The R Word

[Omgsarge]

Great article. The fact, that it was written by a man drives the point home that rape is NOT just something that happens to women. It can happen to everybody at every point of their lives.

Honestly, "rape" is definitely not on the same level as "murdered" or "killed". Rape implies that someone in a position of power asserted his dominance over someone else and emotionally and physically exploited him or her. It pretty much is one of the most horrible and scarring things somebody can do a fellow human being. It carries so much hateful and disgusting meaning that it doesn't matter if its "just" a word. It stands for something truly ugly that has to be expunged.

I would say that if hearing "I raped you" on Xbox live is too much for a person, then they shouldn't be on there to begin with because I can't imagine how a person would deal with killing virtual people in a game like COD or Halo.

You can't compare killing and rape like that. They are on two completely different levels. Killing is justified in video-games with competition, self defence or with a bad guy that just needs killing. Context is provided to legitimise shooting someone in the back. As far as as media is concerned, killing is a pretty abstract thing that can mean a multitude of things to a lot of people. Its not even close to being on the same level as rape. How can one justify rape? Killing at least has a certain finality to it. Rape just stays with someone forever. I can understand children using the word to some extent because they want to be on top of the food-chain in the curse/insult arms race that is the internet. But why would a grown human even want to use it to describe the domination of a competitor. As a matter of fact, why not just use "dominate" instead? There are so many perfectly fitting words out there that can be insulting or taunting without sounding like a insensitive and ignorant asshole. (and that are also a lot funnier)

Rape is just so much more personal than murder, as strange as it sounds.

What I'm trying to imagine is you answer why it is ok to use the word murder or starving.

Starving is an insult on XBox live? Like..."I totally made you...starved for kills?"

 

[Susan Arendt]

It's not about offending, it's about hurting someone, on a very real level. What's more important to you - your use of the word, or not making someone relive trauma? What do you value more - saying "I raped you" on Xbox Live, or not giving someone nightmares?

That's what it comes down to, really. This isn't about someone's delicate sensibilities, this is about the fact that a single word can actually cause someone emotional and physical pain.

I would say that if hearing "I raped you" on Xbox live is too much for a person, then they shouldn't be on there to begin with because I can't imagine how a person would deal with killing virtual people in a game like COD or Halo.

EDIT:wow, its very nice to "meet" you! I didn't know that you guys actually read the forums.

And if murder or killing was something that the person in question had experienced personally, you might have a point. But you're comparing a virtual violent act with an actual trauma that someone went through - a comparison so off point that I'm forced to wonder if you're even trying to understand the core argument, or just brushing it off.

 

[itsthesheppy]

There shouldn't be places where rape survivors 'shouldn't' go in our society. If those places exist, it should be up to all of us to eliminate them and turn them into places where they feel included. Trauma survivors have every right the rest of us do to play the games they want and it is not our place to tell them otherwise.

So what should victims of gang violence/terrorism/genocide/famine do about the kinds of words that people use online and in real life?

The same thing you and I should do. Make it clear that such language won't be tolerated because it's hurtful.

 

[jemima101]

An amazing article, and explanation of why words matter. I have been very uncomfortable with the terminology of BDSm for quite a while, words like rape play are bandied around with no understanding of what rape is. I wish everyone could read this article and understand more about the emotions survivors live with.

 

[dragonswarrior]

Epic Snips

So... You do realize that you're lumping good feminists in with a bunch of stupid people right?

I mean, I'll grant you that I don't know everyone. I only know a very few people, and I only listen to fewer. But the people I know who are feminists don't have these crappy "Double standards" that you keep talking about.

Because those double standards are stupid. And if a feminist says it's okay for a woman to be raped in a book with fabio on the cover then he or she isn't a real feminist.

He or she is an idiot.

 

[Helmholtz Watson]

Are you honestly comparing those two things? They're horrible words and while I wouldn't say use them, your argument lacks for two things

1)I've never heard someone describe beating someone at a race as murdering them.

2)I don't know many murder victims who play X-Box live. If someone on there WAS a murder victim I'd either call an exorcist or ask how they survived and probably not refer to my victory as killing them.

1) I never asked you whether or not you have heard the term. I picked that very specific example because I have heard that when I played racing games.

2)Cute, how nice of you to overlook people who have survived attempted murders and people who's family members have died from gang violence and terrorism.

Your ignoring the very point of the reply, imagine something PERSONAL being thrown in your face every time not because you bring it up but because some guy or girl you're never going to meet just wants to use the word and doesn't give two shits. If you want to compare it to something, Rape doesn't compare to saying you murdered someone or you starvationed them, it would compare to saying to a random woman 'Hey, it's raining like a miscarriage out here. Oh, you had one? Well f*ck you, I want to use the word'. Though even that pales in comparison to the emotions Rape brings up.

You know what I'm imagining? You making an argument that doesn't use an appeal to emotion fallacy [http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/appeal-to-emotion].

You can't imagine it, huh? Well, maybe you should consider yourself lucky.

I consider myself Helmholtz Watson but you can call me lucky if you want. ;D

 

[the_lollipop_dragon]

From one survivor to another, kudos for the having the courage to do this.

