware name on them and handing them a bioware IP. Not that this makes any of it okay.
Is that a bad thing though? Let's face it the bioware of old is dead. It might be better that the people who did the ME3 ending and TIM mary sue aren't the ones working on this. They're like a brand new studio who've only done a little bit of sidework. Question is whether or not they can make an identity for themselves or if they'll become part of the EA collective.
 

oRevanchisto

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Joccaren said:
oRevanchisto said:
Those are some rose-tinted glasses some of ya'll are looking through, hell Tali is probably the most boring character in ME1 next to Kaidan and I'm talking about through the whole game not just her initial introduction. It's only in ME2 that she really comes into her own. I'm gonna call bullshit if say you were truly hooked into characters like Tali and Garrus after your first encounter with them. The only "hook" they had was the fact that they were aliens and thus were interested in learning more about their culture. But, for the most part, their actual personalities could hardly be gleaned from their first meet.
*snip*

Further discussions after that build up more of his justice boner, and reveal just how far he's willing to go with his vigilantism. Its all built off what is established in the first half hour though.

So, yeah, you do get some pretty good intros in ME1...
You've just described the ENTIRE first Act of Mass Effect 1, not character introductions. Garrus' introduction was him arguing with Executor Pallin about Saren getting away. Wrex was getting into an argument with Fists guards. Tali we aren't introduced to until the very end of the act. You get the point. Anything past that isn't the intro but further along the first Act. And, none of those intros were enough to gauge the characters of ME1 or immediately fall in love with them. We've seen nothing in the trial of Andromeda about our companions besides their bare bones intro. So you can't really complain or compare them to Mass Effect 1.
 

major_chaos

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Ehhhh 3 hours in and I'm a bit disappointed. Not cancel my preorder disappointed, but "wow this is way more 7/10 than the 10/10 I was hoping for".
Honestly I would describe it as a huge, beautiful, interesting world with interesting lore, dragged down by poor storytelling and forgettable characters. That combined with some of the gameplay changes make it feel more the The Division IN SPACE than Mass Effect, which isn't tragic for me because I enjoyed TD, but it doesn't really fit with the tradition things that made people love ME.

I'm far more worried about the gaggles of smug assholes who "predicted" (by which I mean "guessed") that the game wasn't going to be great acting like bellends and shitting on anyone who dares enjoy it. A double shame because I just recently got to see that kind of person get slapped down hard by Horizon: Zero Dawn.
 

Chessrook44

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Neonsilver said:
Now I have to get a little nitpicky, while there was an explanation for the themal clips in mass effect 2. It is a stupid explanation. Anyone who fired a gun will tell you that you have to slow down firing anyway, with or without the risk of overheating. Because it's pretty much impossible to aim properly otherwise. Even if you accept the explanation, it's still questionable why the thermal clips are applied to every type of weapon or why you can run out of ammo with one gun, but still have clips for another one.
I don't remember the GIVEN explanation for the thermal clips, but I always thought the REAL explanation was so that the companies that made the guns would be able to sell the clips regularly and thus get a bit of extra money out of the military and such via selling consumables alongside the weaponry. It made sense in my head.
 

Neonsilver

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Chessrook44 said:
I don't remember the GIVEN explanation for the thermal clips, but I always thought the REAL explanation was so that the companies that made the guns would be able to sell the clips regularly and thus get a bit of extra money out of the military and such via selling consumables alongside the weaponry. It made sense in my head.
here http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/File:Thermal_Clips_Codex_Cut.ogg

The explanation is basically that the geth determined that if you fire more projectiles, than you are more likely to kill your enemies. That explanation works to some degree since you have to destroy the shields first. However it lacks an explanation why it's used for every weapon type (pistols didn't overheat that much). Why there isn't some type of secondary thermal clip that works like the old system, that could be used when you run out of clips.
Since the characters don't run around with all weapon types like they did in me1, they could for example carry around two assault rifles to switch between when one overheats.

I read that a hybrid system between the one in me1 and the one in me2 was planned, but it had some problems (probably unbalanced) and was deactivated. So from a developers point of view I can understand and agree with it, the lore explanation just isn't very good.
 

bastardofmelbourne

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Chessrook44 said:
I don't remember the GIVEN explanation for the thermal clips,
The given explanation was that it was faster to remove the heat sink and replace it with a new one than it was to wait for an overheated weapon to cool down.

The problem was that the cooldown function was apparently removed entirely, and the new heat sinks weren't reusable, thus giving the space-age super-flechette-railguns that never need reloading or resupply the requirement to be frequently reloaded and resupplied.

