Valve Delivers Blizzard-esque Dota 2 Trailer

[KCL]

ok ok hold up.

NONE OF THIS is true.

Wrong. All of it is true.

Eul made the original DotA for WC3 based off of AoS from Starcraft

Wrong. DotA isn't based on the original AoS map any more than BioShock is based on Doom. They share some basic gameplay. That's it. In fact, DotA grew out of other WC3 AoS maps, which were wildly popular on Battle.net from day one of WC3's launch.

and when The Frozen Throne came out decided to not continue updating it.

Also wrong. In fact, Eul tried to up the ante when The Frozen Throne came out. He created DotA 2: Thirst for Gamma. It sucked, and everyone was playing Tides of Blood instead (which is where the name of the Vladimir ability in League of Legends comes from). Since other people had stolen DotA from him and DotA 2 was a failure, Eul abandoned WC3 modding.

At this point, several different developers made their own versions of DotA for TFT

Correct. Of course, people had been making their own versions all along, just like people still make their own versions of Allstars today. But none of this has anything to do with what I said.

Allstars being the most popular as it took all of the most popular heroes from the other versions and put them in one map.

Wrong. There were actually multiple competing versions of Allstars, too. All of them used the "most popular heroes from other versions" shtick. They even took heroes from non-DotA maps. And this also has nothing to do with what I said.

After a few years, Guinsoo decided to stop updating the map and Icefrog took over. This was NOT the same time he was hired by Riot, that was later.

Wrong. It wasn't the same time that he announced his future plans or that Riot announced the new game. It was the same time that these discussions were happening behind the scenes. And once again, this has nothing to do with what I said.

Icefrog then introduced 75% of the heroes we have today, as well as remaking or removing most of the originals. The only heroes today that really haven't changed since Guinsoo are Traxex and Leoric, two heroes with fairly basic skills.

Not even close. A) IceFrog doesn't design the heroes. B) Plenty of other heroes date from Guinsoo's tenure, but like IceFrog he simply took heroes from the community (as well as from wc3sear.ch), so who cares? C) None of this has anything to do with what I said.

Under Icefrog, Allstars became so popular that it became the only DotA map, and a few months ago finally dropped allstars from its name.

Actually that happened under Guinsoo. There were then and still are other maps that have DotA in their title, but there's only one DotA. It's been that way since 2004. IceFrog's decision to drop the "Allstars" was purely symbolic.

But good job "getting your facts straight."

I know it was.

 

[AnteGravity]

I don't know if DotA is a superior game or if you just like it more.

As for cheap and easy being better, never said that. But a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. I'd rather keep the game that's been plenty good for me and is free over the unknown game that cost money.

If you A) Don't know if it better or not, B) Refuse to give it a sincere try to find out, C) Highly skeptical of other people's judgements, then you are simply beholden to an insufferable position.

Thus, the only thing I can discern is that you must be too poor/cheap/miserly and looking for some vague rationalization to excuse still expressing some opinion on the game.

What can possibly change your choice from "it maybe not be better" to "it is worth the asking price?"

 

[dragongit]

I can still see much of the Warcraft influence in the characters, like the lumbering meat golem from WoW and WC3, and even the Tauren with the totem.

 

[LANCE420]

GAH! I hate DoTA! No half-life 3? ARGH.

 

[Irony's Acolyte]

I don't know if DotA is a superior game or if you just like it more.

As for cheap and easy being better, never said that. But a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. I'd rather keep the game that's been plenty good for me and is free over the unknown game that cost money.

If you A) Don't know if it better or not, B) Refuse to give it a sincere try to find out, C) Highly skeptical of other people's judgements, then you are simply beholden to an insufferable position.

Thus, the only thing I can discern is that you must be too poor/cheap/miserly and looking for some vague rationalization to excuse still expressing some opinion on the game.

What can possibly change your choice from "it maybe not be better" to "it is worth the asking price?"

