Please let Pokemon gracefully exit.

[theultimateend]

So Black and white 2 is/are coming out soon. Oh joy. The least creative pokemon game with the worst designed pokemon and least innovation gets direct sequalage.

Spoiler: What I actually looked like while reading that

I'm willing to say some of the designs were bad, mostly the final evolution of various things. Though that's subjective they did seem to miss the "feel" of previous generations.

But...least innovation? Really...

Did we even play the same game? I'm not even a huge fan anymore and this seemed like the biggest leap forward that they've ever had.

Considering Pokemon is larger than Mario and (as far as I know) the largest video game franchise in the world...I don't see where the graceful exit need be.

I recently went on vacation and played Pokemon Black while on vacation, it was some quite a lot of fun to me. I just didn't dig some evolutions, but can't win em all.

 

[Terminate421]

It's important to realize something. POKEMON IS AND HAS ALWAYS BEEN FOR KIDS.
.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.267885-Game-Freak-Pokemon-Isnt-Just-for-Kids?page=1

Please read this, then come back here and try to argue with that.

Nintendo knows that there are in fact older audiences, it doesn't heavily focus on them but I think given the direction of focusing on story is probably a sign that they do care and give an ear out. That and making the main trainers at the age of 15 instead of 10. Also:

Spoiler

Putting Red in Pokemon Black and White 2

 

[Redlin5_v1legacy]

The series hasn't shaken me off of it yet although if the art design continues along the path its headed I may stop after this next game. This is coming from a hardcore fan who liked everything until Gen IV just fine. Also I'm not picking up the 3DS but I think they're releasing it for both the 3DS and the DS so I won't be screwed for this next one. Black and White wasn't that bad but they weren't as good for me as say the Gen III games were.

But I don't see Pokemon dying a dignified death. I see foresee gen 7 finally crumbling and dying.

I'll always have my older games.

 

[Gxas]

It's important to realize something. POKEMON IS AND HAS ALWAYS BEEN FOR KIDS.

Find me a child under 10 who has a firm grasp on EVs, IVs, breeding, and the metagame. Please.

Fine me one who understands why the Physical/Special split was so important. Please.

Don't say that they don't change things for previous fans of the series. You're incredibly wrong in that statement.

 

[Innegativeion]

Spoiler

Putting Red in Pokemon Black and White 2

What, REALLY??

Le gasp!

Always loved the internet's portrayal of the baseball cap'd protagonist by leaps and bound more than his... less admired anime portrayal, which is really a separate entity at this point.

 

[Lizardon]

Black 2 and White 2 are not the same game, nor are they like Crystal/Emerald/Platinum. They are a direct sequel to the Black and White where you play as a new trainer some time after the events of Black and White. So the story is brand new, not just a updated version like the other 3rd games. I do not now the details of the story (beyond it involving N, Team Plasma and Kyurem) so I cannot comment on how different it will be.

Anyway, you are not the target audience of Pokemon games any more. You've grown up, you've matured and your tastes have changed. You cannot expect the franchise to keep up with you. Nintendo is interested in the new kids, those who've never been introduced to Pokemon before. Sure they make new abilities, moves and items to mix up the competitive scene, but Pokemon has and always will be a game with children in mind.

I do not want to deny kids from discovering Pokemon like I did. And the truth is that it is unlikely for them to find a Gameboy and copy of Red or Blue. So I'm glad that Nintendo keep putting out new games. And the fact that there is little deviation means that they are having the same experience I had 15 years ago.

And the sales data and review scores are not irrelevant. They show that you are in the minority and that nearly everyone eels loves and enjoys the newest Pokemon games.

 

[Terminate421]

It's important to realize something. POKEMON IS AND HAS ALWAYS BEEN FOR KIDS.

Find me a child under 10 who has a firm grasp on EVs, IVs, breeding, and the metagame. Please.

Fine me one who understands why the Physical/Special split was so important. Please.

Don't say that they don't change things for previous fans of the series. You're incredibly wrong in that statement.

I'm 20 and I don't even understand what EV's and IV's are. Mostly because playing Pokemon is not something I do for hours on end, because there are a billion things in life more important than gaming.

The Physical/Special split is important in minute ways that seem important only to hardcore fans. The same way that +3 crit in WoW isn't important, but to an obsessive raider, it's like liquid gold.

Read the rest of my post and you'll catch my meaning. Don't cherry-pick my first sentence and try to talk big.

Actually the split is relatively important to the game. You would care to know why your Tyranitar is failing badly because it's using surf (which is a special move) instead of Earthquake (A physical one). Regardless of its use on say....a fire type.

RPG's tend to give a quick breakdown on stats, pokemon is no exception. The idea of Pokemon is easy accessability, but mastery is truly difficult.

This isn't even a jump reaction "trying to talk big" and such, more or less giving something that is easy to understand that most people have picked up on about the series.

 

[Innegativeion]

War Greymon was my favorite Pokemon.

Fuck you man, Odin all the way. Way better pokemon.

Thunder Reign is incredibly OP as hell, especially against stun-able bosses like the reaper.

Even Thanatos is a better pokemon for xp farming than war greymon, especially if you have him inherit Die for me! and mudo boost.