On top of that, the given explanation didn't actually describe how they worked in the game. A half-"full" thermal clip would never cool down on its own, no matter how long you waited or how much time you spent in between shots; the clip is basically maintaining its internal temperature at a perfectly steady (and high) level indefinitely and in violation of basic thermodynamics, for no reason that makes any sense.

One of the things that grabbed me about ME1 was how well-thought-out the "science" part of "science fiction" was. It was all very restrained and believable. But from ME2 onwards, they started kinda moving towards the "fuck it, this is cooler" type of sci-fi, so now guns need ammunition, infiltrators can shoot fireballs, and you can turn your omni-blade into a sword or some bullshit. (Sorry, Mass Effect nerd here.)
 

spartandude

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So the impressions im getting from reading comments and watching gameplay footage (I havn't played it myself) is that combat is descent (not great but nothing bad). Exploration seems to be more like Inquisition but I've seen alot of people say it's not handled as good, however I havnt seen enough myself to judge so anyone want to bring my up to speed on this aspect?
But for me the meat and potatoes when it comes to Bioware and RPGs in general is story, writing and characters. And from all I've seen it seems to fall flat here. Characters seem to be ok (I can't really judge not having played it meself or sat down to watch a full 10 hours of gameplay) so no opinion there. But from what I have seen dialogues, in terms or writing, acting and animation are.... pretty crap.

Does this match what you players have experienced?
 

Gethsemani_v1legacy

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My first impression is that it is way better then I expected. The combat feels pretty good once I got the FoV up from tunnel vision with weapons drawn, the story hooks were good enough to get me hooked and while the companions all seem pretty bland at this point (a criticism that was pretty much true for everyone but Wrex in ME), they are at least serviceable. The dialogue is all over the place in terms of quality, both in how it is written and how it is delivered. The trial was enough to convince me that I want to play the whole game and that it will probably be worth full price. I doubt it will be my next "bestest game ever", but it will probably be a decent enough space rpg.
 

meiam

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Watching a let's play, the base gameplay seems fluid and interesting, but the new skill system seems horribly hampered. Having only 3 active ability pretty much guarantee that you'll max out everything you want very quickly and the gameplay will just get repetitive from there on. Plus hybrid are weaker since specializing boost the strength of your ability, even if you spend the point in stuff you don't use. They even removed elemental bullet for some odd reason, this is like DA:I all over again where they severely limit the ability system.

The story feel like a dumb blockbuster summer movie, everyone is constantly surprised that there information is outdated (considering it's like 1200 years old, no surprised). You find alien and within minutes your just shooting them. Despite the fact that there's an entirely new galaxy to explore, they still felt like they had to introduced some old mystery and our character still had to be "the chosen one". Lots of retcon happening, nothing major but it's kinda annoying (if you wanna change so much, just make a new IP). Plus, how the hell are you on the same technology level than the people you meet? The Reaper have been reseting the galaxy for half a billions years, we should be way behind anything we meet.
 

Joccaren

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oRevanchisto said:
You've just described the ENTIRE first Act of Mass Effect 1, not character introductions. Garrus' introduction was him arguing with Executor Pallin about Saren getting away. Wrex was getting into an argument with Fists guards. Tali we aren't introduced to until the very end of the act. You get the point. Anything past that isn't the intro but further along the first Act. And, none of those intros were enough to gauge the characters of ME1 or immediately fall in love with them. We've seen nothing in the trial of Andromeda about our companions besides their bare bones intro. So you can't really complain or compare them to Mass Effect 1.
If what you're saying is correct, and in the first 3-10 hours of gameplay we only get 3 lines of dialogue from each of our companions - yeah, that's a fucking issue all by itself. You stated in the first hour. ALL of what I described can occur within an hour game time, less if you're actually good at the game.

And, again, cut down the talk from Garrus to just Executor Palin, and Wrex just to his interaction with C-Sec, you can still very easily gauge the characters as it establishes all of their themes and personallities there and then. They are simply reinforced and given some more depth afterwards.

So, whichever way you slice it, Anromeda is falling short by your criteria. Either its pacing is fucking ridiculous and you only get 3 lines of dialogue with a companion over 3-10 hours, or you get more and your defence is that a similar amount of time with the ME1 characters wasn't engaging either - which isn't true.
Again, haven't looked up anything to know how the character intros actually go, so I ain't judging them as of yet, but from how you've been defending them it doesn't look good.

major_chaos said:
I'm far more worried about the gaggles of smug assholes who "predicted" (by which I mean "guessed") that the game wasn't going to be great acting like bellends and shitting on anyone who dares enjoy it.
To be fair, in this case I think it is fair to say 'predicted'. Bioware has NOT been a good or great studio at any point in the last 8 years or so. They've had a long chain of fuck ups, from DA2, ME3, SWTOR, DA:I and for some even ME2. Their games are average at best, and awful at worst these days, so expecting them to make something brilliant seems... Backwards.

