Conflict between Palestine and Israel escalates

[Silvanus]

Hey... Hey buddy. You notice how my response shows actual video of the spot the rocket hit? You know, where you can clearly see the blast radius, a lack of a destroyed hospital in that blast radius, and a lack of triple digit bodies that would be impossible to remove in such a short amount of time? You think maybe basing a conclusion on video evidence rather than "Some schmuck said" might have something to do with my confidence?

Basing your conclusion on what is shown in a single short clip of footage, which doesn't show the event or its entire impact area-- and then acting as if nothing happened that wasn't shown in that clip-- is not reasonable or rational.

Every side acknowledges casualties in the triple digits. Literally none of the involved parties deny that. Nor do international intelligence communities or reporters.

And for what it's worth, the post Agema was referring to was the one on which you replied to me, saying "THE. HOSPITAL. WAS. NOT. DESTROYED"... in response to a post that didn't claim the hospital was destroyed. That was just pretty weird.

 

[Seanchaidh]

Hey... Hey buddy. You notice how my response shows actual video of the spot the rocket hit? You know, where you can clearly see the blast radius, a lack of a destroyed hospital in that blast radius, and a lack of triple digit bodies that would be impossible to remove in such a short amount of time? You think maybe basing a conclusion on video evidence rather than "Some schmuck said" might have something to do with my confidence?

It is not at all impossible for hundreds of people or even tens of people to remove hundreds of corpses in a few hours. It is rather grim, but that doesn't mean much. It's a busy hospital. There are lots of people around, both staff and people seeking refuge from all the other bombs Israel is dropping. A hospital-- or really any urban or suburban environment-- is not the sort of place that you tolerate rotting corpses.

Spoiler: same video uncensored including many corpses

Israel warned the hospital that it was going to bomb it and demanded they evacuate, both with phone calls and 'door-knocker' artillery fire. It then did so. An advisor to Netanyahu that is engaged in Israel's propaganda war praised the attack, claiming that there were Hamas targets at the hospital, and the IDF's Arabic-language facebook page made a gruesome joke about helping the hospital with its lack of supplies and staff by giving them euthanasia. Then those posts were deleted to make way for asinine claims about a failed rocket launch. The IDF said Al-Jazeera's coverage supported their story; Al-Jazeera convincingly demonstrated otherwise. Channel 4 News in the UK also convincingly demonstrated otherwise, both about the videos of rockets and bombs and explosions against Israel's claims as well as the "intercepted audio" which numerous Arabic speakers have said is very obviously fake-- and to my knowledge none have said otherwise.

The kind interpretation is that you are pretending confidence. The unkind interpretation is that you actually believe what you're writing. Given what I've seen from you here, you should probably just be less confident in general.

 

[Seanchaidh]

To be clear, my above post was referring to a prior Channel 4 report. I hadn't seen this one yet:


For reasons that should be entirely obvious if you watch it, my opinion remains unchanged.

 

[Silvanus]

the IDF's Arabic-language facebook page made a gruesome joke about helping the hospital with its lack of supplies and staff by giving them euthanasia.

Quick note (that isn't terribly important in the context of the wider post, which is accurate) but that post was not on the IDF's official Arabic-language page. It appears to have been a page mocked up to look like an IDF page with a similar logo and name etc.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: when you warn hospitals to evacuate under threat of bombing, shell hospitals as a warning to evacuate ahead of bombing, bomb other hospitals in the past, and have spent weeks and years justifying *why* you have to bomb hospitals, you don't get to be mad when an explosion happens at a hospital and everybody assumes you did it.

Not to reiterate how much it basically doesn't matter: in the time arguing about this hospital, a half dozen high-profile and god knows how many low-profile small-scale atrocities are happening, including bombs at other hospitals, bakeries, homes, and churches. Some of the oldest churches in the world

And the propaganda world is just getting fucking stupid, from octopus plushies being problematic to trying to drag Taylor Swift into it because an event security guy who worked a show once joined the IDF to this:

 

[Gergar12]

Progressive calls for cease-fire fuel Democratic divisions over Israel

Progressive members of Congress are increasing their calls for a cease-fire and upping pressure on President Biden amid the Israel-Hamas war, highlighting differences within the Democratic Party as…

thehill.com

At one point, or another Biden is going to have to call for a ceasefire. I hope it's now.

 

[Ag3ma]

At one point, or another Biden is going to have to call for a ceasefire. I hope it's now.

I was a little suprised by how gung-ho a lot of the Western leaders were. If Israel invades Gaza and the death toll starts getting nasty, there'll be some hefty backpedalling.

I kind of get the feeling that everyone's been trying to forget about the Palestinians. If Hamas has achieved anything, it's wrecking that strategy.

 

[Thaluikhain]

At one point, or another Biden is going to have to call for a ceasefire. I hope it's now.

