On Gaymers and Cons

[Darken12]

How is it implied, and whats so diferent in Gaymercon, other then whats obvious? No, im curious.

Im not against it, if the advantage of making these are so big, but I feel like it makes it harder to get to equality if people keep separating themselves, though I know im probably just freakin naive.

We're gamers, so let's look at games. For games that have the option of making a character of any race, sexuality or gender, we have a disproportionate amount of "straight white male" as the default. See the Dragon Age:Origins trailer [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6SuJ5T9sfAA], the Dragon Age II trailer [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jlACgYHtWCI], the Mass Effect posters (I [http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/d/d9/Mass_Effect_poster.jpg], II [http://johnnybgamer.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/mass-effect-2-poster.jpg] and III [http://www.nzgameshop.com/product_images/posters/video_game_posters/mass_effect_3_iii_maxi_poster_raw.jpg]), and this is BioWare, who is arguably the most egalitarian and inclusive studio. It gets worse from there.

Then we have a comparison between Uncharted and Tomb Raider, two similar games with protagonists of opposite gender. Uncharted has a male lead. He's covered head to toe in practical clothing [http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120715091917/fantendo/images/7/71/NathanDrake.png]. Tomb Raider's female lead, on the other hand, has exposed legs, midriff, arms and cleavage [http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_QWiwZvIq9hQ/TJuYM21bGsI/AAAAAAAAAe4/9MtjcqLtgwE/s1600/lara-croft-2.jpg]. Why? Because Lara Croft is meant to be a character for straight males to drool over, while Nathan Drake is a character for straight white males to project into. Lara Croft is a sexual fantasy, Nathan Drake is a power fantasy. Both are aimed at straight white males.

I could keep citing examples, but I think I've made my point. Most of the entertainment industry (of which games are only a sector) are catered to the straight white male demographic, not because they're a majority (if you put together all the women, non-white males and non-straight white males, you'd definitely outnumber the white straight males), but because they have the most amount of money and sociopolitical power. They're the safest and most lucrative demographic.

So as you can see, regular cons cater to that demographic as well, so I stand by my previous assertion: every con is straight male con. Probably straight white male con, but that's none of my business so I will leave it to someone better informed to speak about how racially inclusive cons usually are.

As for "is this a good thing or not", let me put it like this: it's none of your business. I know it sounds harsh and rude, but I can't think of a clearer way to get the message across. It's not something that's going to affect you, so while thinking about equality is very nice, you have no weight on this. Let LGBT people decide what's best for them. If we want our own con, let us have it. If we want more inclusion at regular cons, let us have it. If you really care about equality, listen to us and our problems instead of telling us what is and is not conducive to equality.

 

[Superlative]

So what you are saying.... is that we should totally also have straight cons as well, just for us straight people!

They're called regular cons.

Which Con exactly, labels itself as "straight"?

Please allow me to try and explain

the reason why people are saying straight cons are called regular conventions is because we, as straight people enjoy the advantage of being the norm due to an overwhelming majority. Due to this majority, nearly everything at a regular convention is going to be marketed towards straight people and heterosexuality will be the presumed norm.

Try thinking of it this way.

You are a Christian. When you get together with your Christian friends, you like to throw Christian Theology in among the general topics of conversation. Now imagine trying to have that theological discussion in the off-topic section of the forums here. Chances are good that you are going to have to deal with trolls posting insults aimed at you and your faith. all you wanted to do is have a nice theological discussion, not have to deal with sky daddy comments.

Now, if you were gay, instead of sky daddy jokes, you would at best attract odd looks and an worse have to deal with a group of knuckle-draggers trying to start trouble. this situation forces you to either hide your sexuality or endure said knuckle-draggers.

What the convention does is create a situation where homosexuality itself is the norm. not only do gay people not have to deal with people doucher, their homosexuality, which normally is something they have to compensate for, is celebrated, something which those in the group can greatly appreciate.