That said, anyone that does genuinely enjoy it - great, more power to you. Shouldn't be shitting on those who enjoy a game for enjoying it. I think a lot of people's issues still arise from the hostility of ME3 where the entire fanbase turned against itself, and a disdain for those who would love a shiny turd if Bioware put their name on it [I know someone like this, has a fucking Bioware tatoo and everything... Its kinda sad].

I ain't drawing any conclusions on it yet. Intial reaction is that it would be terrible, now I'm thinking it'd probably just be forgettable, C to B- level entertainment from what I've heard. Hopefully its better after the initial intro and turns out to be amazing, but I guess we'll see. I ain't holding my breath with Bioware though. More power to those who will love it, but I've got too many better games to play if it isn't actually that good.

Meiam said:
Watching a let's play, the base gameplay seems fluid and interesting, but the new skill system seems horribly hampered. Having only 3 active ability pretty much guarantee that you'll max out everything you want very quickly and the gameplay will just get repetitive from there on.
Weird as it sounds, this is actually an improvement on 2 and 3. In 2, you had a single 'active' ability since they were all on a shared cooldown. This meant that you'd have one great ability that you'd always use, and a bunch of nonsense abilities that would be fun to play with - but you never got to because you were too busy using your good ability.
3 was the same, but your good ability was also given a combo ability, giving you 2 abilities that were actually worth levelling up.
If we've moved up to 3 abilities, we're almost approaching ME1s 5-6 ability lineup, and might actually have competent casters again, whereas they were nerfed to near uselessness in 2, and received only a marginal buff in 3, thanks to damned armour types, and the fact that guns were by far the most effective way to take an enemy down.
 

wizzy555

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I don't watch much anime so a question: When Peebee knocks over the pathfinder isn't that the harem anime trope?
 

meiam

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Joccaren said:
Weird as it sounds, this is actually an improvement on 2 and 3. In 2, you had a single 'active' ability since they were all on a shared cooldown. This meant that you'd have one great ability that you'd always use, and a bunch of nonsense abilities that would be fun to play with - but you never got to because you were too busy using your good ability.
3 was the same, but your good ability was also given a combo ability, giving you 2 abilities that were actually worth levelling up.
If we've moved up to 3 abilities, we're almost approaching ME1s 5-6 ability lineup, and might actually have competent casters again, whereas they were nerfed to near uselessness in 2, and received only a marginal buff in 3, thanks to damned armour types, and the fact that guns were by far the most effective way to take an enemy down.
Not really, you wouldn't always use the same ability in 2/3 at least not at higher difficulty. You generally had one or two bullet ability, so you either just activated that one at first or you would switch based on on the enemy armor type. Then you'd have ability that were only useful for for either shield (overload) or armor (incinerate), so constantly using the same one would be an awful idea. On top of that you had ability that could only be used on enemy stripped of armor/shield (cryo, lift, hacking). You'd have support ability (additional armor, summon bots, charge) and using those on CD made no sense. For example, playing as sentinel in ME2 involved using all your power, overload/warp for armor/shield, cryo/lift once there down to base health (usage differ depending on squadmate, ie if you had access to a warp for biotic combo) and tech armor once the old one was stripped off, plus warp ammo for additional ability to buff weapon. Right away comparing to the new system, you'd have to choose between overload/warp and cryo or lift. Sure once you made the choice you could use them all together, but ME3 weight system made it so you could bring your CD to around 1 second anyway, so if you wanted to play pure ability caster ME3 system was far more viable.
 

Joccaren

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Meiam said:
Not really, you wouldn't always use the same ability in 2/3 at least not at higher difficulty. You generally had one or two bullet ability, so you either just activated that one at first or you would switch based on on the enemy armor type. Then you'd have ability that were only useful for for either shield (overload) or armor (incinerate), so constantly using the same one would be an awful idea. On top of that you had ability that could only be used on enemy stripped of armor/shield (cryo, lift, hacking). You'd have support ability (additional armor, summon bots, charge) and using those on CD made no sense. For example, playing as sentinel in ME2 involved using all your power, overload/warp for armor/shield, cryo/lift once there down to base health (usage differ depending on squadmate, ie if you had access to a warp for biotic combo) and tech armor once the old one was stripped off, plus warp ammo for additional ability to buff weapon. Right away comparing to the new system, you'd have to choose between overload/warp and cryo or lift. Sure once you made the choice you could use them all together, but ME3 weight system made it so you could bring your CD to around 1 second anyway, so if you wanted to play pure ability caster ME3 system was far more viable.
I'll grant that's a way you COULD play, but hardly ever turned out like that. For a start, using abilities on enemies without armour or shields never happened. Once they were at that stage, they were already dead. A handful of shots from an SMG and they'd be down. Additionally, Incinerate was still damned useful against unarmoured foes, lighting them on fire and stunning them temporarily, making Cryo/Lift of questionable utility compared to an incinerate combo.

