Poll: Metroid: Other M killed Samus

[Monk Ed]

I had a bad opinion of Samus's characterization at first, but then I realized something which basically amounts to "Samus's personality is good and deep -- but the goodness is hidden beneath bad, bad writing." A lot of what I at first attributed to her personality I eventually attributed instead to the poor execution. For example, she gets called "whiny" but that's only because we're being inappropriately told her innermost thoughts which she is not actually telling anyone. (In-game, she's very reserved.) This is why I say she was not ruined "FOREVER".

 

[Lunar Templar]

this side of Samus doesn't surprise me, but they coulda left her some common sense (lava zone chase i'm looking at you)

far as i'm concerd, any one whinny about 'how they ruined Samus with other M' is an idiot and needs to read up on her back story before popping off again.
yes, its fanboy sounding, butits true, a lot of the whinning is from ppl who donno the back story,
and anything from G4 TVs fail feast that is Xplay, is ignorable anyway

What backstory? The manga that was only released in japan? Or the vague mentions of space pirates killing her family in the games that was never expanded on? What about the Chozo? That's part of her backstory too.

the manga is easy to get, google it and you should find it in to top few links (which expands on the pirate bit) as for the chozo upbringing, Other M is focusing on her military career, but yes, all of the above, i fail to see how letting her be 'human, flawed, and scarred by her past is a bad thing, since we HAVEN'T gotten any back story to speak of from the games

Do you not see the flaw in having the majority of your fanbase not having easy access to that manga then? A lot of metroid fans may not even know of the existence of the manga or just might not care because it nintendo didn't bother to release it anywhere else, it's probably not important. At least that's the common reasoning I've heard. Plus fan translations should always be taken with a grain of salt. Her being "Human, flawed and scarred by her past" is bad because it creates a dissonance with the gameplay, in the cutscnes she does nothing but whine and moan about how terrible she is and how badly she messes everything up and how she should be a good obedient little girl, or she freaks out and gets anthony 'killed' or Adam has to kill himself because despite blowing up planets and getting out before the timer goes off she can't do this. Yet in the gameplay she's as stoic and badass as ever, even in the other games (and other games where we're given brief glimpses of personality, despite people not noticing there were a few moments in the prime series as well) it all goes against this where she isn't some whiny girl. She has fears and everything, but she doesn't wear them on her sleeve. She isn't a little girl who needs daddy to hold her hand through the big bad space station. Furthermore, in Other M that is ALL we're given of her personality. She wasn't proven to be competent or strong despite these flaws, straight through to the end in every cutscene she was a coward, a little girl who couldn't even stand up to that asshole in the last scene of the game. She had to be rescued by Anthony who apparently hopped on frozen lava monsters to survival. Despite the fact that Samus single handedly took down the freaking metroid queen.

twice, and while i see your point, it, being other M, dosen't bother all that much outside the odd moments, yes, she should be less submissive and whinny, but all this can likely be pinned on Team Ninja for thinking it was a good idea, and Nintendo for giving it to them to begin with -.-

 

[Dfskelleton]

Once again, another character ruined (temporarily) by trying to be "Emotional" and "Complex". I'm not a big metroid fan, but I played prime when I was a kid and loved it. The thing is this: At least she didn't HAVE personality and lose it. If They start out badass and get more personality, it could be problematic, like trying to make Doomguy sad and emotional. However, if he's like Kratos who starts off with a bit of personality and loses it, it's worse. Now, Kratos was a badass for the most part initially, so it's not a big deal, but say James Sunderland ran in with a chaingun and grenade launcher shirtless. Pretty stupid.

 

[Flamma Man]

twice, and while i see your point, it, being other M, dosen't bother all that much outside the odd moments, yes, she should be less submissive and whinny, but all this can likely be pinned on Team Ninja for thinking it was a good idea, and Nintendo for giving it to them to begin with -.-

There's something funny you should know, the person who wrote the game and the characterization of Samus was the original Co-Creator of the character.

