Say hello to the new Iron Woman

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inu-kun said:
I feel like Marvel is fast approaching Konami level of "fuck the fans", if you want a new female black character, MAKE A NEW FEMALE BLACK CHARACTER, don't blackwash chracters because them being written as the same demographic in that time is apperantly an unforgivable sin.

Also, "Riri is a science genius who enrolls in MIT at the age of 15. She comes to the attention of Tony when she builds her own Iron Man suit in her dorm. " Dear lord the amount of mary sue in 2 sentences.
This is really all. I agree wholeheartedly. Make a NEW character. I'm sure there are enough talent in marvel both graphically and storytelling to make at least one new character from scratch. Come on marvel. Prove me wrong.

Diversity is stupid anyway. I enjoy Thor, big and blonde, I enjoy Black widow, a "lady", I enjoy Black Panther, an "african"(wakandaan), I enjoy mystique, a blue female mutant. Why are people so fucking hung up on heroes being their race/ethnicity? The point about captain america isnt that he's white. If thats all someone sees, they have misunderstood a great fucking lot. It pisses me off, and I dont really think it does any good to blackwash or mexicanwash or indianwash or whatever anything. Just make characters. If it makes sense that he/she is black, let her be black. If it makes sense that its a japanese person, let him/her be that.
 

008Zulu_v1legacy

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I swear that there has been an Iron Woman before. Wasn't Tony, Toni (he was gender swapped for some [probably writer-cocaine related storyline]) for a while? I can't remember where I read that, and the Google is uncharacteristically being unhelpful.
 

Karadalis

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Heres the thing with black female ironman:

Its not the race... or the gender... its the message brought in with it..

If this comic turns out to be another [unsolicited opinion about israel] and has your stereotypical feminist nonsense (villains suddenly going mysoginistic in response to new female version of hero even thought there are a shitton of female superheros AND villains allready in the world before getting their ass kicked with the heroine spouting heroic feminist comebacks for example) in it, it will be shit and no one will buy it.

THATS the real issue here. Im way past caring about DC and marvel desperatly and painfully trying to be "diverse" for diversities sake and sacrificing their well established characters on the altair of PC (the whole comic market is aparantly going down the shitter with less and less people buying books from the big 2 anyways)

But please.. can we stop with stupid bullshit 3rd wave feminist social justice nonsense in comics? I mean Ms. marvel managed to do without those just fine right?

So.. if they can manage to keep idealogue nonsense out of the book, make the transition believable and the character 3 dimensional.. then this can work out.

If its another female thor? Yeah no... we will say goodbye to that after a couple of issues.

On the other hand:

I can see the fangirls doing black spider man / black female iron man "teamups" allready
 
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springheeljack said:
Are people still trying to say that Rey is not a good character? Give it up already you aren't convincing anyone new so stop trying to shoehorn it into every discussion


(Sigh of course they will keep doing it right?)
They will, yes. Because she's a good example of things that people find frustrating, and because nobody cares that it annoys you.

OT: I don't really know what to make of this. They're more-or-less repackaging the same hero (mileage will vary on whether you think that's cool or lame), so what will matter is whether she's entertaining/likeable, and if the writers do a good job establishing it as something worthwhile.

Basically all the stuff that we don't know yet...
 

Cicada 5

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Karadalis said:
Heres the thing with black female ironman:

Its not the race... or the gender... its the message brought in with it..

If this comic turns out to be another [unsolicited opinion about israel] and has your stereotypical feminist nonsense (villains suddenly going mysoginistic in response to new female version of hero even thought there are a shitton of female superheros AND villains allready in the world before getting their ass kicked with the heroine spouting heroic feminist comebacks for example) in it, it will be shit and no one will buy it.

THATS the real issue here. Im way past caring about DC and marvel desperatly and painfully trying to be "diverse" for diversities sake and sacrificing their well established characters on the altair of PC (the whole comic market is aparantly going down the shitter with less and less people buying books from the big 2 anyways)

But please.. can we stop with stupid bullshit 3rd wave feminist social justice nonsense in comics? I mean Ms. marvel managed to do without those just fine right?

So.. if they can manage to keep idealogue nonsense out of the book, make the transition believable and the character 3 dimensional.. then this can work out.

If its another female thor? Yeah no... we will say goodbye to that after a couple of issues.

On the other hand:

I can see the fangirls doing black spider man / black female iron man "teamups" allready
Female Thor is one of Marvel's top selling books. Whatever issues you may have with it, they clearly didn't stop the book from attracting readers and making money.

For the record, that villain you're talking about actually does have a history of being sexist.
 

happyninja42

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Karadalis said:
On the other hand:

I can see the fangirls doing black spider man / black female iron man "teamups" allready
If by "teamup" you mean "engage in sexy times together" that's hardly anything new for the fans and the slashfiction market. They will make any insane combination fuck if they feel like it.
 

votemarvel

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008Zulu said:
I swear that there has been an Iron Woman before. Wasn't Tony, Toni (he was gender swapped for some [probably writer-cocaine related storyline]) for a while? I can't remember where I read that, and the Google is uncharacteristically being unhelpful.
Could you be thinking of the Marvel Mangaverse incarnation, Antionette Stark? http://marvel.wikia.com/wiki/Antoinette_Stark_(Earth-2301) Technically she was Tony Stark's sister in that universe.

 

DementedSheep

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Davroth said:
I'm sorry, but how is that a win for female representation? It's a handmedown, great. What that tells me is that Marvel doesn't seem to trust their writers to come up with a compelling, female character, so they try to use a crutch. We will know in less then 6 months how that goes, I'm sure.
Marvel and DC don't trust their writers to come up with completely new characters not attached to a previous super hero, period. Comics are expensive so people don't take risks and familiar names sell even if the characters have little in common. A lot of "new" superheros are legacy or themed spin off characters that maybe get their own thing and change names later. This is not unusual.
 