Um, no, actually, theres indeed a huge percent of people here who would gladly make fun of any religion, but the same poeple are usually also open to many things, including chatting with homosexuals, without making fun of them. The way I see it, more and more people getting open minded about these things, and because of that, I feel like separating them like this is a step backwards.

You missed the point of my post.

these things are not 'seperating people out', its a temporary coming together to celebrate a commonality, something impossible just out on the street.

 

[The Funslinger]

It took me about a minute after reading this to realize he's not wearing pants in the third panel.

 

[stonemaskstoryteller]

and Frankly, thinking that gay people only go anywhere "gay" only to flirt just proves how downright ignorant you are on the matter.

Well excuse me.... when sexuality is mentioned in the very name, it seems pretty logical this is going to be relevant in that place.

I swear, if I am reading "heterosexual-centered" I'm assuming that place has to do with sex, otherwise why the need to mention it at all?
So yeah, tell me. Why the need to make a gay-centered convention if it's not a place to flirt or such?

Because you know.... videogames don't have much to do with talking about your sexual partners. So I still find it idiotic that there is apparently the need to make a VIDEOGAME convention gay-centered.

Again, the ignorance. Homosexuality, Just like Heterosexuality, is more than just a matter of "flirting and sex." Its about Love too, and lifestyle, and because of that it deserves just as much respect.

Also I think you'd be surprised about just how much homosexuality crops up, not just in video games, but in comics, artwork, movies, manga, anime and all aspects of geek culture and fiction. I think you'd be less quick to judge if you did your research...

Besides, If a minority of people want to meet up to discuss homosexuality within geek culture, and talk how it can be more openly talked about and accepted, not just swept under the carpet....Just how can that be so idiotic? It's not going to rob the "purity" from all other Gamer cons. You give us too much credit if you think Gaymer con is capable of such 'devistating' side effect. If people want it, and it's welcoming to everyone, then why not? There's no harm done to anyone and who are you to stop them?

 

[Verkula]

As for "is this a good thing or not", let me put it like this: it's none of your business. I know it sounds harsh and rude, but I can't think of a clearer way to get the message across. It's not something that's going to affect you, so while thinking about equality is very nice, you have no weight on this. Let LGBT people decide what's best for them. If we want our own con, let us have it. If we want more inclusion at regular cons, let us have it. If you really care about equality, listen to us and our problems instead of telling us what is and is not conducive to equality.

Actually, it is, at least a little bit. Maybe not now with the con, but in the end, in a global scale. Altough I doubt Ill live to see that.

 

[clippen05]

Ok, everyone, important question time:

Is this Con banning non-gay people from attending? (Answer: NO)


If the gay culture is not your thing, then give the convention a pass. All these complaints almost feel like people are afraid that having too many conventions will somehow deplete the non-renewable convention resource! (Hint: it won't, you can have a theoretical infinite number of conventions with infinite themes, given enough geek critical mass)

Discussing whether there is a need for this convention or not is exactly the same thing detractors of videogames or comics argue regarding those conventions. Just because you don't get it, it doesn't mean it's worthless.

Gay Culture lol? Isn't the whole idea that lesbians and gays want to be seen as no different than any straight person? I didn't know that sexual orientations had a whole culture reserved for themselves...

 

[Andy Shandy]

Ok this thread got out of hand fast, it is getting challenging to keep up.

That must be the understatement of, admittedly, this very early year. XD

 

[stonemaskstoryteller]

It's the same as making a COMIC con or an ANIME con or a VIDEO GAME con. You're just gearing most of the features and/or the community attending to be focused on noticing or accepting a specific facet of gamer culture.

Thanks, I couldn't have said it better myself.

 

[Darken12]

Actually, it is, at least a little bit. Maybe not now with the con, but in the end, in a global scale. Altough I doubt Ill live to see that.