Yeah, I laughed too when I learned this. So...yeah, it WAS Nintendo's fault. Team Ninja only worked on the gameplay.

 

[The_Echo]

I read a little bit of the article. I stopped when I realized the author was complaining that they tried to add more realistic characteristics to an otherwise nigh-inhuman character.

The part about how Samus could lob missiles at Mother Brain and then be composed enough to flee... How do I put this? It's called "you totally got it wrong." As I see it, Samus could have just as easily been shitting herself with fear as she tried to save her skin. After all, she was a mainly silent character. Her character was really up to personal interpretation until Other M.

 

[Flamma Man]

Actually he wasn't. He was the director of the original game along with Gunpei Yokoi. Hiroji Kiyotake and Makoto Kano created Samus.

Ah, my bad.

 

[Marble Dragon]

...I disagree. Very, very much.

Part of the argument is that Samus acts like a girl now. Boo fucking hoo - Samus is a girl, in case those boobs didn't say anything.

Also...I'll add that it was written by a woman. But more importantly, a feminist. This sounded nearly identical to the same person that wrote the 2/5 review about Samus' character instead of the game. And reading the 1,000+ comments about that article, about 90% of the comment posters have countered her.

Feminism? Bullshit. Saying that women need to act like men to earn any sort of respect is pretty counterproductive, if you ask me. What I get from the article is "I liked Samus better when she was practically a man with boobs." I don't buy it for a second.

Disclaimer: I've never actually played Other M. I may be wrong, and Miss Drake might be entirely correct.

 

[Flamma Man]

Actually he wasn't. He was the director of the original game along with Gunpei Yokoi. Hiroji Kiyotake and Makoto Kano created Samus.

Ah, my bad.

Not entirely since he's pretty much aping their work these days claiming he created her and that the entire series was his idea. He's turned into a bit of a **** and is pretty much removing everything that made the series unique and fun. They need to give the control to someone else. Someone who isn't crazy and thinks more about their kawaii waifu samus then the actual game.

Oh, well then, he's a **** for misinforming me.

And by your previous statement about him, he sounds kinda...creepy.

 

[MBurner 93]

http://screwattack.com/videos/TGO-Episode-40-Heavens-to-Metroid

/thread

Oh, Bob.

Way to completely miss the point of why people don't like Samus. It isn't because they gave her a personality, it's just that this personality that they gave her was whinny, overbearing, annoying, melodramatic and pretty much telling us all about her.

I also love his argument about "Projection" when that's pretty much the basics of "Show don't tell". Throughout all the games, we saw Samus as a loner due to her choosing to be a lonely bounty hunter and never really getting close to anyone, but they also showed us that she did have feelings and wasn't a "robot" as Bob says.

This is easily shown throughout the Prime games if Bob didn't have his "FPS hate dial up to eleven."

But really, Bob's been really annoying lately, especially with his recent Overthinker videos which pretty much label him as a hardcore Nintendo Fanboy.

God, that Sony episode was shit and his latest one, this one, was no different.

I cringed throughout the whole "Strawman" bit.

UGH.

Yea honestly. That whole Strawman bit thing he does kinda pisses me off. In that vid, his strawman basically implies that everyone who didn't like the new Samus in Other M is a Japanaphobic troll from 4chan.

 

[Gigaguy64]

Actually he wasn't. He was the director of the original game along with Gunpei Yokoi. Hiroji Kiyotake and Makoto Kano created Samus.

Ah, my bad.

Not entirely since he's pretty much aping their work these days claiming he created her and that the entire series was his idea. He's turned into a bit of a **** and is pretty much removing everything that made the series unique and fun. They need to give the control to someone else. Someone who isn't crazy and thinks more about their kawaii waifu samus then the actual game.

Now this is also something i agree with.
Every time iv read an interview with Sakamoto he has come off as a Self absorbed Prick.

 

[Flamma Man]

...I disagree. Very, very much.

Part of the argument is that Samus acts like a girl now. Boo fucking hoo - Samus is a girl, in case those boobs didn't say anything.