Woah, you're read way too much into what I've said. I don't have much interest in the genre, and am not in a hurry to try it out. Will I eventually? Sure, I've heard good things about DotA. As for me being skeptical of you, it's simply to full on stated that DotA was the superior game. How can I tell whether this is an accurate evaluation of the game or if it's just some rabid fan spewing their love of their chosen game at me? How do I know it's not something in the middle or both?

You're get awfully defensive about a game that I only stated I had little interest in buying. I never said anything about DotA being a bad game or not worth money for. You merely assumed by my neutral opinion on the matter that I had a low view of it. I look to conserve the money I spend of video games and I'd rather pay money that I have an active interest in buying then another of unknown quality.

 

[Alar]

Also, I didn't mention it before, but I don't really feel that this looks as good as a Blizzard cinematic. Maybe, MAYBE an in-game cutscene.

 

[Shjade]

What is gameplay like in these things, anyway? I keep hearing about them, but I've never tried any. I do love the trailer, though.

Eh, gameplay is sorta...monotonous, really. Games are typically broken up into early-game (aka: "Laning phase"), mid-game (typically a roaming phase, where people start moving into other lanes/pushing hard in groups/working for map control), and late-game, where people start getting their builds together and teamfights have a more major impact on the outcome of the game (early teamfights can set one side ahead of the other, but rarely are they game-winning on their own; a late-game ace, on the other hand, tends to end the game right there if the winning side didn't die off as well). You kill a lot of minions that aren't paying attention to you to get gold while also attacking your opponents to try to stop them from killing YOUR minions for gold as well. Some of the above games emphasize killing your opponents over farming, others (LoL I know for certain) focus on the minion-farming and more or less discourage direct assault on your opposing champions until later on in the game. Economy differences, mainly.

One thing they all have in common, unfortunately, is incredibly insular, intolerant, and generally crappy communities. One need look no further than a thread on the LoL forums detailing their community's relationship with Brazilian players to see what I'm talking about, or browse a few threads griping/laughing about how much trolling goes on in games, and so on. It's worse than I ever saw in the WoW hardcore arena/pvp community, which is saying something.

All in all, DotA-style games are an okay distraction without much depth that tend to be plagued by jerkass communities.

 

[StrixMaxima]

Hmm, I was sincerely hoping for a different approach in DotA 2. The same heroes, the same Str-Agi-Int scheme, even the same items are hinted by the Heavy guy.

While DotA was an amazing mod, which kept me entertained for quite a while, I want something different, now. Specially considering that HoN is now free and a DotA clone with newer graphics and LoL offers a more entertaining development progression for its characters (which are also quite unique, for the most part).

I'll keep on following DotA 2, but I have to say I'm not very excited about it, so far.

 

[kouriichi]

It looks, so good. Normally, i think "3P1C GR4PH1CZ" arnt all that important to a game.
But this looks beautiful. Beyond what i thought it would be.

Even if i like Dota 2, i'll still probably play LoL more, just because of the friends i have on it.

 

[Frozengale]

While Valve is admittedly awesome they are basically just taking DotA and porting it warts and all. I think I will stick with LoL. It was made by one of the original DotA creators and he tried to improve upon the game instead of just make a direct copy. And then when it gets right down to it... LoL or DotA... I'll always know in my heart which MOBA is truly the best. Bloodline Champions of course.

 

[Vankraken]

I really hope they design this game understanding the differences between working within the limitations of the Warcraft 3 engine and actual good gameplay mechanics. People get really pissy about maintaining the integrity of dota and half the time it is blind devotion that people defend some of the gameplay mechanics and not so much if the mechanic is the actual ideal design for the game (working within limitations vs intended design).

 

[Dyme]

Oh, Hey Ashe, Hey Sion, Hey Skarner, Hey Nocturne, Hey Malphite, Hey Galio!!!

Poor form Valve, poor form.