Otherwise...
Soldier; Always use bullet time. Seriously, the ability to double your bullet output, with guns being by far the most effective method of killing someone? Yeah, no time for anything else.
Adept; On higher difficulties? Warp, exclusively. Hell, warp was even useful against unarmoured enemies too, as it gave them a nice 1 second stagger that allowed you to land 2-3 headshots and instant kill them. All other abilities did not work while armour, shields, or barrier was up. Made them more than a little useless. Lower difficulties you could have more fun with singularity and the likes, but higher... Not a chance.
Vanguard; Charge all day long. Nothing else needed.
Engineer; Honestly, while you'll call your droid support, it was by far the best ability. It would float over to the enemy, knock them out of cover for 2-3 seconds, and allow you to land enough shots to down anything but a boss - and even then you weren't behind by much. You COULD incinerate or overload, but they dealt less DPS than your guns by far, especially with enemies ducking into cover. Could be occasionally useful as crowd control, but otherwise... Meh.
Infiltrator; Why use anything but cloak? Really, it was amazingly useful.
Sentinel; Armour was brilliant. Gave you the extra time out of cover to land several killing shots, and once it was gone most of your enemies ended up staggered - allowing you to either kill them all quickly, or run to cover if there were too many.

ME2s focus on guns kinda broke the utility of the caster classes, especially when 3/4s of your abilities didn't work until the enemy was essentially one shot from dead, even on the highest difficulties. Even then, there were only really two classes that could benefit from multiple ability usage for counter shields or counter armour/barrier - engineer and sentinel. When levelling up I never levelled two skills up evenly. It was always my primary skill to max, and then dump into secondary skills that I didn't really need.

ME3 was admittedly kind of broken thanks to its cooldown reduction. Continuous casting thanks to no cooldown did allow you to use any ability you wanted as the situation demanded, though the fact that a no cooldown option was required to make the system work is... Disheartening.

It could be that Andromeda has a greater need for use of powers than the previous games, but I guess we'll have to wait and see there. Most reviews put it as a decent but deeply flawed game ATM, so if I end up getting it its likely to be on sale. Maybe 3 powers is all you need at any point - which, honestly, fills your coverage of ME2 defence types; warp, overload, lift - maybe there's different mechanics entirely at play there. I don't know.
The loss of ammo powers is both a blessing and a curse though. If they're gone entirely, then yeah, that's pretty poor. If they're back to being weapon mods like in ME1, I'm not too fussed - I prefered the greater variety of ammo types, were they better balanced, and not needing to waste levels on what is really just an equipment system that doesn't make a lot of sense to be a character ability anyway.
 

CritialGaming

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So I played the intro section last night. The human facial animations are much better than the .gifs floating around make it seem. They aren't great, and I did encounter some weird ones, but they are gone so fast that I only saw them because I was looking for them. Also I haven't noticed outright shitty Voice acting. I'm not far into the game yet, so that might be meaningless thus far. But so far it might be much more passable than it seems.

We shall see. Gotta sink some time into it to get a good real impression.
 

bastardofmelbourne

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wizzy555 said:
I don't watch much anime so a question: When Peebee knocks over the pathfinder isn't that the harem anime trope?
Experts in the field call this a "Crash-Into Hello [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/CrashIntoHello]", a distinct variant of the "Meet Cute [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MeetCute]" supertrope.
 

Gethsemani_v1legacy

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Joccaren said:
The loss of ammo powers is both a blessing and a curse though. If they're gone entirely, then yeah, that's pretty poor. If they're back to being weapon mods like in ME1, I'm not too fussed - I prefered the greater variety of ammo types, were they better balanced, and not needing to waste levels on what is really just an equipment system that doesn't make a lot of sense to be a character ability anyway.
They are not gone, they are consumables. You can pick up to 4 types of consumables to bring into the field (well, 2 initially and then another 2 once you buy/craft upgrades), consisting of shield/health boosters and ammo as far as I can tell. They last for a set number of reloads and then you have to spend another consumable to keep it going. As far as I can tell, the system is potentially neat but the initial set of only 2 consumables means you'll be limited to 1 ammo type and the shield booster, which is integral if you get caught in a bad spot.