I meant the con specifically. There is no argument a straight person can give me that can reasonably justify giving their opinions any degree of weight.

As for the 'global scale', see the rest of my paragraph. If equality is an important matter to you, listen to the people who suffer from inequality. That's far more constructive and important than knee-jerk reactions to things you might not even understand.

 

[James Joseph Emerald]

Here's what I think is a perfect parallel to the "why do gay gamers want their own conventions" question/argument:

[HEADING=2]Why do bronies need their own conventions? Why can't they just go to the normal My Little Pony ones?[/HEADING]

If your answer isn't essentially the same for both questions, you're probably a bigot.

 

[SonOfVoorhees]

I wonder why they would segregate themselves from others and if being gay is normal why they have to make such an issue of it. It just seems that, for instance, black or gay or whatever can have there own clubs but god forbid there is a white only or straight men only event. Gaming bonds all people regardless, doesnt matter what your background is.

 

[DudeistBelieve]

Here's what I think is a perfect parallel to the "why do gay gamers want their own conventions" question/argument:

[HEADING=2]Why do bronies need their own conventions? Why can't they just go to the normal My Little Pony ones?[/HEADING]

If your answer isn't essentially the same for both questions, you're probably a bigot.

...Wait.

They seriously have Normie-MLP cons?

Really?

 

[Ickorus]

Speaking without rancor, I don't think it's a particularly great idea you can insist all you like that the convention is open to everyone but it's still not going to change the fact that most straight people attending would feel just a little bit uncomfortable as the very name implies it's not intended for us. (Maybe that's the point, who knows?)

I think it would have been much more constructive if instead they didn't give it a specific focus on gay culture in gaming and instead simply made it part of their mission brief to be inclusive to all gamers with the promise of removing anyone who showed intolerance towards another part of our culture.

Maybe I've just lucked out here and I just happen to frequent some of the most down-to-earth and unprejudiced gaming hangouts about but I really do think our culture is one of the most inclusive and forward thinking ones around.

My captcha was a picture of a puppy, this pleases me.

 

[James Joseph Emerald]

...Wait.

They seriously have Normie-MLP cons?

Really?

Well, I believe so. They've been over-shadowed by the whole brony thing, but MLP collectors have been around for a long time. Similar to Beanie Babies.

Plus, y'know, MLP probably had a large presence at toy conventions even before the brony thing.

 

[Darken12]

Speaking without rancor, I don't think it's a particularly great idea you can insist all you like that the convention is open to everyone but it's still not going to change the fact that most straight people attending would feel just a little bit uncomfortable as the very name implies it's not intended for us. (Maybe that's the point, who knows?)

You have perfectly encapsulated the feeling most LGBT people feel when they go to regular cons, for the exact same reasons.

Maybe I've just lucked out here and I just happen to frequent some of the most down-to-earth and unprejudiced gaming hangouts about but I really do think our culture is one of the most inclusive and forward thinking ones around.

Occam's Razor states you're probably just unaware. It's okay, it happens.

 

[Xanex]

I am curious about something. Do the creators of this con believe that whatever they are trying to get away from in regular cons will not follow them there? That the very small number of intolerant knuckle draggers they are trying to get away from will not follow them?

The knuckle draggers are a persistent lot, vindictive and petty. Making a con like this is very much like waving a red flag at a bull.

 

[Ickorus]

Speaking without rancor, I don't think it's a particularly great idea you can insist all you like that the convention is open to everyone but it's still not going to change the fact that most straight people attending would feel just a little bit uncomfortable as the very name implies it's not intended for us. (Maybe that's the point, who knows?)

You have perfectly encapsulated the feeling most LGBT people feel when they go to regular cons, for the exact same reasons.

Maybe I've just lucked out here and I just happen to frequent some of the most down-to-earth and unprejudiced gaming hangouts about but I really do think our culture is one of the most inclusive and forward thinking ones around.

Occam's Razor states you're probably just unaware. It's okay, it happens.