 

[Terminate421]

Spoiler

Putting Red in Pokemon Black and White 2

What, REALLY??

Le gasp!

Always loved the internet's portrayal of the baseball cap'd protagonist by leaps and bound more than his... less admired anime portrayal, which is really a separate entity at this point.

Last I checked the majority of fanworks over that guy tended to come from adults who were before before 1994.

Who's side are you on in this whole shtick by the way?

 

[Uratoh]

Only 70 in Conquest? lightweight! XD

For anyone interested in it, do LOOK IN TO IT before you buy it. It's a tactics/strategy game, as opposed to what some parent buying a pokemon game for their kid might expect them to like.

As for the topic at hand, pokemon is as pokemon does. not all the new ones are gonna be 'win', not all the old ones were 'win' either. I've been thinking they should make some kind of actual pokemon MMO, though they'd need to restrict/not make legendaries available aside from boss encounters, and the like.

 

[Innegativeion]

Last I checked the majority of fanworks over that guy tended to come from adults who were before before 1994.

Who's side are you on in this whole shtick by the way?

Huh? Oh, the demographic thing?

Uhm... like most nintendo RPGs, they're accessible and elegantly simplistic for kids but complex enough to entrench adults and teens.

As for who Nintendo intended it for when greenlighting it, who gamefreak intended it for when making it, I couldn't tell ya without reading their minds.

Personally I don't think it really matters.

 

[Terminate421]

Huh? Oh, the demographic thing?

Uhm... like most nintendo RPGs, they're accessible and elegantly simplistic for kids but complex enough to entrench adults and teens.
.

This. I've been trying to say this. Also I've been holding back rage at the OP who started this pointless and flawed debate.

 

[DJ_DEnM]

What I read...
OMFG GUYS GEN V IS SO DUMB LIKE LOOK AT THIS:

 

[Evil Smurf]

I love B&W because your friends are not massive douches who want to murder.

 

[General Twinkletoes]

Eugh...
Why? They're still fine. The new designs actually aren't as bad as people make them out to be. I'm just hearing a whole load of nostalgia here.

 

[Podunk]

There are a lot of ways to innovate and expand on the Pokemon experience that have yet to be explored. I think the well is far from dry, but they need to be very careful moving on from here, as they are with their first-party series.

 

[MorsePacific]

Do you guys ever take the time to really think about how bad some of the generation 1 Pokemon actually were? Yes, there are now trash and ice cream Pokemon, but generation 1 had the entire Bellsprout tree, Gloom, Tangela, Mr. Mime, Lickitung, and Jynx, among others..

Seriously, all of those guys suck. Every generation has had Pokemon that were really hit and miss.

 

[Kahunaburger]

The Physical/Special split is important in minute ways that seem important only to hardcore fans.

Special attack/defense (or just special, if it's gen I) governs special attacks, vanilla attack and defense governs physical attacks. What's there to understand?

But to be fair, I knew that when I was 10, too.

 

[Rose and Thorn]

I feel the Pokemon games could be something much more great. What they need to do is start over and create a very fleshed out RPG. I feel they need to take out the following...

1- None of this buy Red version or Blue version for pokemon exclusives. Make one version with every pokemon available. I get pokemon is a lot about trading...but it really shouldn't be. It seems like more of a money grab, because a lot of "Fans" will buy both versions regardless.

2- Another trade issue is evolving. You can't level a good chunk of pokemon until you TRADE them? Ummm stupid. "I love my pokemon and wish for him to get stronger, I know I'll give him away so he can get bigger muscles." Silly.

3- Rare pokemon are cool, but ultra rare ones that you can't get without like moving to japan or going to some event in New York city? Argcack. Make every pokemon available to everyone, although make rare ones hard to find and capture, not impossible.

I know these tidbits might not seem big to most pokemon players, but it's things like these that break the game for me. I am someone that hates DLC for the most part, when I buy a game and there are things in the game I can get or characters I can't play with, it just annoys me greatly.

Rant over, sorry. I don't even remember what this topic was about...*looks at top*, oh right. No I don't think it needs to end, just try something new. Pokemon has a great system and mechanic and we don't have many games that play like Pokemon. They should just starting thinking bigger and more fair. How about a game with every pokemon ever in it? With every Gym? Yes please.

Oh...did you want a Vulpix? I'm sorry you bought HeartGold, not SoulSilver...MOTHER#@%$%*!

 

[Kahunaburger]

1- None of this buy Red version or Blue version for pokemon exclusives. Make one version with every pokemon available. I get pokemon is a lot about trading...but it really shouldn't be. It seems like more of a money grab, because a lot of "Fans" will buy both versions regardless.

2- Another trade issue is evolving. You can't level a good chunk of pokemon until you TRADE them? Ummm stupid. "I love my pokemon and wish for him to get stronger, I know I'll give him away so he can get bigger muscles." Silly.

3- Rare pokemon are cool, but ultra rare ones that you can't get without like moving to japan or going to some event in New York city? Argcack. Make every pokemon available to everyone, although make rare ones hard to find and capture, not impossible.

I dunno, trading was part of the fun. As was the duplication glitch