Possibly wait until Israel has done all the killing it feels like this time, then they can declare peace and look diplomatic.

 

[crimson5pheonix]

I was a little suprised by how gung-ho a lot of the Western leaders were. If Israel invades Gaza and the death toll starts getting nasty, there'll be some hefty backpedalling.

I kind of get the feeling that everyone's been trying to forget about the Palestinians. If Hamas has achieved anything, it's wrecking that strategy.

I'm surprised you're surprised. Funding Israel is a nice stable contract for the defense industry.

 

[Specter Von Baren]

Detroit synagogue president Samantha Woll found fatally stabbed outside her home

Samantha Woll, 40, led the Isaac Agree Downtown Detroit Synagogue since 2022. Police have not announced a motive or suspect.

www.freep.com

Looks like violence is continuing to escalate outside of the middle east.

 

[Seanchaidh]

Quick note (that isn't terribly important in the context of the wider post, which is accurate) but that post was not on the IDF's official Arabic-language page. It appears to have been a page mocked up to look like an IDF page with a similar logo and name etc.

ok. how can you tell?

 

[BrawlMan]

Detroit synagogue president Samantha Woll found fatally stabbed outside her home

Samantha Woll, 40, led the Isaac Agree Downtown Detroit Synagogue since 2022. Police have not announced a motive or suspect.

www.freep.com

Looks like violence is continuing to escalate outside of the middle east.

Who and what fucking assholes are doing this shit in my home town? People with their pathetic and petty hatred. Whoever was involved killed a good and important woman who only wanted peace. Who ever this person or people are, when they get caught, their ass(es) won't be surviving general population.

 

[Silvanus]

ok. how can you tell?

Because the official Arabic-language IDF page is this. The profile that posted that has been taken down-- not just the post being deleted, but the profile itself no longer exists, which definitely wouldn't happen for an official IDF profile. Plus, the official pages all have verification marks on Facebook, whereas that one didn't.

 

[Specter Von Baren]

Who and what fucking assholes are doing this shit in my home town? People with their pathetic and petty hatred. Whoever was involved killed a good and important woman who only wanted peace. Who ever this person or people are, when they get caught, their ass(es) won't be surviving general population.

Oh my God.... I'm seeing people debating (Not here) whether A WOMAN FOUND DEAD FROM MULTIPLE STAB WOUNDS should be called a murder yet. This is the stupidest, pedantic shit I've ever seen.

 

[Thaluikhain]

Oh my God.... I'm seeing people debating (Not here) whether A WOMAN FOUND DEAD FROM MULTIPLE STAB WOUNDS should be called a murder yet. This is the stupidest, pedantic shit I've ever seen.

Was almost tempted to say that as a form of cheap satire. But seems reality beat me to it.

 

[BrawlMan]

I'm seeing people debating (Not here) whether A WOMAN FOUND DEAD FROM MULTIPLE STAB WOUNDS should be called a murder yet. This is the stupidest, pedantic shit I've ever seen.

If this is Twitter or Reddit you saw these asinine and dumb arguments coming from, then it shouldn't surprise you. Fuck these assholes and ignore them. They don't care so long as it's not them or someone they care about.

 

[The Rogue Wolf]

Oh my God.... I'm seeing people debating (Not here) whether A WOMAN FOUND DEAD FROM MULTIPLE STAB WOUNDS should be called a murder yet. This is the stupidest, pedantic shit I've ever seen.

"We can't rule out that it's just a tragic sandwich-making accident."

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

Be a real bad time for it to be a misfiring mugging. Do we have *all* the evidence? Wouldn't want to jump to conclusions and all

 

[Ag3ma]

I'm surprised you're surprised. Funding Israel is a nice stable contract for the defense industry.

A few extra dollars for the defence industry doesn't outweigh politicians looking after themselves. They risk huge embarrassment - and electoral pain - to go all in on Israel when it is led by a corrupt thug with a history of not listening to his allies, liable to kick off a human rights catastrophe and further destabilise the Middle East. Even if support for Israel largely survives, a regional crisis could be interpreted as mismanagement of foreign affairs.

A Democratic Pary leader might be particularly wise to be cautious, because a lot more Democratic voters are skeptical towards Israel and sensitive to a slaughter.

 

[Thaluikhain]

A few extra dollars for the defence industry doesn't outweigh politicians looking after themselves. They risk huge embarrassment - and electoral pain - to go all in on Israel when it is led by a corrupt thug with a history of not listening to his allies, liable to kick off a human rights catastrophe and further destabilise the Middle East. Even if support for Israel largely survives, a regional crisis could be interpreted as mismanagement of foreign affairs.

A Democratic Pary leader might be particularly wise to be cautious, because a lot more Democratic voters are skeptical towards Israel and sensitive to a slaughter.

The Dems trying to appeal to the hardliners by doing something terrible, failing to sway their votes, but losing not-evil people, is hardly unknown.