The part about flashbacks being more like a download of old emotions.. thats exactly what my flashbacks are like most of the time. I also get a numbness in my mind but my stomache flips and the rest of my body feels the emotion.

It's a personal annoynce of mine, that people treat rape like its a gender issue. Its not a gender iwssue, its a human issue. Even though I identify as a feminist I feel like there is much work to be done helping bridge the divide between the genders, and getting rid of the association of sexual assault as a woman's crime is one of the first steps. I continue to identify as a feminist because I feel like gender issues get ignored otherwise, and out of respect for the previous activists who came before me and identified as such. I still put most of my efforts into bridging the gap between both of the genders instead of creating more of a gap between us in the name of something good.

 

[Helmholtz Watson]

There shouldn't be places where rape survivors 'shouldn't' go in our society. If those places exist, it should be up to all of us to eliminate them and turn them into places where they feel included. Trauma survivors have every right the rest of us do to play the games they want and it is not our place to tell them otherwise.

So what should victims of gang violence/terrorism/genocide/famine do about the kinds of words that people use online and in real life?

The same thing you and I should do. Make it clear that such language won't be tolerated because it's hurtful.

As long as you peruse those misuses of words like murder, starvation or killed, you and I have no issue.

 

[Shjade]

snip

You typed this better than I could have ever hoped too.

I try to convey these same feelings sometimes but it ends up sounding unsympathetic (to others at least). So I'll be saving this post for the future later.

Except his post does come across as unsympathetic and off-topic. This isn't an article about feminism and I should think reading it would convey the point that rape isn't purely a feminine problem.

He couldn't have missed the mark worse if he tried.

 

[itsthesheppy]

Your ignoring the very point of the reply, imagine something PERSONAL being thrown in your face every time not because you bring it up but because some guy or girl you're never going to meet just wants to use the word and doesn't give two shits. If you want to compare it to something, Rape doesn't compare to saying you murdered someone or you starvationed them, it would compare to saying to a random woman 'Hey, it's raining like a miscarriage out here. Oh, you had one? Well f*ck you, I want to use the word'. Though even that pales in comparison to the emotions Rape brings up.

You know what I'm imagining? You making an argument that doesn't use an appeal to emotion fallacy [http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/appeal-to-emotion].

I never said any of that. I'll thank you not to misquote me.

 

[itsthesheppy]

There shouldn't be places where rape survivors 'shouldn't' go in our society. If those places exist, it should be up to all of us to eliminate them and turn them into places where they feel included. Trauma survivors have every right the rest of us do to play the games they want and it is not our place to tell them otherwise.

So what should victims of gang violence/terrorism/genocide/famine do about the kinds of words that people use online and in real life?

The same thing you and I should do. Make it clear that such language won't be tolerated because it's hurtful.

As long as you peruse those that misuse words like murder, starvation or killed, you and I have no issue.

I certainly will, if I'm in the presence of someone for whom those words are hurtful. However.

As was explained in a Jimquisition episode posted today, 'rape' as a term holds a great deal more power than 'kill'. I won't paraphrase him here; it's ten minutes of your life to watch and I'll even link it for your convenience. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/jimquisition/5972-Rape-vs-Murder]

I feel you are not being intellectually honest, however. I'd prefer if you came forward with your feelings. Do you truly feel that the words 'kill', 'starving', 'genocide', 'murder' etc, are all equally powerful and ought to be avoided? Or are you 'making a point' in saying that if we make it clear that 'rape' isn't tolerated that we are being intellectually dishonest and, therefor, should just use the word because slippery slopes and so forth?

Out with it. Either you think the author of the article is wrong and that the word should be used freely by whoever likes with no consequences, or you feel that we're not being intolerant enough of potential trigger words, in which case we are still in disagreement, but mostly because I'd think you were taking it to a 'logical extreme' that isn't necessary.

 

[Hollyday]

I really don't have anything original to add to this thread. Reading the comments so far people have pretty much summed up my feelings, but I couldn't leave without saying something.

I have never read such a frank article on this issue. Thank you so much for writing this and opening it up to comments. I feel genuinely moved by your piece and hope to read more articles tackling such issues, with the same authenticity and emotional depth, in future on this site.

 

[Sartan0]

I did not read the replies as I assumed someone else would post something that would piss me off.

Thank you for your article. I could not possibly fully understand living with what you do. But what you said reminded me why I think that actual crime needs to have even harsher penalties then the law currently allows.

For all you gamers out there this is what you can do: If you hear someone using that language call them on it in every way you can. Plain and simple.

 

[Safaia]

Oh anon I just want to pull you into a hug so we can go cry together. Thank you for sharing.

 

[Helmholtz Watson]

You can't compare killing and rape like that. They are on two completely different levels. Killing is justified in video-games with competition, self defence or with a bad guy that just needs killing. Context is provided to legitimise shooting someone in the back. As far as as media is concerned, killing is a pretty abstract thing that can mean a multitude of things to a lot of people. Its not even close to being on the same level as rape. How can one justify rape? Killing at least has a certain finality to it. Rape just stays with someone forever.