Vykrel

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serious question: have Marvel comics come up with any ORIGINAL female superheroes in recent years? any noteworthy ones?

it seems to me that in order to be diverse, their go-to tactic is to just sort of gender-bend existing heroes. She-Hulk, Spider-Woman, Thor...ina. etc. etc.

its just so lazy.
 

votemarvel

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008Zulu said:
votemarvel said:
Marvel Mangaverse incarnation, Antionette Stark?
Could be. But I am fairly certain he was gender swapped for a time.
I don't recall any story where 616 Tony was turned into a woman.

Women have worn the suit in the past, Pepper Potts and Bethany Cabe to name but two, but they weren't Tony. Roxxon had a woman in their version of the Iron Man http://www.ironmanarmory.com/biosoz.html#sfire Stratosfire.

It's past 5am where I am and lack of sleep is dulling my memory. I'll have a kip and that could jog a memory free.
 

DementedSheep

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Vykrel said:
serious question: have Marvel comics come up with any ORIGINAL female superheroes in recent years? any noteworthy ones?

it seems to me that in order to be diverse, their go-to tactic is to just sort of gender-bend existing heroes. She-Hulk, Spider-Woman, Thor...ina. etc. etc.

its just so lazy.
Not denying it's lazy but how many noteworthy ORIGNIAL male superheros have they come up with in recent years?

Although part of the reason they made so many superheros with variations of other superheros names in the beginning was so they could copywrite the names to stop other companies using them for spin offs and parodies. I also think they just suck at naming things. Even if the name makes it sound like they would be gender bends that isn't necessarily the case. She-Hulk (she is also not recent) and Spider-Woman aren't similar to their male counterparts.
 

Overhead

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It's because legacies do better. It's hard to get a new book to be successful and you stand a better chance if you have a built in audience by connecting the character to an existing superhero or team.
 

Addendum_Forthcoming

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Women have taken up the Iron Man suits on occasion. What makes this occasion any different? Well, not technically a woman ... I mean 15 years old. Kind of hoping she isn't much of a Mary Sue.

Plus I can see a reason why Marvel might want to shake up a few things given the success of the movies. Change is good ... it gives people a chance to enter the comic books feeling like they're not missing out if they do.
 

renegade7

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Saelune said:
Ok, well, passing out Iron Man suits isn't new (War Machine, Rescue aka Pepper Potts, Scarlet Spider) but why does Tony need to be...replaced?
I imagine it's either something to do with Robert Downey Jr's contract or maybe they're feeling like Stark/Iron Man has been too much of a main character in the MCU and want to take him out of the spotlight.
 

happyninja42

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renegade7 said:
Saelune said:
Ok, well, passing out Iron Man suits isn't new (War Machine, Rescue aka Pepper Potts, Scarlet Spider) but why does Tony need to be...replaced?
I imagine it's either something to do with Robert Downey Jr's contract or maybe they're feeling like Stark/Iron Man has been too much of a main character in the MCU and want to take him out of the spotlight.
But the MCU isn't the same as the comic universe, so the continuity between them doesn't have to be the same. There's no reason why Downey's contract ending would impact the comics at all.

It's more likely what comic books always do, shake things up in a way that generates hype, coverage, and discussion, to try and bolster sales. It's hardly the first time they've done this, this is just the newest iteration of it.

And it's worked at least to some degree. I personally have never read an Iron Man comic, and never really cared to. But I am interested in this legacy story arc, and want to see how it pans out. So if the only reason was to just drum up new sales, mission accomplished.
 

McMarbles

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Davroth said:
I'm sorry, but how is that a win for female representation? It's a handmedown, great. What that tells me is that Marvel doesn't seem to trust their writers to come up with a compelling, female character, so they try to use a crutch. We will know in less then 6 months how that goes, I'm sure.
What it tells me is that Marvel doesn't trust their readers to buy a new character without a famous name attached. And judging by past sales numbers, they'd be right.

For example, they're coming out with a brand new series starring a completely new black superhero named Mosaic. And I see nobody talking about it. But we're up to eight pages talking about a black female Iron Man.
 

Lightknight

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Gorrath said:
Lightknight said:
Doesn't really seem to matter anymore. Not really. I'm beginning to think of the whole marvel universe the way I thought of the Exiles series. Infinite worlds and infinite iterations/permutations of each hero/villain.
Out of pure curiosity, do you consider that a positive or negative? I see the pros and cons of it and so I'm torn. On the one hand, you aren't stuck re-imagining the same character over and over or else stuck repeating the same story. On the other hand, you lose a concise narrative, probably contradict yourself, and perhaps end up repeating the same stories over and over with different faces. I guess in the end I'd rather see different faces at least if we're going to read a perpetual remixing of the same tropes.
I consider it to be a severe watering down of distinct heroes. Just like the multiverse it means things just don't matter.

Like think retroactively in the DC universe when superman died. In the multiverse, so what? That's just superman of Earth ####. People who say that with infinite parallel universes there is at least one where X happens don't have a good enough handle on infinity. Instead, there are an infinite parallel universes where X happens on an infinite number of them.

So everything is futile both with rapidly changing heroes and in multiverse setups in general.

The more people start to think of different characters when one superhero moniker is evoked then the less that moniker matters.
 

Lightknight

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Ersetu said:
The story seems pretty standard, but is the art in all Marvel comics that terrible and lazy now?
Depends on the artist, of course.

But I do agree, this bratz doll ironwoman looks silly. Can't be mainstream. Guess Earth 2301 is full of people who don't look human.