Who knows maybe the demo is really really old, and when the full game comes out. It'll be what we always wanted....I can dream right?
What the Hell, Gearbox?
- Thread starter Crash486
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Just cause 2 had minor health regen, but med packs were necessary to survive.Vibhor said:
And my post was not directed at the design-choices of DNF, but OP's statement that these game mechanics should die.
Dude. They haven't been working on it for that long.ToastiestZombie said:
Sure, someone had the idea back then, but it's not like they've had a full team sitting around thinking about the game for twelve years, only to start building it now.
That'd just be a stupid thing to do.
I actually went back and played duke 3D. Health packs work in FPS only if they are in good areas, problem with this is that without a regenerating health bar you can get stuck around a checkpoint with 2 hit points left and no med kits about to enter an area in which you have no choice but to be hit a few times (One part of duke 3D involves shrinking yourself and then running from enemies long enough to grow back and fight, problem is that with low health you will be killed instantly so when I had no health, that part became impossible since I couldn't switch weapons fast enough after I grew back)
I enjoy regenerating health bars but only if they are done well. I'd like there to be a health bar as well as a shield so the heath can only be increased by med kits but the shield will slowly recharge over time... Have any games even done that?
I enjoy regenerating health bars but only if they are done well. I'd like there to be a health bar as well as a shield so the heath can only be increased by med kits but the shield will slowly recharge over time... Have any games even done that?
Yeah, that's another good example. Loved the hell outta those games too.artanis_neravar said:
Gonna be interesting how they plan to "take it back to its roots" after this whole Vegas travesty.
*MINOR* health regen?Hyper-space said:
Health was divided in 4 quarters. Each quarter took 1 RPG shot to completely run out. The last quarter lasted the longest because it was constantly regenerating. That was no minor health regen. I could take armies with that much health(normal mind you) and still have enough to raid the nearby military base.
You are still not addressing my main point, the one about the game mechanics, you are dwelling on minor technicalities and subjective (not objective) experiences.Vibhor said:
You are still not addressing my main point, the one about the game mechanics, you are dwelling on minor technicalities and subjective (not objective) experiences.[/quote]Hyper-space said:
I was mocking your post that it was incorrect just like you mocked the OP.
See,this is the problem that we all face when we go off topic.
Sadly nobody is crying over regenerating health(DNF has EGO instead of health anyway). OP is a bit out of his mind. The thing that made DN3D good was the huge and fun arsenal of weapons(Shrink ray and freeze ray are something that are still not seen in the shooters these days). It was the same reason why gravity gun got hailed as innovative and fun. The new game (demo) just limits the player's ability to do shit.tehbeard said:
Also do note people, the demo was made by 3D realms, not Gearbox. The mighty boot does exist(as seen in the trailer where duke squished small enemies) and there is a chance that they may have changed the weapon bullshit too and considering the demo was supposed to be for a special group of people there is a chance that it was just to show that the game lives.
It was you that went off-topic in the first place and Just Cause 2 still has minor health-regen and relies mostly on med-packs (saying that you can kill so and so in one quarter doesn't change shit). Hell, just replace Just Cause 2 with any game where your character can take massive amounts of punishment.Vibhor said:
You have no argument, my point is still valid as you never even so much as TRIED to refute it. Instead, you decided to dwell on something that's beside the point and irrelevant.
So next time, if you have no goddamn fucking argument, don't go off-topic and then claim that everyone is at fault.
But why CAN'T we go back to old-school shooters? Where one guy can lug around an entire armory and enough ammo for a large SWAT team?
That seems a hell of a lot more fun than what I played.
EDIT: and on the topic of regenerating health. Red Dead Redemption had a form of regenerating health. There you go.
That seems a hell of a lot more fun than what I played.
EDIT: and on the topic of regenerating health. Red Dead Redemption had a form of regenerating health. There you go.
I don't see why everybody says Duke was so tough in 3D. I watched a let's play of the game recently on normal and the player went from full health and armor to dead from 3 mid range shotgun blasts from a pig cop. The weapons also seemed underpowered and you really didn't get enough ammo to go on a rambo style rampage. Also the reason for regenerating health and limitted weapons is to do two things. For weapons it encourages thinking your loadout beyond, "do I have enough ammo." Now you have to consider what weapons will give you the best ability to handle changing situations in the future while also handling the one you have now. For regenerating, it's discourage the habit of spending time searching around the level looking for health kits before you get into the next fight. It also prevents you from ending up fighting the a billion hit point boss that has an unaviodable, but weak attack with one health. It's happened, not fun; not intense, just annoying.
My guess as to why all these games, and I haven't looked into this at all, is that they're all using the same engine or a subset of that engine and they couldn't be bothered to tweak it. When was the last time there was an FPS with no limit to the weapons you could carry (ie, at some point in the game if it allowed for it you could be holding every single weapon) and med kits? Probably so long ago that they don't want to use that game engine or update it.Crash486 said:
You said just cause has no health regen. Your point was wrong. And even your minor health regen is actually a major health regen. If I replace just cause 2 with a game where your character can take massive ammounts of punishment then it always comes to regen health. Look at Saints row 2. It has regen health. GTA 4 does not have regen but the character cannot take more than 1 close shotgun to the fact. Any other game left would be old school run and gun shooters which actually have no need for this mechanics. Thus the OP is not wrong, the only one that is wrong is you.Hyper-space said:
'Fair enough' to everyone who pointed this out to me - it makes me wonder why they'd use so old a build, but finger crossed, then!Shydrow said:
And 80% of the product was handed to them.Vibhor said:
Also, what kind of asshole are you to attack someone on the internet with no good reason?
I recall someone here on The Escapist discussing why these mechanics were so popular a while back, though I can't remember who. The reason that they have caught on is because they allow the developer to know exactly how much health the player will have when entering each room. In a traditional shooter, levels had to be designed with how much health the player might have in mind. If health was too sparse, then rooms further from a health pack couldn't have a lot of enemies, or else they would become far too difficult. But if the player had too much health then the game was too easy.
The advantage (from a developer's viewpoint) of a health regen mechanic is that they know how much health you will have when entering any room (i.e. full health, because you'll wait to regenerate). This means that they can pack each room with a challenge designed to keep the player playing at maximum capacity. It allows for a game that is much more action packed, even if the need for strategy is drastically reduced.
That is actually why it caught on with gamers at first too. While it's worn a little bit at this point (especially with those of us who like the addition of strategy) a sizable portion of the gaming audience is just looking for some brain dead action. They don't want to think about their resources, they just want to put crosshairs over heads (and don't get me wrong here, I enjoy that sometimes too).
Unfortunately, as this demographic that really likes the over the top action that a health regen system allows for has become the majority, those of us who like the added strategic elements of managing health resources have been forgotten.
The advantage (from a developer's viewpoint) of a health regen mechanic is that they know how much health you will have when entering any room (i.e. full health, because you'll wait to regenerate). This means that they can pack each room with a challenge designed to keep the player playing at maximum capacity. It allows for a game that is much more action packed, even if the need for strategy is drastically reduced.
That is actually why it caught on with gamers at first too. While it's worn a little bit at this point (especially with those of us who like the addition of strategy) a sizable portion of the gaming audience is just looking for some brain dead action. They don't want to think about their resources, they just want to put crosshairs over heads (and don't get me wrong here, I enjoy that sometimes too).
Unfortunately, as this demographic that really likes the over the top action that a health regen system allows for has become the majority, those of us who like the added strategic elements of managing health resources have been forgotten.