Disclaimer: I've never actually played Other M. I may be wrong, and Miss Drake might be entirely correct.

The argument was NEVER about Samus acting like a girl, it's that her personality has been brought down to being an overbearing, shallow, over dramatic, exposition spewing annoyance.

 

[Flamma Man]

Yea honestly. That whole Strawman bit thing he does kinda pisses me off. In that vid, his strawman basically implies that everyone who didn't like the new Samus in Other M is a Japanaphobic troll from 4chan.

So his strawman...is a strawman? How fitting.[/quote]Yeah, I actually kinda laughed a little when I thought about it after finishing the video.

 

[Monk Ed]

The argument was NEVER about Samus acting like a girl, it's that her personality has been brought down to being an overbearing, shallow, over dramatic, exposition spewing annoyance.

If you were to mute the game whenever Samus begins a soliloquy, would the result be a much better experience? In other words, is it really just the storytelling style that has created this perception of her being a whining annoyance? Because outside of those, it looked to me like Samus was her usual terse self.

 

[Flamma Man]

The argument was NEVER about Samus acting like a girl, it's that her personality has been brought down to being an overbearing, shallow, over dramatic, exposition spewing annoyance.

If you were to mute the game whenever Samus begins a soliloquy, would the result be a much better experience? In other words, is it really just the storytelling style that has created this perception of her being a whining annoyance? Because outside of those, it looked to me like Samus was her usual terse self.

I assume you mean the cut scenes?

 

[Wintermute_]

YES. they f***ing ruined her. So wut if she wasn't characterized? she had fantastic games that where just amazing. Now, she's just another emotionally crippled space marine with that "dark and gritty" past like every. thing. else.

Here's the deal. The cool thing about Samus was her lack of characterization. She could be whoever or whatever, and I think metroid was defiantly more about the world and story then samus. However, Now nintendo half-assed her characterization and she generic and just lame.

its not like their was really much character to ruin. but no one here can really say its "good" right? there was nothing redeeming about the character. just shallow and generally an un-needed addition to an otherwise really good series, the metroids and the metroid primes.

 

[icame]

I had to go play the prime trilogy again just to make sure we didn't enter a singularity where all female characters act like whiny bitches and need a guy to tell her what fucking weapon she can use.

 

[Monk Ed]

double post deleted

 

[Monk Ed]

But if you mute it then you'd miss out on actual dialogue and sounds. Basically if you could somehow edit out the pointless narrations that just tell you literally what is going on. She will go on and on telling you exactly what's going on in the flashback even as the characters are saying things and doing things, and then in the end it will almost always end with "ADAM WAS RIGHT I'M STUPID" (paraphrased of course). But you know, someone's about to die? She's about to die? Something dangerous about to go on? TIME FOR A FLASHBACK TO WHINE ABOUT HOW STUPID SHE IS AND HOW SHE CAN'T DO ANYTHING! The story is outright terrible. Sakamoto has no talent.

Editing out the soliloquies is what I meant, yeah.

That's my thesis: that Samus's actual personality as depicted within the action of the game is 99% A-OK and badass and all that, and it's really just the overwritten soliloquies that created the bad impression in people's minds. Her soliloquy lines are even spoken in a different tone from what she uses with people in-game; it's rather striking once you notice it.

If Samus's pains and self-doubt had been shown in indirect ways through better direction -- for example, showing a brief cut of her left hand tightening its grip on her cannon to show her emotional pain at being called an outsider in that one early scene -- I wager she'd have come off a lot better to the American audience.

 

[LogicNProportion]

I certainly wasn't happy with the direction they took Samus...

Also, I'm fucking SICK of hearing Jennifer Hale's voice! D<

 

[Grounogeos]

They didn't ruin Samus in Other M.

True, their characterization wasn't the best. But really, how can you characterize Samus well when she's become a badass on par with (or better than) Master-fucking-Chief without saying a single word throughout the entire series? And personally, I like the way they characterized her, especially her still being upset over the Metroid Hatchling getting killed by Mother Brain.