What the fuck are you talking about?
Drow Ranger was in WC3, just like Axe and the other DotA champions.
If anyone is stealing, it is Riot from DotA/Warcraft.

Apart from that: Blizzard makes WAY prettier cinematics. More dynamic animations, far far faaaar more beautiful backgrounds.

And concerning DotA 2: It looks like DotA 2 is "stealing" some interface improvements from Riot, such as better hit point bars. Hope they also steal LoL's minimap, because it is just superior.

And I can see DotA 2 killing HoN. But LoL will be untouched, because it is just a different (better) game.

 

[Yokai]

To be completely honest, while this will no doubt be a high-quality and fun game, Valve's a little late. DotA clones have sprung up all over the place, and unless they actually move the genre forward (more than two or three maps, different objectives) this is likely going to be a complete waste of everyone's time.

 

[Shjade]

Oh, Hey Ashe, Hey Sion, Hey Skarner, Hey Nocturne, Hey Malphite, Hey Galio!!!

Poor form Valve, poor form.

I'm reminded of a claim I read wherein someone stated that Don't Stop Believing was created by the writers of Glee.

These character frameworks have been around a little while. [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/OlderThanTheyThink] The hooded archer, in particular, has existed as a "thing" for a long time, pretty much as long as elves have been thought of as archers. The earliest example I KNOW I can point to is Alleria from WC2, but I have no doubt there are earlier ones than that. It's a pretty popular theme.

 

[RA92]

I would usually sympathize with a community who had their mod bought by another company to be developed as a purchasable game - but the DotA community is so fucking terrible that I'm here enjoying myself watching 'em throw themselves into a fit.

Anyway, DOTA 2 is basically Valve's ticket to the competitive scene, which is big. The prize pool of LoL's Season 2 is $5 million, the winner of the DOTA2 tournament bags $1.6 million, and the Chinese DotA 1/StarCraft 2/Warcraft 3 team Catostrophic Cruel Memories was recently bought for $6.2 million.

CS:GO is being developed with eSports in mind as well.

 

[Random Argument Man]

I just hope we don't have the same community that the orginal DOTA had... I also kept thinking that the TF2 theme song would pop out at the last second..

 

[maddawg IAJI]

Oh, Hey Ashe, Hey Sion, Hey Skarner, Hey Nocturne, Hey Malphite, Hey Galio!!!

Poor form Valve, poor form.

Whu? But...*Sigh* Every single one of the champions you just mentioned had some form of inspiration drawn to them from one of the heroes you just saw.

For example, Skarner? His ultimate, Impale , was a move from a previous Dota champion.

Ashe? There are so many people in Dota who play and act exactly like her, that it would be impossible to narrow it down.

Urgot is believed to be based off of a previous Champion concept called the Spider Queen who in turn comes from a Dota Hero.

They took quotes and made multiple references to Dota and the game the mod was made for as well.

Malphite and Nocturne are based off of creatures from Warcraft 3 (Golems for Malphite and shades for Nocturne), Jarvan has several quotes taken straight from Arthas ("For my father, the king!") and Karthas had the unfortunate unoriginal fate of being named after the Lich King and one of the demons he served.

In short, the guys you just fighting were the originals here and the ones you're claiming they ripped off are the ones they inspired.

 

[mrwoo6]

Can I just call this now before this start to get stupid. When we begin to get more, and more DoTA 2 gameplay and info, can we all PLEASE not ***** about whats better, LoL, HoN or this?

I love LoL, and I know all of these games are shockingly similar. I also know it makes you feel better to argue that somehow the one you sunk your money into is better. But in the end doesn't matter, because its all just down to taste.

Its just a genre of game.

 

[Cenequus]

I really hope it's good but the trailer was meh,all it told me was:" don't worry we have the same champions as DOTA".

 

[Amondren]

I enjoyed myself some DOTA and I will probably pick this one up looking forward to it.