I think for me it's that I've never seen the walls that apparently exist that cause people to treat others differently based on silly things like sexual preference, race, gender or whatever else you care to think of.

People treat it negatively* but this lack of understanding is what everyone should wish for, if nobody saw the walls they wouldn't exist and the world would be a far better place.

[small]* Just look at some of the posts in this thread to see what I mean.[/small]

 

[Nieroshai]

So conversely, you are saying regular game cons are exclusively for straights? Now if we did THAT we would get sued... double standards gall me. If you're a gamer, be a gamer. There shouldn't be "gaymers" because that creates "straightmers." Lobbying for anything other than equality and unity is divisive. That is why while racism is bad, the Black Panthers and the Rainbow Coalition are also bad. This is why while sexism is bad, N.O.W. is also bad. Men's lobbies, white lobbies, and straight lobbies aren't okay because they're prejudiced. So why is the other way around okay? Be gamers, not "look-at-me-because-I'm-different"mers.

 

[Nieroshai]

Why would gaymers want their own cons? Well, why would lolis want their own con?

(HINT: The subject matter covered is inherently disgusting to CISGENDERED HETERONORMATIVE BIGOTS normals no matter how many episodes of Glee you watch.)

I fully support gaymer-cons and in fact would encourage all gay gamers to stick with those. As many as possible.

Out of curiosity, would a "straightmercon" (nevermind how retarded that reads) be intolerant? A con specifically for straight gamers, gays need not apply?

 

[Darken12]

I am curious about something. Do the creators of this con believe that whatever they are trying to get away from in regular cons will not follow them there? That the very small number of intolerant knuckle draggers they are trying to get away from will not follow them?

The knuckle draggers are a persistent lot, vindictive and petty. Making a con like this is very much like waving a red flag at a bull.

In a regular con, only 20% will genuinely care, at most. Everyone else will either actively not care or just pretend to care because it's the socially acceptable thing to do. The knuckle draggers will not meet that much opposition.

At a gaymer con, it's likely the percentages will be reversed.

I think for me it's that I've never seen the walls that apparently exist that cause people to treat others differently based on silly things like sexual preference, race, gender or whatever else you care to think of.

People treat it negatively but this lack of understanding is what everyone should wish for, if nobody saw the walls they wouldn't exist and the world would be a far better place.

When you're a member of the privileged majority, it's very tempting to close your eyes and pretend everything's fine and go "it's okay guys, you can stop complaining, we reached equality" and treat wilful blindness and ignorance as a way to keep on pretending everything's fine. It's not a malicious thing, but it happens, and it happens alarmingly often. You know who truly knows if we've reached equality or not? The minorities and the oppressed (which are not the same). Ask them if we've reached equality yet or not.

So conversely, you are saying regular game cons are exclusively for straights? Now if we did THAT we would get sued... double standards gall me. If you're a gamer, be a gamer. There shouldn't be "gaymers" because that creates "straightmers." Lobbying for anything other than equality and unity is divisive. That is why while racism is bad, the Black Panthers and the Rainbow Coalition are also bad. This is why while sexism is bad, N.O.W. is also bad. Men's lobbies, white lobbies, and straight lobbies aren't okay because they're prejudiced. So why is the other way around okay? Be gamers, not "look-at-me-because-I'm-different"mers.

No.

I'm just gonna say it: you're flat out wrong.

It's not that "if you did that you would get sued". You already do that. See my examples in a previous post, the entertainment culture (of which games are a part) already caters almost exclusively to straight white males. Every other demographic has to fight tooth and nail to get recognised. "Straightmers" already exist. They're called gamers. That's why we have "girl gamers" too, because the default is the straight white male.

The reason straight white males have a problem with minorities and the underprivileged fighting for rights and inclusion is because "privileging the straight white male" is seen as normal and the status quo. By trying to change that, straight white males feel threatened because they're no longer being catered to.