I was referring to using the word rape in trash talking on xbox live, not as a game mechanic.

I can understand children using the word to some extent because they want to be on top of the food-chain in the curse/insult arms race that is the internet. But why would a grown human even want to use it to describe the domination of a competitor. As a matter of fact, why not just use "dominate" instead? There are so many perfectly fitting words out there that can be insulting or taunting without sounding like a insensitive and ignorant asshole. (and that are also a lot funnier)

Because it's trash talking?

Starving is an insult on XBox live? Like..."I totally made you...starved for kills?"

Starving as a word that is used to exaggerate a situation like being hungry. I was under the impression that this thread was also talking about the use of the word rape IRL as well.

 

[Anonymous]

Your taking a shotgun to the subject in hopes of hitting something. I'll start out in being blunt in saying (as I've said before) that I myself was raped by a gay man when I was six. In my cause though I blocked it out, which doesn't make it any easier when you know it happened.

I disagree with what you have said in the rest of your post regarding feminism, but I'm very sorry about what happened to you. It's a very difficult thing to live with and even more difficult to talk about, and I respect you for being able to speak about it.

I would encourage you to talk to someone about it -- a professional, a family member, someone in the clergy, or even a friend. Believe me, talking about it helps a lot. Turning your back on it and hoping you won't remember doesn't work and often makes things worse. That was definitely the case with me.

 

[Shjade]

Dude, don't play video games if you don't want to hear it, or don't listen to what people have to say on Xbox live.

You say this as if this kind of language is a requisite element of video games and Xbox Live. The latter, maybe that's true, I wouldn't know, I don't have an Xbox and for all I know touching that console infects your linguistic center with a Tourette's-like condition requiring you to spew bile as long as it's in use. It's possible.

It sure as hell isn't inherent to video games, though. So, hey, how about instead you don't play video games if you want to hurt people?

Starving as a word that is used to exaggerate a situation like being hungry. I was under the impression that this thread was also talking about the use of the word rape IRL as well.

Rape isn't an exaggeration of murder. It's a completely different action. This is part of the problem with your comparisons: most of the terms you're bringing up are larger versions of things that are happening (ex: "It was genocide" when describing a team kill. Killing five people isn't really genocide, but it's the same physical activity and context, just on a smaller scale.). Comparing this to using a word for a completely different action with completely different consequences doesn't work. It's like asking, "Why is it okay for me to call these apples a fruit basket but not okay to call them a Cadillac? They're just words." Well, yes, they are just words, but "fruit basket" is at least something close enough to extrapolate from "apples." A car is something completely different and has no business being used as a substitute for pieces of fruit.

If you're wondering why I went in such a random direction with my metaphor, it's a subtle way of pointing out you're being ridiculous (which, given this explanation, is now less subtle).

Edit: Second quote attribution fixed.

 

[Helmholtz Watson]

a comparison so off point that I'm forced to wonder if you're even trying to understand the core argument, or just brushing it off.

I understand it and I disagree with it.

Your ignoring the very point of the reply, imagine something PERSONAL being thrown in your face every time not because you bring it up but because some guy or girl you're never going to meet just wants to use the word and doesn't give two shits. If you want to compare it to something, Rape doesn't compare to saying you murdered someone or you starvationed them, it would compare to saying to a random woman 'Hey, it's raining like a miscarriage out here. Oh, you had one? Well f*ck you, I want to use the word'. Though even that pales in comparison to the emotions Rape brings up.

You know what I'm imagining? You making an argument that doesn't use an appeal to emotion fallacy [http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/appeal-to-emotion].

I never said any of that. I'll thank you not to misquote me.

That entire quote was an appeal to emotion. You didn't say why murder is a word that is allowed to be used, you just kept bringing up the feeling of rape victims and how they should be considered while ignoring my question about the word murder.

I feel you are not being intellectually honest, however. I'd prefer if you came forward with your feelings. Do you truly feel that the words 'kill', 'starving', 'genocide', 'murder' etc, are all equally powerful and ought to be avoided? Or are you 'making a point' in saying that if we make it clear that 'rape' isn't tolerated that we are being intellectually dishonest and, therefor, should just use the word because slippery slopes and so forth?

Out with it. Either you think the author of the article is wrong and that the word should be used freely by whoever likes with no consequences, or you feel that we're not being intolerant enough of potential trigger words, in which case we are still in disagreement, but mostly because I'd think you were taking it to a 'logical extreme' that isn't necessary.

I feel that words like rape are just as bad as murder or kill and that if you are going to avoid using the word rape, you should avoid using hyperboles like murder or killing. However, seeing as how I don't think that they are nothing more than words, I feel that people should be allowed to say what you want on Xbox Live.

 

[Helmholtz Watson]

So, hey, how about instead you don't play video games if you want to hurt people?

No, if people payed for it, they have a right to use the product.

 

[Shjade]

So, hey, how about instead you don't play video games if you want to hurt people?

No, if people payed for it, they have a right to use the product.

Doesn't wash. If you pay for a gun, you don't then have the right to shoot someone with it. Owning a thing doesn't endow you with the power to use it in any way you see fit.